Psychic pair fail scientific test

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purely anecdotal and not something I remember myself but have been told by my mum.

When I was 5 we had to go to Sydney during the school week. My Mother had written a letter to the teacher explaining that I would not be in class for the rest of the week. She was thinking to herself (she had not talked to my father about it) that she must ask me to take the letter in and put it on the teachers desk as soon as I got to school in case I forgot.

I came out of my bedroom crying, saying But Mummy we aren't allowed to go into the classroom until after the bell rings.

One I DO remember. We were sitting down playing trivial pursuit My sister asked me the question "what was the name of the actor who played Hutch in Starsky and Hutch. I had no idea. She turned over the card and the instant she read it (to herself) I blurted out "David Soul". After that there was a rule that no one was allowed to read the answer until I had said I give up (I'm pretty sure it wasn't the first time).

I've had quite a few very strong de ja vu experiences over the years as well. I'm generally a sceptic, and I think that most psychics are probably fakes, but I'm not willing to completely tar them all with the same brush :)

But yes DF96 I can totally see where you are coming from with respect to the audio comment ;)

Tony.
 
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I've had quite a few very strong de ja vu experiences over the years as well. I'm generally a sceptic, and I think that most psychics are probably fakes, but I'm not willing to completely tar them all with the same brush :) .
I think that's being a bit unfair to most people who "can pick things up", the trouble is that once you have to perform on demand, as a "do it now!" service, for monetary return, etc, then it brings an element of tension into the situation which runs counter to the state of mind that is necessary. A bit like, "You are going to hear someone tell a joke in 30 secs, and you are required to find it funny, and must laugh naturally upon hearing it!".

Which is why virtually every attempt to "scientifically" test this phenomenon is doomed to fail; you might as well say love on sight can't exist: "Scientists organised tens of thousands of single people to meet for a precisely specified period of time, in a random manner; and not a single marriage was the result - no evidence for love on sight was found ... "

Frank
 
The psychic stated that she needed face-to-face visual and hearing of the voices. She didn't make anywhere near the excuses... err, claims that are now being presented.
Also, if it can't be attempted "scientifically, how can it be said what state of mind is necessary? Either we're dealing with "the unknown" or we aren't.
IMO, the analogies leave something to be desired, too. Unless it is agreed that the "bit like" is an acting bit, which is done all the time. As is cold reading.
 
Yes, a type of human contact is required, which for want of a better word needs to be "natural". If a scientific "approach" requires this to be eliminated then the chances are that failure will be the result. Or, yes, acting if the practitioner was not in the mood for whatever reason, but still felt that some sort of response was necessary in the situation, for all sorts of reasons.

Just imagine if doctors were "tested" in a similar manner: they were presented with a patient with certain symptoms, but were not able to correctly diagnose the problem or prescribe the only medications that were relevant to making him healthy -- I think you would be justified in suspecting them of being quacks ... ;)

Frank
 
There are many ways to deal with that, depending on the nature of the difference in results. Would you like some examples from my own experiences in 35 years as a working scientist?
Yes, there are always ways of furthering the situation if everyone takes the situation seriously. Which includes as one result, that the scientist with the different results effectively upends the thinking of all the other scientists.

But, if all are convinced that it's all nonsense, and can never be anything but, then none of those avenues are pursued; everyone laughs uproariously about the farce and heads off to the bar for a beer ...

Frank
 
The face to face contact is essential because the "psychic" relies on subtle (and not so subtle) facial and body language "tells" by the subject to guide the reading narrative. Psychics do have powers...powers of observation and human intuition that they share with other professional con artists.
 
Actually, I think that some psychics might pass the test as it is possible that there are effects going on which current science either can't or won't consider. I don't think these effects are relevant to audio, though. Most psychics work in the way the sceptics assume.

I was just amused by the classic excuses which get trotted out when an ability which helps someone earn a living disappears when tested. It only seems to be certain abilities which disappear: people can do maths/surgery/driving/flying under pressure yet hearing (audible and psychic) seems to require vision too.
 
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If you don't have a copy of James Randi's "Flim Flam," run right out etc. Cold reading (and sometimes not-so-cold reading) is an ancient art, yet can be extremely impressive to people not versed in mentalism.

“Cold reading” is all around us, every minute, everywhere. We are “readers” and “sitters” intentionally or unintentionally. Once we understand this, we may turn into skeptics or cynics.

I try to cool down, keep a distance from the rational part of me and enjoy the ride.

George
 
Psychics do have powers...powers of observation and human intuition that they share with other professional con artists.
It's always a shame that people feel the need to become derogatory towards others who have a set of beliefs or an approach that makes them feel uncomfortable.

Most are not conning in the accepted sense, it is more the usual human story of ritual and habit overwhelming the elements which had the inital special qualities. A person has a "gift" in any area, it may be as simple as a distinctive singing voice. Only a relative few truly appreciate these special qualities when they are in full flower, this is when the true value of whatever is happening is at its height. Then they are "discovered", and the unravelling begins: the need is now for a show to always deliver, a push button capability for results becomes essential, and the integrity begins to seriously erode. In the final, sad episodes the abilities are largely absent but people flock to witness the "guru", paying huge sums to experience the person, just so they can tell their friends that they've done it ...

And so it goes, and has for thousands of years ... it is just the human way ...

Frank
 
No, he's derogatory toward psychics (who are total scumbag con-artists) not their victims (who are only guilty of gullibility and often desperation).
Unfortunately that is an example of how this type of conversation degenerates: it starts with the non-believers or sceptical nudging each other and rolling their eyes, then the jokes start coming, which evolve more and more into a fat man slipping on a banana skin variety, and finally raw anger enters the mix -- "how can such types of people be allowed to be in public ...!"

And people wonder how wars start ...

Frank
 
Explain this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sHN2kngOtk4

Must be ESP. No other possible explanation. Right?

Con artists are con artists. I truly and honestly don't understand the mindset which feels it necessary to defend them, especially when the defender is clearly not a stupid person. Indeed, Dave is right- I see the same behavior from people in audio steadfastly defending the scammers.
 
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