What frequency are w bins designed for - diyAudio
Go Back   Home > Forums > Loudspeakers > Subwoofers

Please consider donating to help us continue to serve you.

Ads on/off / Custom Title / More PMs / More album space / Advanced printing & mass image saving
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 11th June 2014, 12:47 AM   #1
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Default What frequency are w bins designed for

Hey guys, firstly Ive learned so much reading through this thread about subs and its helping me decide what type of subs to get because there are so many types to choose from, Cheers.
Im a Dj and use 2x dual 15"+ cd tops and 2x 18" w bins, i recently bought a Behringer cx2310 c/o and it seems they play better(louder) around 120hz and below.
So are they designed for 50hz and above? when they play lower frequencies my amp clips and turns off! for the size of them you'd think they'd shake shake everything to bits lol.

W bins 18" Beyma GT400, 300w
Amp QSC RMX1450 1400w @ 4ohms
  Reply With Quote
Old 11th June 2014, 01:52 AM   #2
expert in tautology
diyAudio Member
 
bear's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: New York State USA
"W" bins are not "designed" for any frequency in particular. It's just a convenient way to *fold* a bass horn. Beyond that the actual dimensions, mouth size, and flare rate are a few of the determining factors. The selection of a proper driver has an effect as well.

Fwiw, with 300w drivers, you can't run 1400watts into them for very long without overheating the voice coils. Assuming they are in parallel you can run 600watts or 300w per driver, while in series you can still only run 300watts per driver. You can't exceed the power rating of any driver.

In general larger size horns (regardless of configuration) will do lower in frequency. An exception is where you use multiple truncated (mouth too small) and identical horns arrayed together so that the effective size of the mouth is increased - and/or they are run against the floor, floor/corner boundaries (making the effective mouth size larger).

_-_-
__________________
_-_-bear
http://www.bearlabs.com -- Btw, I don't actually know anything, FYI -- [...2SJ74 Toshiba bogus asian parts - beware! ]
  Reply With Quote
Old 11th June 2014, 01:59 AM   #3
diyAudio Member
 
Inductor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Cascais
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alkismurf View Post
...when they play lower frequencies my amp clips and turns off!

W bins 18" Beyma GT400, 300w
Amp QSC RMX1450 1400w @ 4ohms
Hummm!
Do you have one driver in each enclosure?
(My first guess would be an impedance problem or amp not impedance stable, amp can work with stereo 2 ohms outputs also.)
RMX1450 Power Amplifier ? QSC
Beyma 18 GT400
__________________
NEXT-proaudio Portugal
  Reply With Quote
Old 11th June 2014, 12:04 PM   #4
expert in tautology
diyAudio Member
 
bear's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: New York State USA
Guessing that the single amp powers at least the two types of bins listed... could be a source of impedance/phase angle issues that way.
__________________
_-_-bear
http://www.bearlabs.com -- Btw, I don't actually know anything, FYI -- [...2SJ74 Toshiba bogus asian parts - beware! ]
  Reply With Quote
Old 11th June 2014, 12:40 PM   #5
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by Inductor View Post
Hummm!
Do you have one driver in each enclosure?
(My first guess would be an impedance problem or amp not impedance stable, amp can work with stereo 2 ohms outputs also.)
RMX1450 Power Amplifier ? QSC
Beyma 18 GT400
Yes 1 driver per bin, im running them bridged into 1 channel, ill try them in stereo tomorrow and see how that goes and Ill let you guys know how it went, also there are no markings on the speakers and have matched them visually to beyma pics on the net so they could be a 4ohm version, heres a pic, also the terminals are at opposite sides.(more photos on photobucket)

Click the image to open in full size.
  Reply With Quote
Old 11th June 2014, 09:36 PM   #6
expert in tautology
diyAudio Member
 
bear's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: New York State USA
Take ur ohmeter and measure the DCR of the VC, the DCR is always slightly *lower* than the impedance.

For example if you get a 6.8ohm DCR, you likely have an 8 ohm speaker. So, if you have a DCR under 4 ohms, you have a 4 ohm speaker.

You did not say if the amp is running ONLY the "w" bins, or if it is running the "w" and the 15" cabinets too?

IF ur running the amp in bridged and you have the w bins in PARALLEL, then your impedance is likely too low for the amp to drive at full or nearly full output. You can still run in bridged, IF you switch to a SERIES connection so that the series impedance is DOUBLE the impedance of a single driver or "w bin".

Probably not much difference in max spl with either the series connection + bridged amp vs. parallel connection + "stereo" (two channel) operation.
__________________
_-_-bear
http://www.bearlabs.com -- Btw, I don't actually know anything, FYI -- [...2SJ74 Toshiba bogus asian parts - beware! ]
  Reply With Quote
Old 11th June 2014, 10:22 PM   #7
wg_ski is offline wg_ski  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alkismurf View Post
when they play lower frequencies my amp clips and turns off!
Amp QSC RMX1450 1400w @ 4ohms
Quote:
Originally Posted by bear View Post
Fwiw, with 300w drivers, you can't run 1400watts into them for very long without overheating the voice coils.
You can't run an RMX1450 at 1400 watts for very long either. It's not even a 1/3-duty-cycle-rated amp at 4 ohm bridge. That amp will shut down before it delivers enough average power to hurt the VCs. Excursion could still be a killer, though. At frequencies below where the horn has significant "gain" the impedance will tend to be low - the deeper the bass you try to feed them the worse the situation.
  Reply With Quote
Old 12th June 2014, 11:17 AM   #8
epa is offline epa  Netherlands
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: amsterdam
these beyma are 18 gt200
most w-bins sound ugly above 100hz,and because you run dual 15" tops,you might as wel cross in that area
you wil need a high pass filter on them,(depending on what model)~40 hz lr

w-bins are not the n1 choice nowadays.you better of bilding a th of the same size(or bigger) to get some more low end

edit/ 250watt rms asuming 500 watt aes.
ive had these myself ,weak cone ,x-max 6mm .
you might want to inspect the cones for folds/damage.
__________________
one good thing about music ,when it hit you feel no pain.
so hit me with music
. hr driver db

Last edited by epa; 12th June 2014 at 11:23 AM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 12th June 2014, 01:19 PM   #9
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by wg_ski View Post
You can't run an RMX1450 at 1400 watts for very long either. It's not even a 1/3-duty-cycle-rated amp at 4 ohm bridge. That amp will shut down before it delivers enough average power to hurt the VCs. Excursion could still be a killer, though. At frequencies below where the horn has significant "gain" the impedance will tend to be low - the deeper the bass you try to feed them the worse the situation.
Thats exactly what i was thinking, i can turn it on, play a song with low bass (40-60hz on the c/o) and it will shut off within a few seconds, raise the c/o fq to 100hz and it sounds like there's less stress on the driver which is why i asked what fq these played at,(also the "Excursion being a killer" i heard them bottom out and quickly turned them down, oops lol ) and yes the deeper bass and the amp cuts out, i thought the qsc rmx series was a good amp so im trying to figure out whats going on (maybe the amp needs a service?), i still have to run it in stereo so i still have some more testing to do.
  Reply With Quote
Old 12th June 2014, 01:27 PM   #10
wg_ski is offline wg_ski  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by epa View Post
w-bins are not the n1 choice nowadays.you better of bilding a th of the same size(or bigger) to get some more low end
W-style horns typically have a fast flare rate and a short path, which implies a high cutoff frequency. W-style folds are only space efficient if the flare rate is relatively fast, for slower expansion rates the snail shell does better. 50 to 60 Hz is pretty much all you get, and that's without the local excursion minimum typical of THs which will let you play a bit below the quarter wave frequency. Stacking them in parallel doesn't help the LF corner either - if the path is too short the path is too short.
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Hide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Klipschorn Bass bins duder1982 Swap Meet 6 22nd January 2014 01:14 AM
Help about Bass Bins Dzony988 Subwoofers 13 18th August 2011 01:40 PM
How to make Bass bins Jaminator Subwoofers 8 8th November 2007 11:24 PM
Selenium bins SG3525 Subwoofers 3 3rd November 2005 03:50 PM


New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 12:48 AM.


vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2015 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright 1999-2015 diyAudio

Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2