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monoblock vs. one chassis?

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agree, short speaker cable & long signal wire.
the sound will less hifi & more natural.
the reason is the long signal wire had a large capacitor with lost high freq, so the sound will less hifi. But BTW more natural is this method.
I use 30 ft signal cable & 10 feet speaker cable.

thanks

Thomas
 

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But............

I know the chassis issue is there. But here the issue being considered is which cable should be longer. We aren't even considering the chassis which incidentally gets bigger and is not the problem.
I am sure we would make any chassis that fits the bill if we decide that one cable should be longer than the other.
Finally its left to the builder ... no matter what is really better.
If my wife will kill me if I have two chassis , I will build only one even if the speaker wire should be as short as possible. If not I will be 'shot'. Boy , is man weaker than a woman!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
More :drink: :drink: :drink:
 
I know there are more points to discuss about monoblocks than just the stereo separation but when it comes to that a lot of serious amp designers would comment to watch the PSRR and the proper grounding of your amp first than just "jumping" over these problems with monoblock construction.
I think it´s not right to believe monoblocks are better in general.
If you can´t properly build a stereo amp into one chassis you shouldn´t go monoblock unless you use a topology with poor PSRR like some simple Class A designs so you kinda depend on power supply separation.

Jens
 
The new tip...add capacitance to the interconect...

agree, short speaker cable & long signal wire.
the sound will less hifi & more natural.
the reason is the long signal wire had a large capacitor with lost high freq, so the sound will less hifi.

So, the less high frequency, the better the sound??':bigeyes:
Oh my God!!
Why not to add a capacitor across the live and ground of the interconect to kill the highs and increase the distortion of whatever is driving it!!!
Maybe a new tip!!!;)

I think that i need some holidays:dead:
 
Less hf..........good

Hi Jorge,
I think this is a language problem. I think what was meant is that the HF will roll off.......outside the audio range and ensure that no ultrasonic noise etc will get into the system.
With a 600 ohm load ( properly driven )and with the cable capacitance of say 220pf per meter and 20 meters of cable the
-3db point is about 60KHz. Not too bad!
:)
 
I guess the real proof is in the pudding. Audition a set of mono block amps against a single chassis amp of about the same output rating and make the call. I listened to a highly moded AES amplifier against a set of bone stock Quicksilver amps. The "Quickeys" blew away the AES's.

Sure you have two sets of everything to purchase when you put together a set of mono block amps. Like "Frank" always says "There are no free lunches"

Bottom line is you get what you pay for in this hobby/obsession. You don't get good low end with a 25 dollar output transformer or high fidelity with a 2dollar tube.

Just my .02

Joe
 
burnedfingers said:
I guess the real proof is in the pudding. Audition a set of mono block amps against a single chassis amp of about the same output rating and make the call. I listened to a highly moded AES amplifier against a set of bone stock Quicksilver amps. The "Quickeys" blew away the AES's.

Hardly a relevant comparison. They're two different amps.
 
Cost comparisons......

You don't get good low end with a 25 dollar output transformer or high fidelity with a 2dollar tube.

This is not strictly true. I bought Soviet 6SN7's (NOS) for about US$0.70 each ! That did not make them any worse than the same type tubes for US$5 or 8 in the US. It's just that the market where I bought it was getting rid of them.
Also used and old but perfectly good transformers could cost US$25/- or less at a sale. But bought from a dealer non of these would ever come so cheap.
You must be refering to prices at regular dealers. That's why I guess we find so many DIY'ers at garage sales .My friend bought a Thorens TD124AB with a 9 inch SME arm for US$25 /- !!!! All in perfectly good condition.
So don't ignore garage sales !
Cheers.
 
Brett


Please tell me what to use for a good comparison to my Quicksilvers. I thought the AES's were a fair amp to compare as the power output was the same, the output tubes were the same, and the circuitry was roughly the same.

Fantastic

I'm sorry you misunderstood my point. I was attempting to say the you get roughly what you pay for. This doesn't mean that tubes you purchased for .70 that would normally cost a hell of a lot more is a bad deal. I meant that usually the cheap quality cheap priced tubes are usually crap. Would you expect the same sonic quality out of a cheap 300B tube as compared with a Western Electric? I don't think so.

Joel

Quote

This type of statement is joy to a retailer's ears, but is sadly uninformed and incorrect on both counts.

Well Joel, aren't you the same guy that was perched on the soap box shouting the merits of the $7.00 choke and the cheap Hammond transformer? Unless I'm mistaken I think there are other opinions more informed than either of us that debate the differences between cheap iron and the more costly iron. Maybe were all uninformed and incorrect on all counts.:nod:

Joe
 
burnedfingers said:
Please tell me what to use for a good comparison to my Quicksilvers. I thought the AES's were a fair amp to compare as the power output was the same, the output tubes were the same, and the circuitry was roughly the same.

Joe the two amps you mention have different topologies, OPT's, power supplies (parts and design), grounding layout, chassis construction etc. All of these would make noticeable sonic differences, probably much more than the mono/stereo chassis layout. IME, the dual mono configuration brings advantages primarily in power supply (usually larger/lower Z for duals) and placement because you <i>can</i> locate then next to the speakers and run shorter cables. All things being equal, dual mono is not significantly better, but does infer some minor advantages. I usually dual mono poweramps, because I like to place them near the speaks, and in the big poweramps, a single chassis becomes too heavy and mechanically awkward.

Cheers!
 
This thread is turning into a flame-fest :(

Why do you guys always argue so much! :) Agree to disagree dammit!!! :)

I would just like to say that my experiment with having all the power transformers on one chassis, and the recifier, tubes, choke and OPTs on another was very successful. No hum whatsoever, (using DC on DHT filaments is great) and sounds wonderful. Easy to lift too.

The best thing about this arrangement is that the PSU chassis can be hidden out of view, with only an umbilical going to the main part of the amp.

my 0.02
 
ShiFtY said:
This thread is turning into a flame-fest :(

Please get a grip. This is hardly a flamefest. LOL

Why do you guys always argue so much! :) Agree to disagree dammit!!! :)

You're a Kiwi, and I bet in you're local pub, everyone agrees about everything that has a subjective quality about it too, right? Like who's the best footballer, the prettiest sheep...

{snip}
As for the rest of the post, basically I agree, if all the earthing and decoupling is done right.
Oh, heck, I'm not allowed to do that am I?
 
Re: DUAL MONO.

fdegrove said:
Grrrrrr, I hate that.
Correct us Joel, please, please.

I'd be happy to. Apparently you are agreeing with Joe, who claims that a $2 tube cannot be "high fidelity". Are you serious?
An RCA 6J5 is not hi-fi? A sylvania 6C4 is not hi-fi? A ken-rad 6V6 is not hi-fi? A raytheon 5755 is not hi-fi? An RCA 6080 is not hi-fi?

All of these cost $2 or less. Get a clue. :headbash:

Do you have any more dumb arguments you'd like to proceed with Frank? Joe?

ps. James also has used, and enjoyed the $10 plate choke I was "on my soapbox" about. No smart comments for him? And I suppose you've tried the parts in question, and found them disagreeable? :dodgy:
 
diyAudio Senior Member
Joined 2002
DUAL MONO.

Hi,

I'd be happy to. Apparently you are agreeing with Joe, who claims that a $2 tube cannot be "high fidelity". Are you serious?

No, and don't tell me how and where to buy tubes, thank you very much.

How a tube is high-fidelity is beyond me but have it your way.

Any more displays of your supreme intelligence on advancing, or shall I say sticking with 1930 hi-fi?

FWIW, it is not the price of the tube that makes the difference.

The point is that you pretty much get out of what you put in and that doesn't necessarily mean money.

Cheers,;)
 
Hi-fi tubes

For those who love older music, it is a good bet that it was mastered on an Ampex 300 or 350 recorder. The 300 used a 6J5 in some of the low level stages.

I have serviced much vintage equipment. 6SN7s, 12AX7, and 5U4s are not uncommon.

The 300B was used in theaters. 803, 805, 811 and 813 were popular.
 
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