Hi all,
got a question for the gurus here...
i have a THT LP subwoofer that has about a 12' throat. when setting the distance for HT processing, i have it set up as my distance from the seat to the mouth plus 12' and the phase WAS at about 90 degrees. recently i played with the phase and it's currently at 270 degrees and sounds much cleaner and deeper than before. is the distance set up correctly, and what is going on with the phase? at first i thought i could decrease distance and decrease phase, but my gut tells me that's two separate adjustments.
any advice/input?
thanks,
Scott
got a question for the gurus here...
i have a THT LP subwoofer that has about a 12' throat. when setting the distance for HT processing, i have it set up as my distance from the seat to the mouth plus 12' and the phase WAS at about 90 degrees. recently i played with the phase and it's currently at 270 degrees and sounds much cleaner and deeper than before. is the distance set up correctly, and what is going on with the phase? at first i thought i could decrease distance and decrease phase, but my gut tells me that's two separate adjustments.
any advice/input?
thanks,
Scott
Scott,
1)Don't know if you are having a "Spinal Tap" moment, but a 12 foot throat is a bizarre kettle of fish.
2) Who knows.
3) Yes.
Art G. (Guru) Welter
Hi Scott,
Provided that the 'Distances' are set correctly for the Main Speakers and the Sub, i.e. the distance dependent Excess Phases are removed: then both Mains are considered to return a ~zero Ref. Phase at the chosen XO frequency.
If the Sub is still 90 degree off:
A 270 degree Phase shift is equal to a – 90degree shift, so when adding this to the Sub(+90) the sum will be in-Phase with the Mains(+90-90=0) but obviously 180degree is lost at the XO frequency= the Time for a Half XO Wavelength.
If the XO is at 80 Hz then a Half Wave Length is ~344/(2×80)= 2.15 m.
This length corresponds to a 'Time loss' of 2.15/344 = ~6.25 m-Sec.
If a Sub is Signal-Delayed or advancing less than ~10 m-Sec in respect to the Mains:
The Ears and the Brain combination fuzes all the Signals to one single time event.
IMO, Looks like your Phase/Distance Settings are OK.
b
thanks guys!
Art:
it's a front loaded folded horn, so the path from driver to exit is about 12', but i'm not 100% sure on the length. is that looking at it incorrectly? maybe just look at the exit as the distance? and i LOVE spinal tap
B:
thanks, i did some reading and what you say makes sense. i've got a new AVR coming today (Anthem with ARC). and i think i'll set the phase to 0 and adjust the distances. if things are a bit hinky, i can fine-tune with phase.
cheers all and thanks again!
Scott
Art:
it's a front loaded folded horn, so the path from driver to exit is about 12', but i'm not 100% sure on the length. is that looking at it incorrectly? maybe just look at the exit as the distance? and i LOVE spinal tap
B:
thanks, i did some reading and what you say makes sense. i've got a new AVR coming today (Anthem with ARC). and i think i'll set the phase to 0 and adjust the distances. if things are a bit hinky, i can fine-tune with phase.
cheers all and thanks again!
Scott
My speakers, including a Klipschorn bass, are kind of spread around the room. My experience, until recently when I got time-shifting ability with a Behringer DCX2496 DSP crossover, was that phase was purely a matter of taste since in-phase and out-phone had separate loudness bumps and dips without a clear winner (meaning complex additions and subtractions around the room... like you'd expect when you take your attention off your sim program).
With big time-shift ability, I could shift big time. But soon found that a tape measure is only a rough guide (and also digital gear introduces time delays too).
When done shifting the Klipschorn timing (or more exactly, moving my ESL panels WAY back to where the Klipsch sound originates), my well-loved percussion music (Steve Reich kind of stuff) was clearly sharper and well-worth the effort.
Ben
With big time-shift ability, I could shift big time. But soon found that a tape measure is only a rough guide (and also digital gear introduces time delays too).
When done shifting the Klipschorn timing (or more exactly, moving my ESL panels WAY back to where the Klipsch sound originates), my well-loved percussion music (Steve Reich kind of stuff) was clearly sharper and well-worth the effort.
Ben
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