Difference between Super Scoop and Folded Horn Subwoofers - Page 7 - diyAudio
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Old 21st March 2013, 08:19 PM   #61
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Here's another pic. This design is much closer to the way DSL designs tapped horns, and much less like the way the typical DIY'er designs tapped horns.

The light grey line is a single tapped horn, the darker black line is a stack of 8 of the same horns.

As you can see, this one doesn't have the big hole in response as multiple cabs are added but the peak at 100 hz is still greatly reduced even in this design. This proves that the problem is not Hornresp, the problem is the design. And since most people don't design like Danley does, picking a random tapped horn design off the internet and stacking it in multiples isn't the best choice.

(You might argue that this response doesn't look like Danley's measured results, especially the peak at tuning, but if you add some stuffing to the throat and mouth areas this would measure with the exact same response curve shape as the TH-Spud and DTS-10.)
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Last edited by just a guy; 21st March 2013 at 08:37 PM.
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Old 21st March 2013, 08:39 PM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by just a guy View Post
The light grey line is a single tapped horn, the darker black line is a stack of 8 of the same horns.
The light grey line is not a simulation of a stack of 8 horns, it is a simulation of one circular exit of 8 times the area as one simulated cabinet.

To come close to that in half space, a stack of 8 would look something like the diagram below.

And the TH would have to have the entire frontal area as an exit.
I have not seen that type of TH or stack in the real world.
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Old 21st March 2013, 08:48 PM   #63
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Originally Posted by weltersys View Post
The light grey line is not a simulation of a stack of 8 horns, it is a simulation of one circular exit of 8 times the area as one simulated cabinet.

To come close to that in half space, a stack of 8 would look something like the diagram below.

And the TH would have to have the entire frontal area as an exit.
I have not seen that type of TH or stack in the real world.
It's true that you don't see it often but it's easily possible. Put the mouth on what is usually the bottom, lay them on their sides and stack them and then the full frontal area is the mouth. See Bill Fitz's THT (low profile version) for an example of how this is done. It's a front loaded horn but you can do the same with tapped horns. It's the pic near the bottom of the page.

http://www.billfitzmaurice.com/THT.html

Maybe I can do a direct link.

Click the image to open in full size.

Once again, if you plan to stack from the beginning these are trivial details. If you don't plan ahead it's almost impossible to get anything resembling a good result.

But even if the mouths are on the side you can get a lot better approximation of a circular exit than the pic you showed. Laying on their sides, 2 stacks 4 high with all the mouths clustered together in the middle. I couldn't find an example on google so here's a really simple pic of a stack with all the mouths clustered in the middle. The mouth area is shown in red.

Click the image to open in full size.

Last edited by just a guy; 21st March 2013 at 09:14 PM.
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Old 21st March 2013, 10:24 PM   #64
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Originally Posted by just a guy View Post
But even if the mouths are on the side you can get a lot better approximation of a circular exit than the pic you showed. Laying on their sides, 2 stacks 4 high with all the mouths clustered together in the middle. I couldn't find an example on google so here's a really simple pic of a stack with all the mouths clustered in the middle. The mouth area is shown in red.
The upper response of FLH or TH becomes relatively narrow, much less than 180 degrees.
The shape of the stack is reflected in the ground plane.
The stack you just drew does not look much like a circle (or a square) in the upper response, more like a line array.

A vertical sub line array with a narrow exit is a good thing, but not what Hornresp predicts .
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Old 21st March 2013, 10:46 PM   #65
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You are correct of course, there's no arguing with that.

But as long as you are aware of what Hornresp is doing you can get a reasonable correlation to the model. Obviously putting them in a horizontal row 16 feet wide isn't what Hornresp is predicting and won't match the model or be ideal in any situation I can think of.

As long as you at least try to do the right thing it's usually going to be close enough. (Usually way better than close enough. And easily close enough that my simulation is not invalid. The mouth shape is going to primarily influence dispersion pattern anyway, not frequency response.)

Last edited by just a guy; 21st March 2013 at 11:04 PM.
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Old 16th April 2013, 03:40 PM   #66
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Originally Posted by ClackS02 View Post
this is very interesting ! why is this the case?
sorry for the late responce.
the hog scoop is closer related to a th than a normal scoop.
here is a sim with the fane colossus 18xb
Click the image to open in full size.
Click the image to open in full size.
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Old 26th March 2014, 01:30 PM   #67
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Hello guys new to pa system building here but i recently bought a 18 inch scoop from a guy who said it was some hugo hugo plan from spr\eaker plan i loaded it with 18sound lw1400 bbe processor and crown xls 5000 amp but when i raise the volume it reaches a level and the bass dissappears even thoygh i raise limiter and output on processor help please
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Old 28th March 2014, 04:39 AM   #68
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Originally Posted by Subsolutionstt View Post
Hello guys new to pa system building here but i recently bought a 18 inch scoop
...when i raise the volume it reaches a level and the bass disappears...
help please
(I'm) Just new in this thread, but it looks like a phase shift (180º) or null with the back wave.
Others will tell...
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Old 28th March 2014, 07:30 AM   #69
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the lw 1400 should work fine in a hog scoop.
sounds like an amp problem.
did you try antoher amp?
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Old 9th April 2014, 11:53 AM   #70
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Originally Posted by Inductor View Post
(I'm) Just new in this thread, but it looks like a phase shift (180º) or null with the back wave.
Others will tell...
Hmm i m lost here
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