I have been using this Sony SA-WX700 sub for the past few months from my brother, and right now I ran into a little emergency so I cannot do the other sub project at the moment.
To make a long story short, the digital amp in the Sony just died last night (which I have read is typical of these subs).
The 10" drivers are of very decent quality; very solid and robust, and I would like to use these in a new, smaller and less expensive subwoofer project. They have a nice and heavy magnet, large vented pole-piece, a 2" voice coil, thick pulp-paper cone, huge 1" rubber surround, and a stiff dust cap.
Anyway, I was wondering (and hoping) someone on here may have or may be capable of getting the T/S parameters of these 10" drivers.
If so, I would like to build a new subwoofer system using these two drivers along with one of those BASH digital 300 watt plate amps from Parts Express.
Yes, I know I could just build a new sealed enclosure to match Sony's 1.58 cu.ft. enclosure, but I would like to, if possible, go with either a slot ported design or regular ported design just to get a little more output and extension at or slightly below 20Hz. The Sony sub (as a fully working unit) is capable of reaching 20Hz on its own, but the output at 20Hz is down about -9dB if I remember correctly from my in-room measurements.
So if any of you could help me out on this, I would greatly appreciate it!!!!
I know you all are very resourceful in finding out this kind of information, or even finding some websites that have this type of information.
Many thanks in advance!
To make a long story short, the digital amp in the Sony just died last night (which I have read is typical of these subs).
The 10" drivers are of very decent quality; very solid and robust, and I would like to use these in a new, smaller and less expensive subwoofer project. They have a nice and heavy magnet, large vented pole-piece, a 2" voice coil, thick pulp-paper cone, huge 1" rubber surround, and a stiff dust cap.
Anyway, I was wondering (and hoping) someone on here may have or may be capable of getting the T/S parameters of these 10" drivers.
If so, I would like to build a new subwoofer system using these two drivers along with one of those BASH digital 300 watt plate amps from Parts Express.
Yes, I know I could just build a new sealed enclosure to match Sony's 1.58 cu.ft. enclosure, but I would like to, if possible, go with either a slot ported design or regular ported design just to get a little more output and extension at or slightly below 20Hz. The Sony sub (as a fully working unit) is capable of reaching 20Hz on its own, but the output at 20Hz is down about -9dB if I remember correctly from my in-room measurements.
So if any of you could help me out on this, I would greatly appreciate it!!!!
I know you all are very resourceful in finding out this kind of information, or even finding some websites that have this type of information.
Many thanks in advance!
The best you can hope for is to find a DIYer in your area with a comprehensive testing setup to determine the T/S parameters. Companies like Sony are almost never forthcoming with their drivers' T/S parameters - since that's proprietary information (and you might be pretty disappointed if you really knew the kind of parameters some manufacturers will settle for in their drivers, such as high Fs and Qts above 0.7).
From what it sounds like to me, unless you're prepared to shell out for a replacement amplifier, you should just try something with one of your Dayton DVC15 woofers in a sealed box and some sort of basic amplifier driving it.
From what it sounds like to me, unless you're prepared to shell out for a replacement amplifier, you should just try something with one of your Dayton DVC15 woofers in a sealed box and some sort of basic amplifier driving it.
BAM said:
Thanks for the input BAM!
This is true, and I was kind of thinking about that as well. What I can do is just build a new, slightly larger sealed enclosure for them (2 cu.ft.), have them both front-firing and powered by one of those 300 watt Parts Express Bash amps and use them for my bedroom system. I have a pair of Triangle Zephyr's in there which do a pretty good job, but they could use a little help, and these Sony 10's would easily do the trick.
Back to the Dayton 15DVC, I'm thinking of maybe building a slot-ported enclosure for it, also powered by the same 300 watt Parts Express Bash amp. Any thoughts on this one?
BAM said:
I already did, as I kept a close eye on port velocity, which is at a max of 10.5 s/m @ 12 Hz. It's a nice and calm low of 7.2 m/s @ 20Hz. I can live with that.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Just a quick update....
I broke out my father's old Technics SU-8099 integrated amp today, rewired the Dayton 15DVC sub for dual 8 ohm operation, ran a mono signal into the "Main" input on the amp, and turned it on. Amazingly enough, eventhough the Technics is only 115 watts @ 8 ohms, it has boat-loads more slam and control than that Rythmic amp could ever dream of having. And as loud as I have been playing so far, the amp has only peaked a max output of roughly 30 watts to the Dayton sub, and that was REAL loud, easily hitting 100-105dB at my seat around 30Hz or so!!!
I am still using the original enclosure I made for it several years ago (4.23 cu.ft sealed before displacement, which comes to about 4 cu.ft with driver installed), and I never cared for the sound of it. The movement seemed very sloppy, and because of that there was a lack of detail and it was boomy. Of course I was always only using that Rythmic plate amp.
But now with the Technics connected, its an entirely different animal! The driver is extremely tight now and the detail is back. And bass extention is well into the mid-teens (Hz) without a problem.
I can't wait until I can barrow my brother's SUV so I can go get some 1" MDF and build that slot ported enclosure!
Anyway, here's a few pictures of the amp and sub.
And just an internal shot to show how beefy and rugged this thing is. Technics don't make 'em like this anymore! It weighs a good 60lbs at least. (that face plate is solid 0.25" aluminum!)
I broke out my father's old Technics SU-8099 integrated amp today, rewired the Dayton 15DVC sub for dual 8 ohm operation, ran a mono signal into the "Main" input on the amp, and turned it on. Amazingly enough, eventhough the Technics is only 115 watts @ 8 ohms, it has boat-loads more slam and control than that Rythmic amp could ever dream of having. And as loud as I have been playing so far, the amp has only peaked a max output of roughly 30 watts to the Dayton sub, and that was REAL loud, easily hitting 100-105dB at my seat around 30Hz or so!!!
I am still using the original enclosure I made for it several years ago (4.23 cu.ft sealed before displacement, which comes to about 4 cu.ft with driver installed), and I never cared for the sound of it. The movement seemed very sloppy, and because of that there was a lack of detail and it was boomy. Of course I was always only using that Rythmic plate amp.
But now with the Technics connected, its an entirely different animal! The driver is extremely tight now and the detail is back. And bass extention is well into the mid-teens (Hz) without a problem.
I can't wait until I can barrow my brother's SUV so I can go get some 1" MDF and build that slot ported enclosure!
Anyway, here's a few pictures of the amp and sub.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
And just an internal shot to show how beefy and rugged this thing is. Technics don't make 'em like this anymore! It weighs a good 60lbs at least. (that face plate is solid 0.25" aluminum!)
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
BAM said:
I don't know. I can't imagine it getting any tighter than it is right now.
I just got done watching "The Best 25 Years Of Pop - A tribute to Trevor Horn" on HDNET on cable. The dynamic impact of the bass drums and electric bass made it feel like the instruments were right in the room with me. And the keyboard bass was rattling the whole room. I couldn't believe how good this sub was sounding durring this concert/show. I could easily hear the differences between the different bass instruments.
I've gotta say, I seriously believe that this sub with the Technics amp is beating anything that even the SVS PB12-ISD/2 I used to have did. It's much tighter than the SVS, it has a LOT more impact than the SVS, it reveals a lot more detail and has absolutely no problems reaching as low as the SVS tuned to its 16Hz setting.
And because I have it out in the middle of the front wall instead of in the corner, there is no boominess at all.
However, I did notice the amp peaking between 70 and 80 watts with music, so I'll definately have to get a more powerfull amp for some serious reference level movie playback. But I am still completely amazed at how loud this sub is playing with about 30 watts rms!
My dad has a similar one from the mid 80s, does 120w/ch ointo 8 ohm...but is also 4 ohm stable! and he never even uses it, and uses it to drive his psb alphas and the technics 3 way boom boxes that came with it...saddening really, i wish i could take it for my dayton 8 plaster cracker project....
i better get on searching pawn shops hahaha
i better get on searching pawn shops hahaha
xstephanx said:
Actually, my oldest brother bought Technics' top-of-the-line integrated amp in the early 80's at the PX when he was in the army, and the quality of Technics products by then had really gone to pot. In fact, Technics started going down hill in 1979 with cheaper build quality and plastic face plates and knobs.
He only kept if for a couple months before trading it back in for a Carver C-1 preamp and Carver M-400t "cube" amp which was by far much better quality.
The SU-8099 that I have is ALL metal, face plate, knobs and buttons!
I also have a Sony SA-WX700 with a blown amplifier. I removed the amplifer unit, fashioned a 3/4" MDF board in it's place- and installed/wired in a Bash 300w subwoofer amplifier on to the new panel.
Intially, i wired the the 2 speakers in parallel - but this seemed to cancel out any bass whatsoever. The sub will move to near full excursion- with little to no sound whatsoever. I'm sure i have them wired incorrectly and that they are cancelling each other out. Does anyone understand how Sony's SAW (Acoustically loaded subwoofer) design works? If so, how do i wire the two subs together? For those unfamiliar with the design- the system basically has 2 - 10" drivers. A bottom speaker fires INTO the enclosure (with the back of the driver exposed to the outside). Another 10" driver is mounted traditionally in the same enclosure as the bottom driver. The 2 speakers generally share the same airspace- except that one fires into the enclosure chamber and one fires out of the enclosure. If wired in parallel and in phase- i thought they would operate in tandem. This not appear to be the case.
Any thoughts or suggestions would be appreciated.
Joel, CA
Intially, i wired the the 2 speakers in parallel - but this seemed to cancel out any bass whatsoever. The sub will move to near full excursion- with little to no sound whatsoever. I'm sure i have them wired incorrectly and that they are cancelling each other out. Does anyone understand how Sony's SAW (Acoustically loaded subwoofer) design works? If so, how do i wire the two subs together? For those unfamiliar with the design- the system basically has 2 - 10" drivers. A bottom speaker fires INTO the enclosure (with the back of the driver exposed to the outside). Another 10" driver is mounted traditionally in the same enclosure as the bottom driver. The 2 speakers generally share the same airspace- except that one fires into the enclosure chamber and one fires out of the enclosure. If wired in parallel and in phase- i thought they would operate in tandem. This not appear to be the case.
Any thoughts or suggestions would be appreciated.
Joel, CA
The bottom driver needs to be wired out of phase. What you have here is a 'push-pull' arrangement where one driver is flipped (magnet sticking out of the box) to cancel out certain distortion products. However, you also need to flip the wiring of the bottom woofer (+ to -, - to +) so that both cones are pushing air out or pulling air into the box at the same time. So, try flipping the polarity of the woofer that's on the bottom.
I know this thread is super old.. However I wanted to share my experience with the Sony Sa-WX700 and the drivers inside of it.
I bought one of these home subwoofers. Didnt find it to be great at all to be honest. a very slow one note subwoofer with almost no sub bass any lower than around 35hz. Not musical at all. It seems people have no clue what musical bass really is.. Ive owned a few good brands and model. THIS model is not one of them... At ALL. the
The arrangement of the speakers is what is called Isobarik.
Sony make the subwoofers push/pull isobarik so that 2 drivers would fit into a small 1.5ft square box. The whole idea of this sort of speaker alignment is lower distortion and box size and also extend low frequencies... Problem is it decreases power by half. So for example since you have 2 drivers in this box and only ONE is the effective output ( because the other is basically just helping the other one move correctly) you are using your amp to drive 2 speakers but you can hear only one which is why is decreases teh power by 50%... This basically sux. So that 250 watt amp is now 125 watts MAX... It has no low extension. AT ALL.
I took it apart. I found some very intersting things about drivers.. Although i do NOT have the parameters for the drivers i can say they must be substantial. Heres why.
If you take the lower driver out the enclosure sony made, sealed it back up and use it just as a single sealed 1.5" enclosure it sounds allot better. Still it lacks low end. You need allot of power for this driver. The sensitivity must be low 80's cause you can put 350 watts easy no problem on just one of these. Thats what I did and the sub started to exhibit some nice low end that it claimed. It digs low. Only if you take the crappy amp off of it and go single driver. Seal it all air tight. Put a small amount of pillow stuffing... BAM! Deep bass that should have been there before...
NOW wait! its gets more interesting.
I have 2 slot ported box each same type and size. Got um at BestBuy. Good quality. Very sturdy... 1.5ft3 total each with a slot port of about 11" wide x 15" deep and measurements of this box with a thickness of .75" wood is
17.3" w inches x 12.6 " d 17.4" h.
I put these 2 sa-wx700 woofers in these boxes ( they are 3.3ohms each )
WOW. They are a totally different subwoofer now. They beat the hell ou tof the back seat. All subwoofers I ever heard had to be loaded in a corner or trunk if used in a car so that the distortion from the cone would not be heard and also to have a better output.. However , I have NO idea why but these subs in those boxes could be put in the middle of a parking lot and they would slam just like in a vehichle..
WAIT gets even better... no joke.
I lined the walls on the enclosure with simple pillow stuffing. Notthing majot. Very thin but good amount and omg.. Unbelievable... The low end changed drastically... They sounded like 2 speakers double there size... No no.. Im not joking because I already have a 15" woofer i tested all this with.
I put a 18db subwonic filter at 21hz. Low pass set at 65hz 24db per octave.. I dont think there is a subwoofer on the market for car audio that does what these do...
So if you can get these and want a really good all around sub woofer. make that box, line it with polyfill and give it at least 350 watts and use a subsonic filter... Mind blown..
I bought one of these home subwoofers. Didnt find it to be great at all to be honest. a very slow one note subwoofer with almost no sub bass any lower than around 35hz. Not musical at all. It seems people have no clue what musical bass really is.. Ive owned a few good brands and model. THIS model is not one of them... At ALL. the
The arrangement of the speakers is what is called Isobarik.
Sony make the subwoofers push/pull isobarik so that 2 drivers would fit into a small 1.5ft square box. The whole idea of this sort of speaker alignment is lower distortion and box size and also extend low frequencies... Problem is it decreases power by half. So for example since you have 2 drivers in this box and only ONE is the effective output ( because the other is basically just helping the other one move correctly) you are using your amp to drive 2 speakers but you can hear only one which is why is decreases teh power by 50%... This basically sux. So that 250 watt amp is now 125 watts MAX... It has no low extension. AT ALL.
I took it apart. I found some very intersting things about drivers.. Although i do NOT have the parameters for the drivers i can say they must be substantial. Heres why.
If you take the lower driver out the enclosure sony made, sealed it back up and use it just as a single sealed 1.5" enclosure it sounds allot better. Still it lacks low end. You need allot of power for this driver. The sensitivity must be low 80's cause you can put 350 watts easy no problem on just one of these. Thats what I did and the sub started to exhibit some nice low end that it claimed. It digs low. Only if you take the crappy amp off of it and go single driver. Seal it all air tight. Put a small amount of pillow stuffing... BAM! Deep bass that should have been there before...
NOW wait! its gets more interesting.
I have 2 slot ported box each same type and size. Got um at BestBuy. Good quality. Very sturdy... 1.5ft3 total each with a slot port of about 11" wide x 15" deep and measurements of this box with a thickness of .75" wood is
17.3" w inches x 12.6 " d 17.4" h.
I put these 2 sa-wx700 woofers in these boxes ( they are 3.3ohms each )
WOW. They are a totally different subwoofer now. They beat the hell ou tof the back seat. All subwoofers I ever heard had to be loaded in a corner or trunk if used in a car so that the distortion from the cone would not be heard and also to have a better output.. However , I have NO idea why but these subs in those boxes could be put in the middle of a parking lot and they would slam just like in a vehichle..
WAIT gets even better... no joke.
I lined the walls on the enclosure with simple pillow stuffing. Notthing majot. Very thin but good amount and omg.. Unbelievable... The low end changed drastically... They sounded like 2 speakers double there size... No no.. Im not joking because I already have a 15" woofer i tested all this with.
I put a 18db subwonic filter at 21hz. Low pass set at 65hz 24db per octave.. I dont think there is a subwoofer on the market for car audio that does what these do...
So if you can get these and want a really good all around sub woofer. make that box, line it with polyfill and give it at least 350 watts and use a subsonic filter... Mind blown..
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