looking for 'nice' warm'euphoric tube sound

[Raj1]

Hi,


I'm waiting for Aspen amps to release the glass harmony SE amp (won't be for a while yet). The amp will be used in a small room (my bedroom), so typically won't be played too loud. The sound I want for this is really 'syrupy', to coin a phrase.

I havn't purchased a tube amp before, so I'm new to it all.
Is there a generalised sound to SE, PP or OTL amps?

I think the Aspen amp will be good as Hugh Dean knows what he's talking about. I already have a really good ss amp in my main room. But was looking for something really relaxing for my bedroom where the warm euphric sound will be welcome.

Thanks
Raja

[Joel]

Originally posted by Raj1
Is there a generalised sound to SE, PP or OTL amps?

If there is, I would hope to god it isn't "syrupy".

I think most people with experience in audio find that tubes are capable of delivering a clean transparent sound that complex, high feedback SS amps are not.

Yet again, I have to wonder, why you would want your system to "sound" like anything??? Why don't you just buy an EQ if you want a "warm" sound?

[Bas Horneman]

looking for 'nice' warm'euphoric tube sound

Hi Raj,

Been busy with tubes now for 2 years or something..The closest I got to what you describe is a 6AS7 tube. So my guess would be to get something based around a 2A3. Don't expect to much though. Modern caps, and decent iron (transformers) give very clear sound without sounding "grainy" ...that's about as close as youre going to get to syrupy.

I am actually suprised at how little "sound" a tube has...I probably has less of a signature than a transistor or mosfet. Guess that syrupy sound was caused by certain paper in oil coupling caps.

The warm sound is created by the 2nd harmonic distortion a tube has more than a transistor (or emphasizes more)...(Not saying that tubes have more distortion) a 300b has vanishingly low levels of distortion as Lynn Olson puts it. SE amps also have more of it than PP.

So to conclude I guess you would have to look for a 2A3 SET transformer coupled...(between the driver and 2A3) to give a nice harmonic ("warm") sound. (An interstage preserves the harmonic structure of a tube the best)

Cheers,
Bas

[dhaen]

Hi,

Personally, I don't think any valve / tube has a sound signature (unless microphonic / faulty of course).
The differences we percieve are due to tha way the valve interacts with the circuit it is runnning in. Differences in sound between 2 valves of the same type, but different brand can be attributed to characteristic variations. If the valves are within spec, then a circuit that shows a big difference in sound between these could be considered to be a poor design. Why should the variations be circuit dependent if this is not the case?

It is my view that Iron (and it's interaction with the valves' slight characteristic variations) will make the biggest sound signature. - Enter the OTL lobby

Is there a valve sound? Yes and no. The difference in results between the best examples of both traditions is small.

Well that's probably upset a few people

Cheers,

[Bas Horneman]

It is my view that Iron (and it's interaction with the valves' slight characteristic variations) will make the biggest sound signature. - Enter the OTL lobby

Sure has a signature John, but in a good way

It gives 3rd harmonics a kick in the teeth
http://www.aloha-audio.com/library/FindingCG.html

Is there a valve sound? Yes and no. The difference in results between the best examples of both traditions is small

Yup, I got a lesson in that when my tube stage in CD player sounded pretty much the same as a lowly op-amp...or did you mean between OTL and valve.

Cheers,
Bas

[Raj1]

Hi,

Ok I didn't mean to stereotype all tube designs with my previous question.
So I'l try to find the words and provide some more info.
I recently purchased a copy of miles davis kind of blue, which was re-mastered on tube gear. Ok now what do I mean by syrupy?, well the high's have a certain ring on this cd, smooth but still detailed and extended.
The brass has a nice overtone which is really pleasing to my ears.
I already have a good SS amp to deliver 'realism' I want. This is for my bedroom and I thought it would be nice to have an amp that could kinda do this sound permanentley. I'm open minded here, and I don't want to get into or cause a tube vs SS argument. Like Bas said it's the second harmonic that creates the stereotyped tubey sound. One would assume that SE amps, are probably closer to what I'm looking for. I don't mind distortion if it's of the type which produces the 'overtones', which are so pleasing to the ear. I'm sure there are tube amps out there with low distortion, but I'm looking for 'musicality', not in the sense of outright realism (MY SS amp already does that), I guess it's hard to explain, I guess Bas interpreted what I was trying to ask the best. My sincere apologies if I came accross as implying that all tube amps are not accurate in terms of accurate reproduction of a sound. I'm not after strictly accurate reproduction this time, and I don't think I need an equaliser, i've not heard one yet that can, I'm sure there are some tube designs that fit the bill, just looking for some more info to clarify matters. What makes questions like mine difficult is all the set minded people who can't see past a certain type of musical reproduction. I just find the sound of the re mastered cd very pleasing, and would like a tube amp capable of doing this with virtually everything I play on it, if of course such a beast exists.

Thank you guys
sorry once again for posing a somewhat silly question

Thanks
Raja

[Bas Horneman]

Raja,

Best thing would be to audition a couple of tube amps with the speakers you intend.

Cheers,
Bas

PS...aint such a thing as a stupid question...there is such a thing as a stupid answer though..

[dhaen]

Bas,

http://www.aloha-audio.com/library/FindingCG.html

You're brilliant!
I've been looking for that article for ages. In fact last year there was a post on the forum asking for it's URL. I knew from the description exactly which article he meant, but I'd lost it too!

Oh, BTW, I meant Valve vs. SS...

The jury's out on OTL. No doubt I'll get my hand smacked by Frank

Cheers,

[fdegrove]

Hi,

there is such a thing as a stupid answer though..

No shortage of those.

Cheers,

P.S. I'll chip in later...watching a fascinatong movie right now, sorry.

[Bas Horneman]

Hi John,

You're brilliant!

No I'm not

Lynn Olson is!

Glad I could help again...

Cheers,
Bas