If I "think" in English, as that is my arterial language, and a German "thinks" in German, as that is his arterial language, how does a person, who doesn't speak a particular language, "think"?
To satisfy the inherent constraints of this philosophical dilemma, assume that the latter individual has existed on a deserted tropical island in the pacific for his entire life. One rich in natural resources, but necessarily devoid of any potential for human contact and interaction.
Thadman
To satisfy the inherent constraints of this philosophical dilemma, assume that the latter individual has existed on a deserted tropical island in the pacific for his entire life. One rich in natural resources, but necessarily devoid of any potential for human contact and interaction.
Thadman
Some out-of-the-ordinary Lounge talk. Personally I think the premise is flawed. DF96 made good guesses, but I think language is strictly a communication medium; it has no meaning or utility to a single individual. Pictures I tend to agree with wholeheartedly, if that includes abstractions. Rather than a castaway, the question caused me to consider someone like Helen Keller.
Sofa, that's not clear. You can have an individual on an island, but his brain is the product of several million years as a social animal- language, in a sense, is wired-in. There's a lot of work being done to understand that- some of the best is happening in the Ramscar lab at Stanford, though I'm prejudiced because of Prof. Ramscar's excellent taste in Chablis.
Sure. It's interesting and research into its understanding is worthwhile. But I see your question begging another question. Is my brain wired in for American English, the Dutch of my paternal ancestors, the German of my maternal ancestors, or wired-in for some unknown language from prehistory? Hence, I stand by my statement. Granted, my definition of language may differ from the academic. But that has not been addressed, to my mind. I see a difference between "language" as a human communication tool and "language" as a brain-organizing tool. It's the latter that I don't concede to be language. I may well be wrong. I just see a rather large and unavoidable distinction.
Google "Tabula Rasa"
it's all theoretical and very difficult to prove anything useful.
Yes. And there is quite a bit of controversy about this at the moment, as Chomsky may have been proved wrong.
Please see the book "Don't sleep, there are snakes." A language with no recursion. That would invalidate much of Chomsky.
There is a good bit of video on the book's author, Daniel Everett, on Youtube.
Thought and language have been a topic of fascination from ancient times. There are tomes and tomes on the subject.
"The Hungarian language goes far back. It developed in a very particular manner and its structure reaches back to times, when most of the now spoken European languages did not even exist. It is a language which developed steadily and firmly in itself, and in which there is logic and mathematics with the adaptability and malleability of strength and chords. The Englishmen should be proud that his language indicates an epic of human history. One can show forth its origin; and alien layers can be distinguished in it, which gathered together during the contacts with different nations. Whereas the Hungarian language is like a rubble-stone; consisting of only one piece, on which the storms of time left not a scratch. It's not a calendar that adjusts to the changes of the ages. It needs no one, it doesn't borrow, does no buckstering, and doesn't give or take from anyone. This language is the oldest and most glorious monument of a national sovereignty and a mental independence. What scholars cannot solve, they ignore. In philosophy it's the same way as archeology. The floors of the old Egyptian temples, which were made out of only one rock, can't be explained. No one knows where they came from, or from which mountain the wonderous mass was taken. How they were transported and lifted to the top of the temples. The genuineness of the Hungarian language is a phenomenon much more wonderous than this. He who solves it shall be analyzing the Divine secret; in fact the first thesis of this secret: “In the beginning there was Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God."
Sir John Bowring
Sir John Bowring
No one knows
Hi Thadman,
I was a psych and biology major in college, so I know there's been a lot of research on the effect of the language a person speaks on the way he/she thinks. However, I wasted most of my lunch break searching the internet & Pub Med (a database of medical research) trying to answer your specific question. The problem is that no such person who grew up on a deserted island without language has ever been studied. There are people who can not acquire language or who had, but lost, the ability to use language because of brain damage, but they may have additional brain damage which affects non-language thinking. In addition, almost all the research concerns therapy to help such people acquire or re-acquire language, so it's hard to find research into your specific question.
Most of the research mentioned by other posts has concerned psycholinguistics or neurolinguistics, which is mainly concerned with the process by which humans acquire language. To what extent is it "hard-wired" or learned? etc . . . That doesn't really get at your question. There's also a lot of interesting research on the effect of a person's language on the way they think. Read up on Lera Boroditsky's work at Stanford.
I suspect your question will never be answered, because a subject who's brain is not messed up by damage, or lack of human interaction will never be found.
Hi Thadman,
I was a psych and biology major in college, so I know there's been a lot of research on the effect of the language a person speaks on the way he/she thinks. However, I wasted most of my lunch break searching the internet & Pub Med (a database of medical research) trying to answer your specific question. The problem is that no such person who grew up on a deserted island without language has ever been studied. There are people who can not acquire language or who had, but lost, the ability to use language because of brain damage, but they may have additional brain damage which affects non-language thinking. In addition, almost all the research concerns therapy to help such people acquire or re-acquire language, so it's hard to find research into your specific question.
Most of the research mentioned by other posts has concerned psycholinguistics or neurolinguistics, which is mainly concerned with the process by which humans acquire language. To what extent is it "hard-wired" or learned? etc . . . That doesn't really get at your question. There's also a lot of interesting research on the effect of a person's language on the way they think. Read up on Lera Boroditsky's work at Stanford.
I suspect your question will never be answered, because a subject who's brain is not messed up by damage, or lack of human interaction will never be found.
Not quite true. There are several famous cases of a "Wild Child" who grew up without language. Once past childhood, they pretty much loose the ability to learn language.
There are many classical myths and stories about this too. Children reared without language to find if there is a "natural human language." There does not seem to be.
There are many classical myths and stories about this too. Children reared without language to find if there is a "natural human language." There does not seem to be.
First, define "thought".
Second, define "language".
Language and thought.
They are close, and multiple family relationship with each other.
Sweet sisters and parents of each other at the same time.
Well yes, it's such a incestuous relationship.
They can not exist without each other.
Now suddenly I can not get better.
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Hello. Pico!
In fact, I know, I'm also hard to understand, because while I used English words, I think in Hungarian.
If it is taken, then the language has only a code.
The thought is more than that.
But still, the mother tongue of more than a code, because it perfectly expresses the thought. And inspires.
In fact, I know, I'm also hard to understand, because while I used English words, I think in Hungarian.
If it is taken, then the language has only a code.
The thought is more than that.
But still, the mother tongue of more than a code, because it perfectly expresses the thought. And inspires.
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