Cheers!
Here's to an enjoyable summer for all.
Note: I only asked because I have spent some time in a particular Canadian province that has a lack of lake acres and a high per capita income.
Hmmm sounds like Alberta to me. Wait for this summer. The lake acres will be the same but I have a feeling that the per capita income will be significantly different.
First of all thanks for the help. Maybe only 5 minutes for you but I appreciate it.
I want to make sure I am understanding your concept correctly. Are you thinking something like the attached picture? Rear volume vented through long slot port, front of the woofers firing directly into their own slot.
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Yes it was expensive. In it's defense I never really set it up to succeed. I still believe they are excellent drivers but I had it in its minimal sized sealed enclosure (or slightly smaller!) and then the whole box was placed in a storage locker that had a single 10 inch vent into the cabin. There was quite a bit of shaking in the boat but not much sound. The woofer eventually gave up.
Thank you *very* much for doing this. I am going to listen to this again tonight on a decent set of headphones to get a accurate representation.
So if I understand correctly this track has very little content lower than 40hz right? Somewhere between 10 and 20dB lower at 30Hz than at 40Hz correct?
Kinda but not really. More like the pic in the attachment. See how the the slot the woofers fire into is tiny? It only has to be big enough to control velocity. That whole top board would be removable so you can get the drivers in and out. The slot opening is tiny so there is good moisture protection.
The drawing is not 100 percent related to the sim I showed, the Lrc in the sim is too short to match this drawing (and I masked chamber resonances in the sim) but there's a bunch of ways to lay this out and if you get creative you can make just about anything work. It is absolutely essential that the sim match the layout you choose, Lrc HAS to be correct and chamber resonance cannot be masked or the sim won't match the final product. I didn't know exactly how it would be best laid out (your largest box shape is not a perfect rectangle) and I didn't want to spend more than 5 minutes, so with the sim I provided what you see is what you get, and it doesn't match this drawing exactly.
I would suggest playing with several different layouts and completely different alignments in Hornresp first before deciding on any given design though.
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Didn't figure out how to insert images so I'll give you the dropbox link to a few screens from spectrum analyzing 4 techno tracks and one dubstep track.
Calypso is dubstep, the rest is techno.
Hope it helps for you to figure out how low you want to go
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/vo6owdavyzke2xj/AABrvPyi6b0D0yFNLw9JVvSda?dl=0
Calypso is dubstep, the rest is techno.
Hope it helps for you to figure out how low you want to go
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/vo6owdavyzke2xj/AABrvPyi6b0D0yFNLw9JVvSda?dl=0
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Download Audacity and run your favorite tracks through it.
I don't have Audacity or any music on the computer I'm on but here's a pic of some tracks I analyzed in the past. Top pic is "Get Low", a rappy type tune by Lil Jon with a simple 2 note bassline. Bottom track is "Bass I Love You", which you probably won't be playing out on the lake, but I'm not going to edit the pic just so you don't have to see it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Here's another pic I did a long time ago, the top track is Van Halen "Jump". Classic rock doesn't have any bass. The bottom two tracks are car audio system bass cd tracks. Again, not going to edit the pic so you don't have to see them.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Hunter by Kaiju, a track that Sine introduced to us. As he has pointed out, when low passed this track is the equivalent of a steady sine wave through most of it's duration.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
I haven't analyzed any tracks lately but as I mentioned Royals by Lorde has a 20 hz bassline (if the rumors are true) and this is the direction all new music is going, especially in the genres you are interested in. With a 50 hz tuning the Van Halen track would sound pretty awesome but everything else here would be pretty sucky and disappointing, the entire bass line would be missing.
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Can't see any of the pictures. Not sure if it's a problem on my end but I doubt it. I can copy and paste the addresses into my browser and see them that way but that's a bit of a pain.
The problem with analyzing tracks this way (by looking at pictures) is that you have to then find the track and play it to correlate the picture to the sound, and if you don't play it on a system that can reproduce the lowest notes you'll never know what it was supposed to sound like in the first place, so unless you have a very capable sub system already you won't know what you are missing. You might think the lowest notes are not that important because you never actually heard them. In my experience, with the music I like, it's important to get down to 27 hz with flat response.
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It was not on your end, I could not figure out how to insert the images so I simply linked to the dropbox folder. Can you see them in there?
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The track name is in the cubase project track(easy to find on youtube).
The good thing with techno is that the bass is very repetative, making these pictures quite accurate. Dubstep is harder however as the bass notes change much more regularly and the pitch and frequency of the bass frequencies goes up and down with it.
Thanks. This does help. I have attached the pictures in case others in the future are interested.
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Those plots are interesting and it is funny that you mention "Get Low", that is the song that was playing when my JL Audio 13w6v2 finally gave up.
I will download Audacity and spend some time with it. Do you know of an app that will let me actually artificially high pass a track and select the F3 of the filter? It is one thing to look a these pictures and realize there is content below 40Hz but it is another to know how the track would sound without that content being reproduced.
Audacity. It has a high pass feature, you can select the frequency and rolloff. I've never played with it so I don't know if you can do it on the fly, or even how accurate it is, but give it a shot.
http://manual.audacityteam.org/o/man/high_pass_filter.html
I was pushing 140+db in my last car system with Planet Audio BB1250.1 amp and dual 12 inch Kicker W7 (Kijiji package deal $300 all in) in a large ported box tuned to 30 (and flat to 30, not the junk box recommendation Kicker gives). That was with the car off, NOT running, and the battery was just a bit bigger than the battery in my lawnmower. (Chev Cavalier.)
I didn't bother adding more or larger batteries, the car already rattled like it was going to fall apart.
Of course a car is a lot different than an open boat but I'll go for the 30 or lower tuning every time regardless of how much power is available. If there's not enough power add more batteries and amps. I just showed a sim that says these driver can do 124 db (minus power and port compression), that should be plenty loud enough, and it shouldn't be any kind of trouble providing them with power. I wouldn't shoot for 20 hz but I absolutely wouldn't go any higher than 30.
Yeah, it will be loud if you stick your head in the subwoofer box. At the end of a ski rope you can have a 12" clattering against the backplate and you'll barely be able to hear it over the engine. Subtract about 45dB from 'peak calculated' SPL to get real world in open space at 100 feet. A ski rope is 35 to 70, depending on how good you are . Shorter and it's harder to get around bouys or get much air. Without more cubic footage to work with, you'll probably have to compromise on extension.
. Shorter and it's harder to get around bouys or get much air. Without more cubic footage to work with, you'll probably have to compromise on extension.Thanks for the insight guys. I think I am beginning to think I should aim for a lower tuning. My last fear is that even though the box can hit low it will be lost in an open environment, and I will be left throwing watts at another boat shaker. Add the wind noise when moving and really how much low bass are we going to be able to hear?
I have never heard a good sub system in a boat period. It makes me think that a different approach is needed. eg. Trade some low frequency extension in for louder (somewhat higher) bass that can actually be heard.
I have never heard a good sub system in a boat period. It makes me think that a different approach is needed. eg. Trade some low frequency extension in for louder (somewhat higher) bass that can actually be heard.