Hello Bass gurus, "HELP" I have had a couple of 12" Audio Concepts DV12's that I want to purpose into a sub box (or 2) for Hifi, and some HT as well. I have plenty of space, and reasonable skills to build a box. I am hoping for a tapped horn or TL design. The design part is becoming a bit overwhelming, I am hoping for either a proven existing plan, deserving of a tweak or two, or maybe some solid direction on volume and dimension of a horn, that I can attempt to fold up. I am playing with hornresp, but am honestly afraid of building a giant box, and finding out its all wrong. Again on the proven plan idea. I am hoping for something that hits low, (Fs 17) and is interesting to build. I am using a Super-X Pro as a crossover for a biamped set of speakers, that has a sub out channel as well in mono. So although not necessary, certainly open to both drivers in the same box. Although I am looking for as good as possible, I am not super duper critical? Any direction here would certainly be welcomed. I also have found different specs for the drivers, but these are the ones I have been working with. Since my wife doesnt know the answer, can someone else please tell me what to do? I am stuck on these drivers as well.
Audio Concepts DV12
Fs 17.00000
Re 8.00000
Qms 6.00000
Qes 0.47500
Sd 729.00000
Vas 377.46000
Xmax peak 10.54000
Le 2.40000
Nominal Power 150.00000
Qts .440
MMS 173g
Cms .506 mm/N\
Rms 3.085 kg/s
Ref Effieiency, n0 .375%
Audio Concepts DV12
Fs 17.00000
Re 8.00000
Qms 6.00000
Qes 0.47500
Sd 729.00000
Vas 377.46000
Xmax peak 10.54000
Le 2.40000
Nominal Power 150.00000
Qts .440
MMS 173g
Cms .506 mm/N\
Rms 3.085 kg/s
Ref Effieiency, n0 .375%
that Sd figure must be a typo - maybe that's the only thing off in those specs (?) - - here's one spec I found for a DV12 compared to Lab12 in a tapped horn designed for the Lab12 - the real spec might do better than this sim
Lab12 - Tapped Horn -
Audio Concepts DV12 | "Cult of the Infinitely Baffled" Hear The Bass, Not The Box The definitive online resource for Infinite Baffle subwoofer design Established 1999
Lab12 - Tapped Horn -
Audio Concepts DV12 | "Cult of the Infinitely Baffled" Hear The Bass, Not The Box The definitive online resource for Infinite Baffle subwoofer design Established 1999
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Ack, ya 729 is huge. a 12 inch driver should be more in the 500's I think. I wonder if the other numbers are wrong as well? I have looked at boxes designed for the Lab12. Are you suggesting a Lab12 box would possibly work? I kinda get it, but just not quite confident to be able to make my own from scratch. Thanks for chiming in!
Now I have come across this description for the drivers...
Info found on-line:
*The DV12 is a dual-voice coil driver with two 8 ohm coils. All specifications derived with voice
coils wired in parallel. Custom designed, ultra-long vented pole piece, rigid long-fiber ribbed cone
and rubber surround. The super long throw of the DV12 results in exceptionally low distortion at
low frequencies. The DV12 offers excellent sound quality and long term reliability.
Suggested DV12 Applications:
Sealed or aperiodic enclosures of <2.0 to 5 cubic feet, Vented fourth-order alignments,
Electronically assisted higher-order alignments, Infinite baffle systems, Free-air, electronically
assisted dipolar systems, Bandpass woofer systems
The Cast-Frame DV12
by Audio Concepts, Inc. 1998
This legendary 12” subwoofer with over 10mm linear one-way X-max is now available with a cast-frame
and flat spider, resulting in:
•Improved suspension linearity for even lower distortion measurements.
•Improved specifications for the legendary DV12 performance in smaller box sizes.
•Nominal Diameter: 12”, Impedence: 4 ohms, Range: 16-500Hz
•RMS Power: 150 watts, System Power: 200 watts, Sensitivity: 88db
•Magnet mass: 1700 grams, BL: 9.75 Tm, FS: 16Hz
•Qms: 5.78, Qes: .391, Qts: .366
•Vas: 346 liters, Cms: 821.05, Mms: 118 grams, Mmd: 111 grams
•Xmax (linear one way): 10.55 mm, Voice Coil Diameter: 2”
•Voice Coil Height: 30.61 mm, Air Gap Height: 9.525 mm
•Voice Coil Inductance: 2mh, Voice Coil Resistance: 3.11 ohms
•12 3/8” overall width, hole size 11 1/8” Flange depth 3/8” (1/2” with gasket)
•Overall depth from front of flange to rear of magnets: 6”
cast-frame model:
Fs:16
Re: 3.11
Qms: 5.78
Qes: 0.39
Sd (guess) 481
Vas: 346
Xmax: 10.55
Box Volume, Box Resonance
QL Q/Ripple Port* F3 F10
2.0 sealed 42Hz 7 ,97 ---- 35Hz 25Hz
4.5 sealed 31Hz 7 .7 ---- 30Hz 20Hz
5.0 vented 18Hz 7 +1.2db 4”x18” 25Hz 17Hz
6.0 vented 15Hz 7 +.5db 4”x22.25” 25Hz 16Hz
8.0 vented 16Hz 7 0 db 4”x14” 22Hz 14Hz
*The complete range of enclosures for any given driver is limited only by your knowledge and
computer analysis software available.
1. All ports calculated using 4” I.D. tubing (12.57 sq.in.). This is the approx. min. area
required for low turbulence.
2. All calculations assume a .5ohm series resistance (wiring, output impedance of driving
amplifier). A greater series resistance will require a slightly larger box size to attain the
same performance."
Info found on-line:
*The DV12 is a dual-voice coil driver with two 8 ohm coils. All specifications derived with voice
coils wired in parallel. Custom designed, ultra-long vented pole piece, rigid long-fiber ribbed cone
and rubber surround. The super long throw of the DV12 results in exceptionally low distortion at
low frequencies. The DV12 offers excellent sound quality and long term reliability.
Suggested DV12 Applications:
Sealed or aperiodic enclosures of <2.0 to 5 cubic feet, Vented fourth-order alignments,
Electronically assisted higher-order alignments, Infinite baffle systems, Free-air, electronically
assisted dipolar systems, Bandpass woofer systems
The Cast-Frame DV12
by Audio Concepts, Inc. 1998
This legendary 12” subwoofer with over 10mm linear one-way X-max is now available with a cast-frame
and flat spider, resulting in:
•Improved suspension linearity for even lower distortion measurements.
•Improved specifications for the legendary DV12 performance in smaller box sizes.
•Nominal Diameter: 12”, Impedence: 4 ohms, Range: 16-500Hz
•RMS Power: 150 watts, System Power: 200 watts, Sensitivity: 88db
•Magnet mass: 1700 grams, BL: 9.75 Tm, FS: 16Hz
•Qms: 5.78, Qes: .391, Qts: .366
•Vas: 346 liters, Cms: 821.05, Mms: 118 grams, Mmd: 111 grams
•Xmax (linear one way): 10.55 mm, Voice Coil Diameter: 2”
•Voice Coil Height: 30.61 mm, Air Gap Height: 9.525 mm
•Voice Coil Inductance: 2mh, Voice Coil Resistance: 3.11 ohms
•12 3/8” overall width, hole size 11 1/8” Flange depth 3/8” (1/2” with gasket)
•Overall depth from front of flange to rear of magnets: 6”
cast-frame model:
Fs:16
Re: 3.11
Qms: 5.78
Qes: 0.39
Sd (guess) 481
Vas: 346
Xmax: 10.55
Box Volume, Box Resonance
QL Q/Ripple Port* F3 F10
2.0 sealed 42Hz 7 ,97 ---- 35Hz 25Hz
4.5 sealed 31Hz 7 .7 ---- 30Hz 20Hz
5.0 vented 18Hz 7 +1.2db 4”x18” 25Hz 17Hz
6.0 vented 15Hz 7 +.5db 4”x22.25” 25Hz 16Hz
8.0 vented 16Hz 7 0 db 4”x14” 22Hz 14Hz
*The complete range of enclosures for any given driver is limited only by your knowledge and
computer analysis software available.
1. All ports calculated using 4” I.D. tubing (12.57 sq.in.). This is the approx. min. area
required for low turbulence.
2. All calculations assume a .5ohm series resistance (wiring, output impedance of driving
amplifier). A greater series resistance will require a slightly larger box size to attain the
same performance."
In the attachment, I see the hornresp horn, segment 1 is 175 litres, parallel walls, then in segment 2 the horn narrows. Can you explain how to get the fold, so the speaker placement lines up for the tapp by the mouth? If I fold both halves in half, it works as in they overlay, but it makes an odd sort of large rear chamber. is this what this is looking for? the driver is mounted facing out at the mouth. If a box has a path with 1 180 degree turn, the outside shape is odd, while the speaker mount and tapp do not overlay? Can you describe a general shape or path for the horn?
Sorry If I seem dumb, but this is new, but once I get my head around it, I should be able to make a box. thanks again for any help getting me going here. I was able to create the same model, just have to now convert that to a box.
W
Sorry If I seem dumb, but this is new, but once I get my head around it, I should be able to make a box. thanks again for any help getting me going here. I was able to create the same model, just have to now convert that to a box.
W
OK a few questions to help here?
If S1 and S2 are equal then the baffle is parallel with the wall? and if L12 is 175, the driver is way up by the fold? then L34 is way less than L12 this makes the mouth up close to the woof/ finally S4 is at 177 so there must be more box past the mouth? does one close the mouth at the bottom and have an empty void in the lower bit. Its like of the 350 ish cm horn, 250 is on on side, while maybe 100 cm are on the other side? Very odd shape happening here. Am I way off in the way I am reading this? I suppose an access panel can be placed in front of the driver for access, and an empty void can be left past the mouth to make the box squareish? Or can one fold the L12 in half?
So many questions.. sheesh
If S1 and S2 are equal then the baffle is parallel with the wall? and if L12 is 175, the driver is way up by the fold? then L34 is way less than L12 this makes the mouth up close to the woof/ finally S4 is at 177 so there must be more box past the mouth? does one close the mouth at the bottom and have an empty void in the lower bit. Its like of the 350 ish cm horn, 250 is on on side, while maybe 100 cm are on the other side? Very odd shape happening here. Am I way off in the way I am reading this? I suppose an access panel can be placed in front of the driver for access, and an empty void can be left past the mouth to make the box squareish? Or can one fold the L12 in half?
So many questions.. sheesh
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