Im going to be ordering 2 12" brahmas soon and im just wondering if theres going to be any difference in quality (musicality wise), if i go ported instead of sealed.
Also to power them im going to get a pa amp, found 2 around the price i want to spend.
Crown XLS602 and the Crown CE1000. What difference is there between these 2 amps other than that the XLS602 has a fair bit more power, does the CE1000 sound better ? If anyone could suggest a better amp for the price please tell me
posty.
Also to power them im going to get a pa amp, found 2 around the price i want to spend.
Crown XLS602 and the Crown CE1000. What difference is there between these 2 amps other than that the XLS602 has a fair bit more power, does the CE1000 sound better ? If anyone could suggest a better amp for the price please tell me
posty.
I agree with markp, we need more info.
All other things being equal, sealed ought to sound best. However, things are rarely equal.
For starters, is this going in your home? I would assume so given choice of amplifier. I would strongly suggest looking at the other Adire drivers, if so. To get the most efficiency out of them, you will want to wire the coils in parallel, but that puts you at one ohm, a hellish load for any amplifier. Also, the Brahma series was primarily designed with the car audio environment in mind, thus they have notably higher Fs than most 'home' drivers, and as such, any kind of enclosure will have a much higher F3. In the case of the Brahma 12, lowest sealed F3 will be 46Hz. While that could work if you have a small room, in a large room, you may want more extension.
If this is for home use, I would seriously consider using a single Tumult instead. It will move slightly more air than two 12" Brahmas, but play much deeper, and cost about $250 less. If you really need stereo subs, I would consider two Tempests, unless box size is your primary concern, then the Tumult is the way to go.
Whether or not sealed or ported works best for you depends in no small amount of the room in which the sub will be playing. I am doing ported designs lately because I like how you can tailor the response curve more easily to fit your needs, and my listening room doesn't mind the extension. The last place I lived could not have handled the kind of extension my sub provides, it would have sounded boomy as hell regardless of box type, unless I had done some serious equalization.
Aaron Gilbert
All other things being equal, sealed ought to sound best. However, things are rarely equal.
For starters, is this going in your home? I would assume so given choice of amplifier. I would strongly suggest looking at the other Adire drivers, if so. To get the most efficiency out of them, you will want to wire the coils in parallel, but that puts you at one ohm, a hellish load for any amplifier. Also, the Brahma series was primarily designed with the car audio environment in mind, thus they have notably higher Fs than most 'home' drivers, and as such, any kind of enclosure will have a much higher F3. In the case of the Brahma 12, lowest sealed F3 will be 46Hz. While that could work if you have a small room, in a large room, you may want more extension.
If this is for home use, I would seriously consider using a single Tumult instead. It will move slightly more air than two 12" Brahmas, but play much deeper, and cost about $250 less. If you really need stereo subs, I would consider two Tempests, unless box size is your primary concern, then the Tumult is the way to go.
Whether or not sealed or ported works best for you depends in no small amount of the room in which the sub will be playing. I am doing ported designs lately because I like how you can tailor the response curve more easily to fit your needs, and my listening room doesn't mind the extension. The last place I lived could not have handled the kind of extension my sub provides, it would have sounded boomy as hell regardless of box type, unless I had done some serious equalization.
Aaron Gilbert
I agree with Aaron about the Brahma. There are better choices for home subs. After having built subs using the Shiva, Tempest and DPL12 there is no doubt in my mind that, of those three, the best driver for music is the DPL12. Placed in a relatively small sealed cabinet with the amp of your choice it plays nice tight balanced bass. You can buy two of them for much less than a single Tumult for stereo bass. That would be an excellent setup!
Adidas cross training shoes are the best and so are sealed subs 
.
No one will be able to answer the first part of your question, it comes down to personal preference. Maybe you were referring to only those specific subs as oppose to other subs when ported vs sealed. I personally don't like to listen to ported subs, musically they sound worst than ported. And I have found that 15's almost always sound better than similar 12's to me.
. No one will be able to answer the first part of your question, it comes down to personal preference. Maybe you were referring to only those specific subs as oppose to other subs when ported vs sealed
. I personally don't like to listen to ported subs, musically they sound worst than ported. And I have found that 15's almost always sound better than similar 12's to me.
My Nike Airs have served me well for years. If it was me, and I know it's not, I would buy two DPL12s for less than the price of one Brahma and put it in separate sealed 75 liter enclosures. You can run the numbers in WinISD (or your program of choice) and draw your own conclusion. Just my $0.0261950 (converted to AUD).
What do you consider reasonable?
Ultrachrome,
Given that the DPL12's play 84dB with one watt, 100w will get you to 104dB. That's pretty loud, although as far as bass goes, not groundbreaking (no pun intended). Oh, I just noted you said 100w/channel. Unless your amp will handle four ohm load when bridged, you can run one channel to each voice coil. So 200w will get you to 107dB. You may start to run into excursion limits before your amp gives out, or not, depending on your tastes and your room size.
Aaron Gilbert
Ultrachrome,
Given that the DPL12's play 84dB with one watt, 100w will get you to 104dB. That's pretty loud, although as far as bass goes, not groundbreaking (no pun intended). Oh, I just noted you said 100w/channel. Unless your amp will handle four ohm load when bridged, you can run one channel to each voice coil. So 200w will get you to 107dB. You may start to run into excursion limits before your amp gives out, or not, depending on your tastes and your room size.
Aaron Gilbert
sreten's recommendation is for the Brahma. Different driver, different enclosure. A vented enclosure for the DPL12 will be on the order of 145 liters tuned to 16.4 Hz. I've used the DPL12 in a sealed enclosure with a rated 100w@8ohm (the driver was wired for 4 ohm) and it's plenty loud. Given that a vented enclosure is generally more efficient it should be enough.ultrachrome said:
postman said:
Crown XLS602 and the Crown CE1000. What difference is there between these 2 amps other than that the XLS602 has a fair bit more power, does the CE1000 sound better ? If anyone could suggest a better amp for the price please tell me
posty.
Both amplifiers are Crown's Low Line Series. The XL 602
should sound better than the CE 1000 due to having
ruffly 200 watts more than the CE 1000 (In 8, and, 4 ohms)
By better sounding, I'm reffering to Headroom.
A Better amp would be a used Microtech which is a
Macrotech without all the bells and whistles.
One nice thing about XBL^2 is that you can think of it as brute-force for keeping the cone behaving...
While you can't fix the slight "smearing" due to the port/subwoofer being inherently out of phase a tad, the XBL^2 subs generally all sound better in ported boxes than their EBP or Qts would lend you to think they would be.
In a "normal" ported box, the XBL^2 woofers even sound nicer even than most subs that have higher EBP's or lower Qts's.
Constant cone control and low inductance is a good thing.
While you can't fix the slight "smearing" due to the port/subwoofer being inherently out of phase a tad, the XBL^2 subs generally all sound better in ported boxes than their EBP or Qts would lend you to think they would be.
In a "normal" ported box, the XBL^2 woofers even sound nicer even than most subs that have higher EBP's or lower Qts's.
Constant cone control and low inductance is a good thing.
Hmmm maybe i should be getting 2 tempests then. I was really hoping for some non massive boxes, and to have stereo subs, but i guess i cant have best of both worlds. And yes when i said is ported better than sealed i was reffering to the brahma specifically.
Is there any reason why the Crown CE1000 has a $100 extra price tag over its XLS line equivalent ?
How much do these microtech amps cost ? And where can they be purchased from ?
Thanks for all the help so far
Is there any reason why the Crown CE1000 has a $100 extra price tag over its XLS line equivalent ?
How much do these microtech amps cost ? And where can they be purchased from ?
Thanks for all the help so far
Postman.
I don't know ho much the CE 1000 cost, nor the XLS 602.
I do know that a Microtech 2400 new cost around $800.
A used one is around $5 - $600 Gotta keep in mind that
the Microtech Series is the original touring amp from Crown.
If you are using this amp for your home, get the XLS 602.
I don't know ho much the CE 1000 cost, nor the XLS 602.
I do know that a Microtech 2400 new cost around $800.
A used one is around $5 - $600 Gotta keep in mind that
the Microtech Series is the original touring amp from Crown.
If you are using this amp for your home, get the XLS 602.
I fully agree with Omnifex about the MicroTech amp. These things sound MUCH better than the CE and the XLS amps. If you have to choose between the CE and the XLS, go with the CE. It is built better snd sound a little bit better. If you need the extra power, go with the CE2000. Either way, stay away from the XLS. In my opinion, any Crown amp series below the CE shouldn't have the Crown name on it. If you can save a little longer, check out the K1 or K2. These work great in home theater systems due to the fact that they don't have fans, and they draw much less current than other Crown models. I've sold a great many K series amps to people for home theaters, and everyone who has purchased one has been very happy.
Cheers,
Zach
Cheers,
Zach
Im not looking to spend alot of money on a amp at this time. So now your saying that i should go with the CE is it going to sound any different (compared to the XLS) at all considering its going to be used to run subwoofers not full range sound ?
The k1 amp produces the same power as the XLS602 but is over double the price :\
If anyone can suggest a better amp for under $500US new tell me.
The k1 amp produces the same power as the XLS602 but is over double the price :\
If anyone can suggest a better amp for under $500US new tell me.
Do you have something against a used amp.
I've read too many horror stories on the CE 1000, and,
CE 2000 (In PA World) so, I wouldn't touch it.
For $500, you can get a used Crown PSA 2,
Microtech 1200, or, Macrotech 1200.
These amps have been track tested and, are bulletproof,
in terms of performance for decades.
The only CE that has a good reputation is the CE 4000.
Which has the same topology as the K Series
The CE 2000, and, CE 1000 are different beast, and,
would pick any of the used Crowns I listed on Ebay
than these two models.
Just my 2 cents...........
I've read too many horror stories on the CE 1000, and,
CE 2000 (In PA World) so, I wouldn't touch it.
For $500, you can get a used Crown PSA 2,
Microtech 1200, or, Macrotech 1200.
These amps have been track tested and, are bulletproof,
in terms of performance for decades.
The only CE that has a good reputation is the CE 4000.
Which has the same topology as the K Series
The CE 2000, and, CE 1000 are different beast, and,
would pick any of the used Crowns I listed on Ebay
than these two models.
Just my 2 cents...........
Omni-
The CE's do have problems in the PA world, namely the fans stop working causing the amp to overheat. While this does happen in the PA world, I've yet to have one returned when used for home theater.
Tha's a great suggestion to pick up a used Crown MT1200. You can find them used for under $500 US if you look around a little bit.
Cheers,
Zach
The CE's do have problems in the PA world, namely the fans stop working causing the amp to overheat. While this does happen in the PA world, I've yet to have one returned when used for home theater.
Tha's a great suggestion to pick up a used Crown MT1200. You can find them used for under $500 US if you look around a little bit.
Cheers,
Zach
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