Compound loading 6th order quarterwave "Super Planar" horns and pipes concepts/builds

Absolutely

Gkh ,
Yessir , i will definitely put something together for you :happy2:

In the meantime you want to get that guy (or lady if you prefer) broken-in (in free-air) before before he or she goes into a cabinet ...... :D Very low frequency sine-waves down around 25hz or 30hz with enough drive to get the cone moving moderately for several hours or more, or even overnight should suffice ....

Gkh , When you take the driver out of the packaging let us know what your impression of it is........... It's construction, appearance , quality etc ..:)
 
MMJ, do you mean this Altec?



Adding a phase plug will give higher upper range.

Yes , like that one or similar such as the Altecs with the larger section on bottom for us to fold our longer QW path inside of .. .. :)

Since the High-Tuned resonator has such a flare it might be easier to simulate this one in Hornresp's "CH" mode ....


I have about 6 drivers orders in preparation for prototype planar build (after I finished the TH218SC prototype) I am a bit behind i was struck with stomach flu since last weekend.

Thank you for the new sketches MMJ, appreciated!

No problem on the sketches Obi , and that is exciting news about the upcoming protoypes! I hope you get to feeling better soon!
 
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Matthew,
this driver is really sturdy and, apart from some sloppiness, looking ok.

Sturdy is good! :D I think it is not unusual for Chinese budget drivers to have a little bit of sloppiness on the glue ... .

Right now it's breaking in with 15Hz and approximately 3mm cone movement till tonight.

Ok , you have the right idea :)

You can go higher in frequency if you want ....It is common to break drivers in that have lower Fs values with signals as high in frequency as 20hz or 25hz ........ That driver's Fs is probably up around at least 45hz-ish (the one that Sebastian measured had a 46hz Fs, partially broken in) , so you just want to stay well below that .... 30hz would still be safe in this case because we know the Fs isn't going to shift down that far during break-in ...... I would be surprised if the driver's Fs settles as far down as 40hz , It will more likely end up in the mid to low 40s unless this driver is substantially (pun intended:tongue:) different than Sebastian's sample ..
 
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I have never ever broken in a driver in 30 years. Replaced a lot of drivers mostly RCF ones since they where considered the best in my region back then. Replaced mostly in clubs at friday or saturday night, remember back 30/20 years ago drivers were not the quality they have now, and also not much on the limiting tools to protect speakers.

Weekly job, just Pull speakon, remove grill, get out drivers from sub, put in new drivers, put on grill, put in speakon, boem war volume. During the week replace recones. test if good, rinse repeat. :wrench: :D
 
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Pros and Cons

grats for the Job

Thank you Sir! :)


Hi MMJ, a single driver version for Super Planar Top would worth?

Sure! A single driver version can be made to work , and would be worthwhile ... I would expect that the dispersion would get narrow and start to beam if used all the way up into the upper midrange (just like it would with a direct radiating 10" , 12" or 15") ..... So you would want to have a lower crossover point or set it up as a 3-way ...... We have discussed a couple of possibilities for improving dispersion in a single driver Super Planar top cab but the only ones that have been built and put into service are the dual driver versions of the tops ......................... We do have many single driver subs though ...


Could you check and also plot frequency response comparison versus vented box for the same driver?

With the Super Planar tops there are significant gains in efficiency and output to be made over a bass reflex cabinet but that extra performance comes at a cost, the Super Planar top will be much larger, perhaps twice the size, maybe more..... So there are pros and cons.... We just have to choose our compromises..... "There is no free lunch" as they say ... . We are paying a lot for our "lunch" ;)

Freddi , has posted some great comparisons between some of our recent designs and other horn and bandpass designs ... None of those are simple reflex cabinets though ..

Using Hornresp would not be a good way to compare simple reflex cabinet to high performance quarterwave cabinets because the curve for the reflex will be optimistic and the difference between the two cabinets will be understated (especially the case at full power where port compression is coming into play) ...........

I have been disappointed by enough reflex boxes and impressed with enough quarterwave cabinets to know how this goes ...

A small ported (reflex) cabinet just won't compete with a much larger well designed quarterwave cabinet (using the same driver and tuning).... Unfortunately there are times when 2x (or more) the bulk plus much increased complexity & weight makes the high performance cabinet impractical, so in that case you fall back to simpler and smaller options if the application calls for it ....... Otherwise if weight, size and complexity aren't an issue then you should definitely GO BIG for a BIG sound! , it is worth it!:happy2:
 
Another Paraflex sketch

FAITAL PARAFLEX sounds like a serious condition! Hehehe:clown:

Someone wanted me to create a Paraflex sketch for a Faital Pro 18HP1030 , unfortunately the motor in that driver isn't quite strong enough to get the cabinet size down unless the tuning is raised .... The tuning on this one is around 34hz ..

The width on the cabinet can be reduced quite a lot if you have a strong enough driver ..... We could certainly trim a few inches off of the width with the B&C 18SW115 , and then we could trim a few more inches off of the width if going with the 18DS115 ....

An iPAL 18 or 21 could even be hosted in this thing! ..

Dual 10" sub drivers (with appropriate parameters) could be loaded into this cabinet, and so could a pair of 12" drivers with a small adjustment ...

GKH's 15LB100 could also be loaded into this cabinet if it is made very narrow, around 17"-ish wide (outer) works...... With this tuning it might be exactly what GKH was looking for :)

You could say this cabinet is somewhat compromised because i went with the 2:1 CSA ratio for the purpose of reducing the cabinet size ............. For stronger drivers we could increase the CSA ratio to 3:1 or even a little more in order to improve the performance ......... Also to further increase efficiency and maximum output the fundamental tuning can be moved up to 40hz , it is an option if your musical tastes don't require as much bass extension (only tune as low as you need to, and no lower) ..

I didn't include bracing in this sketch but bracing should definitely be used in this cabinet (you can see how it is used in other Super Planar cabinets by referring to the examples in post #1)

Faital_Paraflex_horn_subwoofer_34hz_metric_18mm_ply_with_inputs.png
 
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The S3 S4 issue with the Paraflex

I think we went over this before, but how are you calculating L34 with the jump from S3 to S4?

BP1fan ,

Freddi asked about that just recently... ... My response is at post #610


"the S3-S4 flare is approximated with an abrupt expansion in the cabinet (if we are going with all 90 degree angles to keep it simple) .. .So it is not exact, but it works .... If we had one more segment in Hornresp then the simulation could follow the cabinet more closely in the S3-S4 section (in TH mode with a Paraflex that is, but it is not a problem in OD mode when modeling the Super Planar 8th , and also not a problem with a ROAR in TH mode because a ROAR's "Tap" is placed right at the abrupt expansion , as opposed to further down the line like we have with the Paraflex) . .. "
 
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UPDATE (added width and driver options)

Update on the sketch from post #633

Added many width options with appropriate drivers at the bottom .... Versatile...

GKH , your 15LB100 is included here :) 34hz-ish tuning ... Lower than ideal but it works with
a general rising response and a gentle rolloff on the bottom... Should make a nice multi purpose sub .......
If you would like the higher performance model (for PA) we could adjust this to give you a 3:1 CSA ratio and 40hz tuning for higher efficiency and output with the sacrifice of some extension .....


NOTE: the drivers in the 65cm column could be put into a 61cm width cabinet , it just moves the F3 up by a small amount .....



Faital_Paraflex_horn_subwoofer_34hz_metric_18mm_ply_with_inputs.png
 
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Hey thanks!

I tried to sim it with x=43,6cm from your first sketch and came up with this (see attachment).
And no, this sub isn't intended for PA, it's, as you said, to be used muli-purpose: for my living room/office, for small parties in my favourite watering hole, ...
 

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You are welcome Gerald! :happy2:

The Hornresp inputs shown are for the 84cm width cabinet .... Your CSAs are all 51.25% of the CSA figures shown in those inputs .... So just multiply the S1 through S5 CSAs by .5125 to get the right figures for your cabinet =) Also be sure to activate "Lossy Le" mode for more realistic results ..
 
Hi, I am a little confused what you see as 'width' If we take the 'standard' approach to measurement of dimensions:Height X Width X Depth.

The viewpont is the speaker layout flat on the side with front facing us. For a more accurate representation you should use two aspect views of the design. Top view and front view.

I presume the Height of the cabinet being [X] dynamic according to the speaker sizes used. The Width being 965mm and Depth being 900mm.

TB46 (Oliver) was a master in making really nice views of designs. I sure miss him and his skills. I am starting to learn free-cad in my spare time. But learning curve is pretty high. 34 years ago I had my graphical education and learned to make technical drawings on these things:

000001747472_1.jpg


Then abandoning what I have learned after my education and starting my music career as producer and working as roadie/rigger/light opperator and technical repair by a sound and light company in Rotterdam late 89 and early 90s. In my spare time i was building car audio crazyness with my brother in my dads car (test subject). that started my interest in enclosure designs, did a few IASCA-NL competitions back then. Although it started much earlier by modifying my dads speakers on the age of 10 to make them sound 'better'.

;)
 
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