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Old 14th October 2008, 06:22 PM   #31
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Richard, good idea. My main goal is to just learn about tubes, and hopefully build a very nice sounding system. The type of music I like probably lends itself best to solid state.

I picked up a book at Halted Specialities yesterday titled "Understanding Hi-Fi Circuits" by Crowhurst and published in 1957 - republished by Audio Amateur Press in 2002. Seems like a good book covering all aspects of tube audio.

The RH84 looks very simple to build: http://www.tubeaudio.8m.com/RH84/rh84.html/
As does El Cheapo: http://homepage.mac.com/planet10/for...3jun06-map.gif

I also like the El Cheapo Eli has designed. Both seem pretty cool and straight forward to make. I like the fact that Eli's El Cheapo has a CCS option already designed. I've had such good success in SS with CCS designs.

The EL84 seems to be a popular audio power tube. How does the El Cheapo using 12AQ5's compare? Curious what others have experienced. I'll probably get around to building both, just looking for advice as a jumping off point.

The thoughtful suggestions and help provided here is very much appreciated! Thank you for helping a SS hobbyist navigate a first time tube project.

BTW, I'll also be at Burning Amp next Sunday.

-David
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Old 14th October 2008, 07:07 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally posted by dw8083
The type of music I like probably lends itself best to solid state.
That's an odd statement to make. Why are you bothering to build tube gear if you're already convinced that SS will do music better?

Jeff
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Old 14th October 2008, 07:19 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally posted by vinylkid58


That's an odd statement to make. Why are you bothering to build tube gear if you're already convinced that SS will do music better?

Jeff
I'm looking to learn more about tubes and to have fun DIY experimenting with low power tube amps and full range drivers. Just looking for a new DIY audio adventure and have fun along the way with my hobby. I'm betting that a lot of my preconceived notions about tubes will change. In the end, I might be out a few bucks and had a good time learning something new.

-David
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Old 14th October 2008, 09:55 PM   #34
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Default Re: Decware SE84C

Quote:
Originally posted by dw8083
The Decware Zen SE84c also looks interesting. It seems similar to RH84.
Our RH84s started out as Decware Zen clones. RH84 wa sbetter and 3x the power is a real draw at these power levels.

El Cheapo (at least our execution) is a different beast.

The RH84 has more midrange magic, the Class A El Cheapo variant some of the best bass i've heard from any amp.

dave
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Old 14th October 2008, 10:02 PM   #35
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Default Re: Re: Decware SE84C

Quote:
Originally posted by planet10


some of the best bass i've heard from any amp.


With a 4" fullrange I guess
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Old 14th October 2008, 10:24 PM   #36
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Default Re: Re: Re: Decware SE84C

Quote:
Originally posted by tinitus
With a 4" fullrange I guess
On many a FR speaker -- up to 8" and a few 2-ways. Chris was even using it as the bass-amp on a set of Tysen (a bit underpowered for the task, but good till there)

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Old 14th October 2008, 10:45 PM   #37
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Default Re: Re: Decware SE84C

Quote:
Originally posted by planet10


Our RH84s started out as Decware Zen clones. RH84 wa sbetter and 3x the power is a real draw at these power levels.

El Cheapo (at least our execution) is a different beast.

The RH84 has more midrange magic, the Class A El Cheapo variant some of the best bass i've heard from any amp.

dave
I was looking over the Decware SE84C schematic (attached), which seems somewhat similar to the RH84.

Dave, I think both you and Eli helped convince me to build the El Cheapo. Hopefully I can catch up with some of you at Burning Amp in San Francisco this weekend.

-David


Decware SE84C:
Click the image to open in full size.

RH84SE:
Click the image to open in full size.
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Old 14th October 2008, 11:00 PM   #38
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Default Re: Re: Re: Decware SE84C

Quote:
Originally posted by dw8083


Dave, I think both you and Eli helped convince me to build the El Cheapo.

From what Dave says it sounds like a little rocking "power-house", so your choise makes sense, since you mostly listen to rock...it may in some sense compensate a bit fore being a "flea-amp"...so far your choise makes sense

Good luck
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Old 14th October 2008, 11:44 PM   #39
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Default Re: Re: Re: Re: Decware SE84C

Quote:
Originally posted by tinitus



From what Dave says it sounds like a little rocking "power-house", so your choise makes sense, since you mostly listen to rock...it may in some sense compensate a bit fore being a "flea-amp"...so far your choise makes sense

Good luck

Thanks Tinitus.

I'm planning on taking some time to sort through the BIG El Cheapo thread Eli referenced earlier.

Here's the El Cheapo schematic I'll start from that Dave was kind enough to share:

Click the image to open in full size.

Any thoughts on this version of El Cheapo is greatly appreciated! From what I'm reading the output transformers are critical for tube amps. I assume that Hammonds are the standard, but I understand there are better makes to consider.

I have a pair of 8 Ohm MOTH's Full Range drivers at the moment, but will soon purchase a pair of 16 ohm Lowthers. Should the amp have different taps for 8 and 16 ohms?

Thank you,

-David
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Old 14th October 2008, 11:56 PM   #40
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Quote:
The EL84 seems to be a popular audio power tube. How does the El Cheapo using 12AQ5's compare? Curious what others have experienced. I'll probably get around to building both, just looking for advice as a jumping off point.
The 12AQ5 is a member of the 6V6 family, which was very inexpensive when EC was designed. It seems EC builders have put a good sized "dent" into the 12AQ5 supply.

Both the EL84 and 6V6 are "12" W. tubes. The EL84 is a true pentode, while the 6V6 is a beam power tetrode. Both sound good, but their voices are different. AAMOF, there's serious sonic "mojo" in "12" W. multi-grid power O/P types, in general.

Members of the 6V6 family make EXTRAORDINARILY linear triodes. The NFB loop in EC is present primarily to linearize the O/P trafo and improve damping factor. By themselves, the signal tubes have a satisfactory distortion profile.
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