Go Back   Home > Forums > >
Home Forums Rules Articles diyAudio Store Blogs Gallery Wiki Register Donations FAQ Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Othorn vs XOC Th118 comparison for fun.
Othorn vs XOC Th118 comparison for fun.
Please consider donating to help us continue to serve you.

Ads on/off / Custom Title / More PMs / More album space / Advanced printing & mass image saving
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 26th February 2015, 07:08 PM   #11
Xoc1 is offline Xoc1  United Kingdom
diyAudio Member
 
Xoc1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Devon UK
An unbiased comparison would be very welcome.
The TH18 was never intended to be a DSL clone, and at the time I drew it up the internal structure of the Danley TH118 was completely unknown to me. Living in Devon, UK I still have never even seen a Danley PA System!
The TH18 has exceeded all my original design intentions which were for a 1KW bass cab.
I wish that the TH18 was not such a close clone of the Danley design as I feel this has stifled development of the design in the public domain. IE I feel wary about posting an updated version with a cone correcting Vee shape above the baffle.
Making the TH18 the same size as the TH118 was a mistake. Mostly because the TH118 is really a TH115 with an 18" driver shoehorned into it!
I would like to know what the effect is of double panel bracing around the mouth and adding a grille are, as I suspect that they would be beneficial to the lower end response of the speaker.
I wonder if the success of the TH18 is down to my concise documentation rather than any performance advantage!
Regards Martin (Xoc1)
  Reply With Quote
Old 26th February 2015, 09:00 PM   #12
Zwiller is offline Zwiller  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Sandusky, OH
Martin, no doubt your concise documentation is the real reason behind the success of the design and I should apologize for calling it what I did. I admire and respect your decision to not publish the cone correction.
  Reply With Quote
Old 26th February 2015, 10:28 PM   #13
Alethia123 is offline Alethia123
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Austin, Texas.
Hey martin. Killer design, thank you! Ya man, I feel you on never having the pleasure of hearing a danley system we built the othorn and your design and we still have never heard a single danley product or any other tapped / synergy horns for that matter. I desperately want to.

I finally am getting over my hornresp phobia thanks in part to this CAD class Im taking, kinda conneced alot of concepts together for me. So hopefully I will have something to offer soon as well! Ill tell you what this whole world can be extremely mystifying from an outsider looking to learn. Math, Physics, Woodworking, Electronics, Acoustics, Hornresp, Technical 3d Drafting.... Some times I am just like "what the heck am I supposed to study today?"

After playing with them both I feel like the perfect sub in my mind would be like right in the middle of the extension of the xoc1TH18 and the Othorn. For a lot of applications the othorn just doesn't really make sense, where the xoc1th18 does and vice versa. I am tempted to try a regular folded bass horn ("front loaded" would be the term?) but I get scared of the need for numbers to get low extension and size.

I've been trying to discern where the advantage level on the "useable output vs number of units coupled" flips between tapped and folded horn. For instance at what quantity does it become more advantageous to use a fold horn design over a tapped. I guess driver for driver may not be fair because some may be better in a TH vs a folded, but I guess in dollar for dollar. Then I try and add in quality and accuracy into the equation, and then I realize I should probably just keep reading and learning because I cant answer that for myself lol.
  Reply With Quote
Old 26th February 2015, 10:43 PM   #14
sine143 is offline sine143  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
this is literally based on hearsay (I have no scientific evidence of it)

but "i've been told" :
'A 1/4 wavlength horn with fc of 30hz will achieve maximum sensitivity (for the given flare) below the 1/2 wavelength frequency when mouth area approaches and exceeds 40 sq feet'

with a slower flare FLH (smaller mouth for given horn length) you can force a bit of a lower corner out of any giving horn length, at the expense of efficiency.
  Reply With Quote
Old 27th February 2015, 12:40 AM   #15
ErnieM is offline ErnieM  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Fresno, CA
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alethia123 View Post
After playing with them both I feel like the perfect sub in my mind would be like right in the middle of the extension of the xoc1TH18 and the Othorn. For a lot of applications the othorn just doesn't really make sense, where the xoc1th18 does and vice versa. I am tempted to try a regular folded bass horn ("front loaded" would be the term?) but I get scared of the need for numbers to get low extension and size.
You might want to look at the keystone thread. Art mentions that you can trade off a little sensitivity for more extension by making one dimension longer. Easier than designing from the ground up and the design is comparatively simple.

Last edited by ErnieM; 27th February 2015 at 12:42 AM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 27th February 2015, 12:56 PM   #16
Zwiller is offline Zwiller  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Sandusky, OH
B&C 18SW115 XOC shaded vs. Keystone in black @ 1W.

Truthfully the OTHORN trounces both on paper but as you allude to, size, weight, power needs, and cost are all factors. Then there's the LABhorn with more of the same problems, plus you need multiples to get the extension. I recall you need 8.

I was fortunate that Art took an interest in my threads and here is a post of his thoughts which highlight some relevant info: (snip)

The reason I designed the Keystone was to get more output from the same truck space. Using the same power (Crest CA-9), and one BC18SW115-4 (bridged mono) compared to 4 Lab 12 (two per side of the amp) in dual ported enclosures, the Keystone outperforms them in every regard.
As a reference, the four dual Lab 12 had more output at 40 Hz than eight dual 18" Meyer HP650.

The price increase of the neo driver now would make me choose the BCTBW100, only slightly less (ultimate) output than the BC18SW115 for a lot less money.

The Lab 12 loaded Pal12 is a nice "bite size" cabinet, but the big gun B&C 18s" are simply way better drivers, and a single 18" Keystone is lighter, easier to build, and 21.5% less truck space (15.52 cubic feet compared to 19.79) than a pair of PAL12.

Art(end)

I think the Keystone really fits the bill of what you want and it's worth the investment in sawdust and time to see for yourself. You already have the driver...
Attached Images
File Type: png XOC v KS.png (62.5 KB, 719 views)
  Reply With Quote
Old 27th February 2015, 04:45 PM   #17
sine143 is offline sine143  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
The Sim is not all that accurate for the keystone
  Reply With Quote
Old 27th February 2015, 07:21 PM   #18
Zwiller is offline Zwiller  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Sandusky, OH
I won't disagree with that but I don't recall many tests posted of the XOC either. That said, I have not studied the XOC thread. In the interests of full disclosure, I plan to someday build the XOC and decide for myself, which is the spirit of this thread.
  Reply With Quote
Old 27th February 2015, 07:53 PM   #19
zettairyouiki is offline zettairyouiki  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
This is what I have on record for the keystone. It matches pretty well with Art's measurements.
Attached Images
File Type: png keystone.png (40.4 KB, 657 views)
  Reply With Quote
Old 27th February 2015, 07:59 PM   #20
sine143 is offline sine143  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
looks more like what I remember, and more like what arts measurments are (and pretty much the exact same as the xoc th18)
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Othorn vs XOC Th118 comparison for fun.Hide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
The Othorn tapped horn Josh Ricci Subwoofers 460 15th July 2018 12:08 PM
Dual Othorn / Dual modified F215AN Build Log Summary Alethia123 Subwoofers 62 17th September 2014 12:59 PM
PSU Comparison phase PC Based 1 10th February 2014 12:12 PM
tweeter Comparison montana Multi-Way 0 31st October 2007 08:38 PM
device comparison name773 Solid State 1 1st August 2003 09:11 PM


New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 05:15 AM.


Search Engine Optimisation provided by DragonByte SEO (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Resources saved on this page: MySQL 14.29%
vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright ©1999-2018 diyAudio
Wiki