Hi GM,
in post 1072 und 1078 you postet two THs which looked really good, since they had a falling response instead of a rise above upper cutoff. This acoustic filter should get rid of alot of distortion, instead of amplifying it further. I wonder if you could tell me how to design these horns, which have a acoustic lowpass above upper cutoff?
in post 1072 und 1078 you postet two THs which looked really good, since they had a falling response instead of a rise above upper cutoff. This acoustic filter should get rid of alot of distortion, instead of amplifying it further. I wonder if you could tell me how to design these horns, which have a acoustic lowpass above upper cutoff?
Greets!
Agreed, I use Prof. Leach's math for all TH sims, so what makes these so acoustically well damped is their sheer size/mouth area, ergo either pick drivers that yield such large cabs and build them into the room or do as TD apparently does and use a driver that yields a small cab, but has the right specs so that when four, six/whatever you choose are stacked together yields the correct bulk/mouth size for the desired boundary loading.
GM
Agreed, I use Prof. Leach's math for all TH sims, so what makes these so acoustically well damped is their sheer size/mouth area, ergo either pick drivers that yield such large cabs and build them into the room or do as TD apparently does and use a driver that yields a small cab, but has the right specs so that when four, six/whatever you choose are stacked together yields the correct bulk/mouth size for the desired boundary loading.
GM
Thanks GM 
Its too bad that both versions will be very big. No free lunch at all
One thought about THs...
As the driver couples into the horn on both sides and the backwave and frontwave have both influence on the movement of the membrane, i suppose, a horn with smaller mouth area will measure closer to the TH simulations, because the bigger the mouth gets, the smaller the influence of the air column on the driver. Am i wrong?
Its too bad that both versions will be very big. No free lunch at all
One thought about THs...
As the driver couples into the horn on both sides and the backwave and frontwave have both influence on the movement of the membrane, i suppose, a horn with smaller mouth area will measure closer to the TH simulations, because the bigger the mouth gets, the smaller the influence of the air column on the driver. Am i wrong?
G'day MaVo
These very broad flat response plots are a result of picking just the right driver. When modeling these boxes the "right" driver pops up every now and then. The 18 Sound 15LW1401 is one such driver, and so is the B&C 15TBX100. Both these work very well in a 30-35Hz TH of a moderate size.
Cheers
William Cowan
These very broad flat response plots are a result of picking just the right driver. When modeling these boxes the "right" driver pops up every now and then. The 18 Sound 15LW1401 is one such driver, and so is the B&C 15TBX100. Both these work very well in a 30-35Hz TH of a moderate size.
Cheers
William Cowan
Good evening.
In the meantime I listened a lot to the first tapped horn I built for the 15" Eminence I had laying around. What I must say is that I like the bass of the unit a lot. Is sounds very accurate and precise. The sound is what I would decribe as effortless and easy. The best bass I had in the system. That's for shure.
After listening some evenings with my friends, one of them wanted to know if it would be possible to build something like that but smaller (better WAF, what the one for the 15" doesn't have). I serarched a lot for possible drivers, and to make a long storry short, I ended up with a 6.5" Tangband. Since they are so cheap and to have some more headroom and flexibility in regards to placement I directly built two units:
Note: Access panel to cover the speaker is not installed on this picture (it will be mounted on the aluminum rails).
For testing I placed them simply in between my mains, right next to them. Especially compare them (75l net) to the 15" TH (430l net) in the right hand corner:
I was very curious on what they are capable of. And after a weekend of listening I have to say that the result is way beyond my expectations. Sure, the big one goes deeper and louder, but they just sound great. Very well controlled and smooth, down to the lowest re3gisters. I found myself several times not believing that only the two small TH's were running (but the big one and the Klipsch were disconnected). They are able to produce very remarkable volumes, much more than usually required for listening music as well as HT. They are capable to keep up with my mains in every way.
This is the design:
This is the theoretical SPL at 20V where Xmax (11.5mm !) will be reached.
Tomorrow I'll bring the TH's to my friends home. Since I fell in love with them, I already ordered another 4 of the speakers.
To come to an end: An incredible bang for the buck (at least in my eyes and for my purposes). Very easy to build (I glued them togeter in my living room) and a lot of fun. For an amp I used the unused rear center amplifier from my HT amp. The xover is a 30€ Reckhorn unit. Total investment for the speakers, the MDF (16mm) and the xover
approx 150 Euro.
I'll make the plans available soon.
Thanks to all of you for sharing knowledge and making DIY HiFi to such a great hobby.
Erik
In the meantime I listened a lot to the first tapped horn I built for the 15" Eminence I had laying around. What I must say is that I like the bass of the unit a lot. Is sounds very accurate and precise. The sound is what I would decribe as effortless and easy. The best bass I had in the system. That's for shure.
After listening some evenings with my friends, one of them wanted to know if it would be possible to build something like that but smaller (better WAF, what the one for the 15" doesn't have). I serarched a lot for possible drivers, and to make a long storry short, I ended up with a 6.5" Tangband. Since they are so cheap and to have some more headroom and flexibility in regards to placement I directly built two units:
Note: Access panel to cover the speaker is not installed on this picture (it will be mounted on the aluminum rails).
For testing I placed them simply in between my mains, right next to them. Especially compare them (75l net) to the 15" TH (430l net) in the right hand corner:
I was very curious on what they are capable of. And after a weekend of listening I have to say that the result is way beyond my expectations. Sure, the big one goes deeper and louder, but they just sound great. Very well controlled and smooth, down to the lowest re3gisters. I found myself several times not believing that only the two small TH's were running (but the big one and the Klipsch were disconnected). They are able to produce very remarkable volumes, much more than usually required for listening music as well as HT. They are capable to keep up with my mains in every way.
This is the design:
This is the theoretical SPL at 20V where Xmax (11.5mm !) will be reached.
Tomorrow I'll bring the TH's to my friends home. Since I fell in love with them, I already ordered another 4 of the speakers.
To come to an end: An incredible bang for the buck (at least in my eyes and for my purposes). Very easy to build (I glued them togeter in my living room) and a lot of fun. For an amp I used the unused rear center amplifier from my HT amp. The xover is a 30€ Reckhorn unit. Total investment for the speakers, the MDF (16mm) and the xover
approx 150 Euro.
I'll make the plans available soon.
Thanks to all of you for sharing knowledge and making DIY HiFi to such a great hobby.
Erik
MaVo said:Thanks GM
Its too bad that both versions will be very big. No free lunch at all
..........the bigger the mouth gets, the smaller the influence of the air column on the driver. Am i wrong?
You're welcome!
Yeah, Mother Nature doesn't like to be cheated.
Hmm, the larger the horn/mouth the more balanced the damping is on both sides of the driver, though one side is under high pressure while the other is damped by a high acoustic mass, so I see no reason why a small mouth horn sim would be more accurate than a large mouth one.
GM
Volvotreter_Tang Band_W6-1139_TH
Volvotreter: Hi Erik, Very nice work with the W6-1139, love the pictures. Please, can you expand on the sound differences between your subwoofers, particularly as to home theater use? I made a few small changes in the Hornresp model and I'm attaching the input and SPL pages for your information.
I have tried to email you in reference to you TH spreadsheet, my email is not going through. Anyway, I got it going in Quattro Pro by changing the "Pattern Color" for the blacked out fields from black to orange.
And yes, a drawing to show your geometric layout solution would be appreciated.
Volvotreter: Hi Erik, Very nice work with the W6-1139, love the pictures. Please, can you expand on the sound differences between your subwoofers, particularly as to home theater use? I made a few small changes in the Hornresp model and I'm attaching the input and SPL pages for your information.
I have tried to email you in reference to you TH spreadsheet, my email is not going through. Anyway, I got it going in Quattro Pro by changing the "Pattern Color" for the blacked out fields from black to orange.
And yes, a drawing to show your geometric layout solution would be appreciated.
Attachments
Volvotreter said:
That would be nice, I know the geometrics for spirals, but not a simple way to calc folding up a long TH, which will be a requirement for this corner loaded long, skinny TH of only ~187.6 L. Talk about packing '10 lbs into a 2 lb bag':
GM
Attachments
swak said:
FWIW, I didn't bother to research any differences between these, but inputted differing specs for the SC,SG,SI models including some measured specs and they all superimposed so close in one of my sims that I had a hard time seeing any difference, so are all interchangeable AFAIK.
GM
@William
I was hunting for a sub going lower than the Klipsch. This goal was clearly achieved. The large TH also sounds very good (especially the lowst registers). At the same time it is capable of insane levels. @20Hz it shakes my living room (brick walls, concrete ceiling and floor) and I daren't to turn up louder. Unbelievable. Funny to see the eyes of ppl who have not experienced someting like this before. A different category of sub (compared to what I have listened to before).
Sonically I like it a lot but I had some ingerartion issues with my mains. When it sounded right, I was able to hear the sub being on the right. May be I'll built a second one. But until then, I will run the TH below the Klipsch (< 50Hz).
Erik
(more later, I'm in a hurry)
I was hunting for a sub going lower than the Klipsch. This goal was clearly achieved. The large TH also sounds very good (especially the lowst registers). At the same time it is capable of insane levels. @20Hz it shakes my living room (brick walls, concrete ceiling and floor) and I daren't to turn up louder. Unbelievable. Funny to see the eyes of ppl who have not experienced someting like this before. A different category of sub (compared to what I have listened to before).
Sonically I like it a lot but I had some ingerartion issues with my mains. When it sounded right, I was able to hear the sub being on the right. May be I'll built a second one. But until then, I will run the TH below the Klipsch (< 50Hz).
Erik
(more later, I'm in a hurry)
@GM - What you say sounds very reasonable. Also, its way over my head to think about when and why a TH would not work as in the simulation.
@cowanaudio - Thanks for mentioning these drivers, a quick sim in hornresp gave a near flat response from about 30-300hz with falling response to both sides. that is what i was in search of. now i have to find out, if there are drivers that can achieve this in the 20-100hz area and what is so special about the ts parameter combination.
@volvotreter - great to see more success stories! Have fun
@cowanaudio - Thanks for mentioning these drivers, a quick sim in hornresp gave a near flat response from about 30-300hz with falling response to both sides. that is what i was in search of. now i have to find out, if there are drivers that can achieve this in the 20-100hz area and what is so special about the ts parameter combination.
@volvotreter - great to see more success stories! Have fun
TangBand WQ8-1071
Hi everyone.
I tried to simulate in HornResp but i don,t get it..
Could anyone give it a try? and se how large the box would be?
This is for the TB W8Q-1071 driver.
http://www.tb-speaker.com/detail/1208_03/w8q-1071d.htm
Thanx
/JZ
Hi everyone.
I tried to simulate in HornResp but i don,t get it..
Could anyone give it a try? and se how large the box would be?
This is for the TB W8Q-1071 driver.
http://www.tb-speaker.com/detail/1208_03/w8q-1071d.htm
Thanx
/JZ
When you are looking for a suitable 8" you may give the Visaton TIW 200 XS 8 OHM a closer look. Besides it looked good in my sims, it has got 11mm xmax and is very well built:
TIW 200 XS
Erik
TIW 200 XS
Erik