• Disclaimer: This Vendor's Forum is a paid-for commercial area. Unlike the rest of diyAudio, the Vendor has complete control of what may or may not be posted in this forum. If you wish to discuss technical matters outside the bounds of what is permitted by the Vendor, please use the non-commercial areas of diyAudio to do so.

Nubie first build Tubelab simple SE

Status
This old topic is closed. If you want to reopen this topic, contact a moderator using the "Report Post" button.
OK I starter in joining this forum wanting to build a tube buffer.
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=141993&perpage=25&pagenumber=1


From this things morphed into the thinking that a tube amp would be a better idea. John ( Victoria Guy) was kind enough to put me onto tubelab simple SE.
http://www.tubeaudio.8m.com/RH84/rh84.html
So my questions are, if you could be so kind to help me:
This is a power amp, my reading other threads suggests this build would cost in the ball park of $500, maybe less if you are a good hunter of parts.
When finished is this amp better than say the Bottlehead kit coming in at the same price, parts hunting not needed? Enclosure included
http://www.bottlehead.com/et/adobes...3/foreplay3.htm
Also Transcendent preamp is a kit in the same price range parts included, and enclosure. It is a pre amp. Would a tube pre amp run with a parasound power amp give me a tube sound vs a Se simple power amp.
http://www.transcendentsound.com/preampkit.htm
If I built this simple SE can I use my Nad pre amp with it or is it not needed if the SE amp has a volume control?
Cheers Ron.
 
OK so that rules out the foreplay, I was thinking it was a power amp.
Do you think it is possible for a Nubie to build this amp? The directions are very good from what I can see. It is more of ordering the parts(not knowing a lot about them) and those little tweaks needed to get all the parts to play together.
I am reading a thread like this one
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=141703

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=136843

And they are way over my head to be honest with you.
Cheers Ron. ( thanks for your help so far)
 
By newbie do you mean never having worked with electronics? This amp is pretty easy to build. The PCB has huge solder pads, so it is actually a good board to learn on. There are a few spots where excess solder can cause problems (tube sockets), but if you are careful you should be fine.

George's instructions are quite detailed for the Simple SE and they cover all of the common build variations well I think. There are choices to be made up front (chassis mounting, power tube type, etc), so it is helpful to read all the way through them once before clicking "order" on Mouser/Digikey/AES/wherever. The parts list for the PCB itself is quite complete with part numbers and everything. The wild cards are the transformers and the tubes, but there are some good choices for these. Then the chassis, switches, pots, etc are up to you.
 
Mungo Park said:

Do you think it is possible for a Nubie to build this amp? The directions are very good from what I can see. It is more of ordering the parts(not knowing a lot about them) and those little tweaks needed to get all the parts to play together.
I am reading a thread like this one
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=141703

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=136843

And they are way over my head to be honest with you.
Cheers Ron. ( thanks for your help so far)

Have you built anything else electronic before? Do you have soldering/de-soldering experience? Can you knock together a decent chassis? Are you comfortable working around high voltage (400-500V)?

This board is a straightforward build with lots of step-by-step instructions by Tubelab George on his website and George also has a fairly comprehensive parts list along with transformer/tube/etc recommendations but you will still have to source the parts, build a chassis, solder everything up, and possibly have to do some troubleshooting.

A couple of nice newbie features of this board is that there are no adjustments that need to be made while the board is powered up, and tubes are inexpensive and readily available. It can also be easily tweaked to run a handful of common output tubes so you can learn a bit and figure out if a 6L6GC, EL34, KT88, etc suits your tastes.

There are lots of posts here about this project so lots of info is available, and George regularly answers the posts.

There is lots of info on the tubelab site also; navigate to the simple SE assembly instructions page, then click and read the topics on the left pane. He covers everything from transformer recommendations to assembly techniques, etc. I think if you spend some time reading that material you will determine if the project scope is something that you can tackle.

You can also ask questions over here for further clarification before you pull the trigger.
 
The only thing I upgraded was C11 and C21 coupling caps. I mail ordered everything and I've spent $700CDN. 3/8ths of that was shipping cost/customs. I still need to buy the wood and mounting nuts/bolts.

You can build this. Read everything until you understand it. Tuns of help on this forum.
 
OK I have soldered some, I don't think it is the problem, I have zero electronics knowledge, waiting for some books though. I did build a small robot kit with my son, all the parts were their and it was not hard getting them soldered in the board, and it worked so I must have got them in the right spots.
I will be OK building a chassis and enclosure.
So the part is having to source the parts could be tough, not knowing anything I would not know if I got the right one or not.
Any options is also potential trouble as I can not understand them. So I guess if I stick to the directions and do not change anything I should be fine, I guess.
I have been reading Georges instructions and they are very good, to his credit.
So I think I am slowly inching towards thinking I can do this.:smash:
Cheers Ron. Thank you all for your help/input.
 
I was one of the early builders of the Simple SE. I loved building it so much I have built another half dozen valve (tube) amps. I still have the Simple SE in my system.

If you want an easy to build project, want to experience "tube sound", want excellent value for money and want something that offers flexibility enough to be a cheap beginner project up to a high-end permanent addition to your system, this is it.

The hardest thing, in my opinion, will be building the chassis. Everything else is a snap. There is plenty of experience building this and you will find many people willing and able to offer advice on this forum. Tubelab also answers questions and offers amazing support for his product.

To answer your question about how it will fit in your system - if you have a pre-amp already it is probably easiest to just keep it and use the Simple SE as a straight power amp. This way volume control and switching is done by the pre amp. Makes the build simpler for your amp too. Is your pre-amp a surround sound pre-amp? Do you have a sub-woofer? This will determine the frequency range required of the amp. If you have a sub then the lowest frequencies are not required to be delivered, meaning that you can save money on the output transformers.

I think that Edcor offer great value on their output and power transformers. There has been reports that the Hammond 200 series power transformers are not as good as they used to be. I would recommend the Edcor XPWR059 power transformer http://home.att.net/~Brik/Edcor/Class_X_Xfmrs_Information.pdf . For output transformers, if on a budget I would suggest Edcore GXSE http://www.edcorusa.com/Products/ShowProduct.aspx?ID=448 If you have a subwoofer, these are cheap and probably all you will need regardless of budget. Don't be concerned that it says for guitar amp use... If no sub and/or you have a bigger budget, you might consider http://www.edcorusa.com/Products/ShowProduct.aspx?ID=465

There plenty of other transformer options too...

As for other options, I use a 5 Henry 200 mA choke and have no hum (others have used 10 Henry chokes, much more expensive and I don't think required). I used Hammond, but I think Triad do some cheap ones. For the optional power supply capacitor, I go a 80uF motor run from ebay very cheap. Chassis I used a Hammond 12*10. Others have used an aluminium top plate and wood sides that look very good. For tubes, I like EL34. They are half the price of KT88s, but some others do prefer the KT88s...

Some quick tips - don't build with a standby switch and don't use solid state rectification (simply leave the FREDS - fast recovery diodes off the board).

I personally think that building this will be much more rewarding and worthwhile that tube buffer or preamp.

Chris
 
Purchase the passive parts from digikey per Tubelabs parts list, he has digikey P/N's for just about everything. Pick up the tube sockets, tubes, and the optional choke from one online vendor and you are just about done.

There are lots of posts and opinions here regarding output tranformers. Seems like the Edcors offer a good bang for the buck, or the Trancendars from ebay.

For an inexpensive power transformer consider the Allied P/N that tubelab recommends.

I would also use a choke in place of R1. Anything around 5H-10H or so and 100-200 ma or so. Most tube vendors sell these chokes.

The places to spend $$ depending on your budget are the output transformers, the coupling caps, and the choke upgrade. Coupling caps and choke are easy to upgrade later, the output transformers a little less easy once you cut holes in the chassis.
 
For my $700CDN investment:

Tubes- (2) JJ E34L, 12AT7, 5AR4

Coupling caps- (2) Auricap .22uF 600V

Transformers: Allied 6K7VG with a C-14X choke. (2) Edcore GXSE-15-8-5K? I may have the Edcore part# wrong. Their website is still down or moved. They are the $31US transformers.

Any Hammond/Allied parts are Canadian made. So if you can source them in Canada, you'll likely save some cash. I wish I knew this prior to ordering from the US.

George is in the process of finding a new manufacturer of FRED's . Thats D1 and D2 on the parts list. These FREDs are SS rectifiers. You can build this amp switchable between these FREDs and the 5AR4 rectifier. I guess the FREDs are good for loud volume in Ultralinear mode. Otherwise they don't sound as good as the 5AR4 tube. I'd wait till George lists a part # for it from Digi-Key or Mouser. But keep reading, you may find you don't want FREDs anyway.

Also suggested you place a inrush current limiter (Digi-Key # KC009-ND) on both red wire conections between the transformer and the PCB (correct me if I'm wrong) and a third one for..... I have'nt figured this out yet. But these are on back order at Digi-Key till near the end of May. Oh, George's parts list has a # HS189-ND ( from Digi-Key) for a heatsink to go with the CSS's. I had to get # HS194-ND instead.

Mouser wants $20US per shipment USPS(capacitors and resistors) whereas Digi-Key wants $8US UPS to my address in Canada. So if you have the patience to get everything in one order, you can save a bunch.
There are 3 or 4 really good threads on the SimpleSE build on this site to read that will get your head spinning, but ingest it all. Once you think you've come to a decision, keep reading or asking questions before you pull the trigger.
 
Mouser can be a few bucks cheaper than digi-key, although Tubelab's parts list is fairly complete for Digi-key, and rather thin for Mouser P/N's.

Digikey does not stock the Fairchild 1200V/8A FREDs, but Mouser has them. You may want to just leave them off of the board if you want tube rectification, or add them later once you are up and running.
 
Also suggested you place a inrush current limiter (Digi-Key # KC009-ND) on both red wire conections between the transformer and the PCB (correct me if I'm wrong) and a third one for..... I have'nt figured this out yet. But these are on back order at Digi-Key till near the end of May. Oh, George's parts list has a # HS189-ND ( from Digi-Key) for a heatsink to go with the CSS's. I had to get # HS194-ND instead.
I thought I read some where to place the ICL after the on/off switch leading to the transformer and also on George's site he also says that adding one to the center tap wire can be beneficial
 
HEADinaJAR said:

Any Hammond/Allied parts are Canadian made. So if you can source them in Canada, you'll likely save some cash. I wish I knew this prior to ordering from the US.

As the song goes: "It ain't necessarily so'...best to double-check before you order, I think.
My local electronics place offered to 'special order' Hammond transformers for about double the price stateside. This was 2-3 yrs ago; perhaps things are different these days.
Cheers
John
 
Chris:
I have a Nad pre amp and peerless speakers, two 8" and one tweeter
so I do not have a sub woofer.

I think I now understand the tip of the iceberg relating to the transformers and will check around for prices, I will start local and expand my search, to the on line suggestions here. Some search time will give me a chance to raise some funds for this endeavor.

HEADinaJAR:
Thank you for a Canuck prospective on the parts/price aspect of things. As well as VictoriaGuy.
And not to leave out the rest who have taken the time to add their hard won insight. I have to say this form, as in the members, beacuse that is what makes a forum, are extremely helpful and sharing with their knowledge . I thank you all and will press on with reading Georges sight and the other threads in the forum.
I think HeadinaJar about summed it up "Once you think you've come to a decision, keep reading or asking questions before you pull the trigger." Cheers Ron.
:D :D
 
Status
This old topic is closed. If you want to reopen this topic, contact a moderator using the "Report Post" button.