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How to make sub 'faster'
How to make sub 'faster'
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Old 26th June 2006, 11:14 PM   #11
foo is offline foo  Tibet
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Hire a professional builder is the" fastest" way to make a subwoofer.
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Old 26th June 2006, 11:58 PM   #12
bvan is offline bvan  Denmark
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Can one talk about 'acurate' in absolute terms? i.e is 0.5 'more acurate' than 0.7. You would then think more speakers and subs would have low Q wouldnt you?

Why would higher Q sound better with strings? Is a higher Q more accurate with strings and a lower Q more accurate in reproducing drums say?


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Old 27th June 2006, 12:36 AM   #13
lndm is offline lndm  Australia
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I have one opinion and I expect others to have their own. That said...

I find a low Q system to sound accurate in that the instruments sound like they should. They are exciting in a subtle but breathtaking way.

I have had others listen to my system and they want to find the treble and bass controls so they can 'crank' them. My system doesn't sound like a commercial mid-fi system does.

Many commercial mid-fi systems have a higher Q bass (or reflex). This can give more 'kick', and can offer a buzz out of heavier music. The instruments don't always sound as much like they are in the room with you though.

Since, though, we are all probably capable of building a system that's better than mid-fi, my guess is that your compromise won't be that large.

I encourage you to take other's opinions too.
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Old 27th June 2006, 01:43 AM   #14
Cloth Ears is offline Cloth Ears  Australia
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Some refs:
Adire Audio on Woofer Speed.
John Kreskovsky on Sealed Enclosures
Art Ludwig on Thiel/Small analysis, especially the section comparing Enclosure Types.

Personally, I believe accurate is a matter of personal taste. I've heard horns that are blindingly accurate when it comes to the speed, percussiveness, etc of the performance, yet are tonally unbalanced compared even to mid-fi. And I've heard stuff that seems to produce the tonal balance of instruments extremely well, yet the notes themselves don't attack the way they should, and the soundstage is smeared "across the horizon". Most microphones cannot record the sound 'accurately' in the first place - even the best will produce a different recording when placed in a similar set-up. Not to mention that the interacting harmonics of the sound will now be recorded as well.
As most rock music takes place above 40Hz, a higher Q system for this is not "necessary". But to cope with most music (and - heresy - also for your HT) you would probably want a low-Q woofer set-up for all regular playing, PLUS a "real" subwoofer to handle those 16Hz organ pipes and the explosions from Star Wars.

Mine is a pair of Q=.577 12" Lambda in sealed boxes (F3 ~50Hz), plus a yet-to-be-completed 2x15" Iso sealed sub-woofer. The latter is awaiting spousal approval... Without the the subby, the sound is indeed 'tight' and 'fast', but not real world. Some pieces just need that bit of extra impact. (Sigh) It was so much simpler when I was single
"It is impossible to build a fool proof system; because fools are so ingenious."
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Old 27th June 2006, 07:18 AM   #15
richie00boy is offline richie00boy  United Kingdom
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How to make sub 'faster'
I agree with Rob on taking the 'Critical Q' sub and it's writeup with a pinch of salt. Also a good point from lndm about what you want - I've known people think 'fast' is damped and articulate as lndm said, but others think it's a punchy sound that adds an element of pace to the music. You need to think more about the sound you want.

Bear in mind though that the placement will matter at least as much as any tweaks you do to the design.
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Old 27th June 2006, 09:47 AM   #16
sreten is offline sreten  United Kingdom
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I'll add I also think the "Critical Q" write-up should be ignored.
Design based on waffle is not design, it's wishful thinking.

I'll also add the following :

The high pass roll-off (i.e. low frequency roll-off) of the sub is one issue.

At least as important is the low pass roll-off of the sub and its
integration with the high pass roll-off of the electrostatics, and
this can be dominated by in-room gain and room resonances.

Using two subs is one route to reducing room effects.

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