With all this history being flung around, there is one question I would like to ask JC.
I have seen it often mentioned that it was Mark Levinson anf your good self who single handedly invented the High End. I guess that would be something around 1974, 1975 or so. At the time, I was busy subscribing to America's Audio, British Hi Fi News & Record Review and Italy's Suono, so I was out of the loop and consequently have no personal view on the matter.
My question is this - without any false modesty, how true is the view that ML and yourself practically invented what we take to be High End as we know it today? Wasn't SAE active already at the time, and could they also be taken as members of what was to become the High End?
I have seen it often mentioned that it was Mark Levinson anf your good self who single handedly invented the High End. I guess that would be something around 1974, 1975 or so. At the time, I was busy subscribing to America's Audio, British Hi Fi News & Record Review and Italy's Suono, so I was out of the loop and consequently have no personal view on the matter.
My question is this - without any false modesty, how true is the view that ML and yourself practically invented what we take to be High End as we know it today? Wasn't SAE active already at the time, and could they also be taken as members of what was to become the High End?
John, are you referring to the 'Bear' who is a member here? Did he have an accident?
jan
No, a different Bear. This one: Owsley Stanley - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Hard to say JC , I missed the period by almost a decade , my teenage years where in the 70's , I do like what came out of the 60,s (music) I' m a big fan of that era of jazz ( van gilder) hence the question ..
Except for a predominant fixation on the second chakra, I think it improved everythingAlthough pinworms and head lice were less than cool (borrowed from Tom Wolfe).
Brad
Err ....ok ...
With all this history being flung around, there is one question I would like to ask JC.
I have seen it often mentioned that it was Mark Levinson anf your good self who single handedly invented the Hig
My question is this - without any false modesty, how true is the view that ML and yourself practically invented what we take to be High End as we know it today? Wasn't SAE active already at the time, and could they also be taken as members of what was to become the High End?
There was already the high-end IMO , it was fine tuned when levinson and JC got together , well at least for me, there is an video with Levinson on u-tube describing that era .
Search Mark Levinson .........
Maybe what he really patented was the use of C1 to bootstrap the cs?
(No I didn't read the patent).
jan
The patent specifically cited White and distinguished their invention. Reading the file wrapper will give you insight as to how.
I would like to point out what the difference between 'high fidelity' and 'high end' is. They both have the same goal, although sometimes one might be in one camp or the other, and be either sonically wonderful or sort of lousy.
High End is mostly BUILD QUALITY and CIRCUIT SOPHISTICATION, based on a 'no holds barred' making of a specific brand of products. If this makes for a superior product sonically, then it is worth it. If not, then it is a failure, and perhaps a waste of money.
It is difficult to tell the difference without trying an individual component in ones hi fi system.
Early examples of 'High End' even before Mark and I came on the scene, were the Marantz 10 tuner, Marantz 9 amp (especially in triode operation) and the McIntosh 3500 power amplifier. These were 'all out' designs that were well built, as well.
Examples of 'hi fi' at the time were the next generation of Marantz solid state components, SAE, Ampzilla, etc. These components did NOT meet the standards of a REALLY high quality amplifier or preamplifier when compared to the best tube designs, from the past, or from Audio Research at the time. Audio Research initially was 'hi fi' due to its construction and parts selection, but it has now moved to 'High End'.
So it is not just sound quality that separates 'High End' from 'High Fidelity', but build quality. You can have sonically superior in either mode, but usually 'High End' has the advantage of the best parts and construction, so all else being equal, it will prevail.
High End is mostly BUILD QUALITY and CIRCUIT SOPHISTICATION, based on a 'no holds barred' making of a specific brand of products. If this makes for a superior product sonically, then it is worth it. If not, then it is a failure, and perhaps a waste of money.
It is difficult to tell the difference without trying an individual component in ones hi fi system.
Early examples of 'High End' even before Mark and I came on the scene, were the Marantz 10 tuner, Marantz 9 amp (especially in triode operation) and the McIntosh 3500 power amplifier. These were 'all out' designs that were well built, as well.
Examples of 'hi fi' at the time were the next generation of Marantz solid state components, SAE, Ampzilla, etc. These components did NOT meet the standards of a REALLY high quality amplifier or preamplifier when compared to the best tube designs, from the past, or from Audio Research at the time. Audio Research initially was 'hi fi' due to its construction and parts selection, but it has now moved to 'High End'.
So it is not just sound quality that separates 'High End' from 'High Fidelity', but build quality. You can have sonically superior in either mode, but usually 'High End' has the advantage of the best parts and construction, so all else being equal, it will prevail.
You viewed the wrapper? Is that accessible on the USPTO site? Interesting!
Anyway, I haven't read that. But from reading both White and Ito, I find the latter, although a better and more detailed discussion and more appropriate to JFETs, unconvincing in terms of meeting the non-obvious criterion.*
But I've certainly seen worse!
Brad
PS: No Jan, capacitors for coupling from the upper load to the lower stage are common to both. Ito has resistors in both sources whereas White has a resistor in the cathode of the lower device as one embodiment. Ito argues that the resistors facilitate operation with unmatched FETs. Of course 2-FET followers with equal-value resistors are common and I presume not patented, the resistors added to allow operation below Idss.
*disclaimer: I'm not an attorney
Someone I worked with said I would make a poor one as I am not skilled at lying. He then shorted me 20% of what he'd promised as a royalty, citing a memory lapse. I guess he'd make a better attorney.Well, that's exactly what I asked, did you invent High End as we know it today.
Never asked about high fidelity, John, I do know people like Saul Marantz, Paul W. Klipsch, Bernard Kardon and Dyney Harman, to name a few, did precede you by at least 20 years.
Yes, I expected the difference to be in circuit sophistication and consequently price to be the key difference. At the time, Dynaco was going through the last of its big days, and James Bongiorno was busy desiging SAE gear, but I always felt SAE was more of a show than the Real Deal, although I should not complain, I had their model 5000 crackle and pop remover, and I must admit it worked as advertised. Later on, I heard two more units with the same mission, both from UK, and they could not compare, they were way behing the SAE.
McIntosh was going strong, as were some other companies of the day, like BGW, etc.
In terms of build quality, SAE was there, ohovering on the borderline, but was ultimately let down by savings in wrong places.
For example, their own declaration at the back of their model I think it was 2400 L (nominally 200W/8 Ohms) clearly stated: 40V into 8 Ohms, 28.3V into 4 Ohms.
I wouldn't take that from a run-off-the-mill Japanese product, ler alone what wishes to be something higher up.
It wasn't until Sumo that James got it right.
For example, their own declaration at the back of their model I think it was 2400 L (nominally 200W/8 Ohms) clearly stated: 40V into 8 Ohms, 28.3V into 4 Ohms.
I wouldn't take that from a run-off-the-mill Japanese product, ler alone what wishes to be something higher up.
It wasn't until Sumo that James got it right.
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