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Old 18th January 2012, 03:36 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tb46 View Post
Hi 2MuchRiceMakesMeSick,

Post #19: "... Is there any way I can drop the height to 14"..."

Yes, that sound quite feasible. I haven't done a drawing on this one yet, but of the top of my head that would be a good height. You would be looking at a combined front face of 76"W x 14"H; the overall depth would be 80"D; the individual boxes would be 76/4 = 19"W.

I can see if I find the time to draw something up around those dimensions, if you are interested.

Regards,
That would be greatly appreciated.

This is the space I have available.

Anything in white I can use. Any area in green will be covered up and I cannot put anything in front of it.
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File Type: jpg space.jpg (12.9 KB, 171 views)
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Old 18th January 2012, 05:57 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2MuchRiceMakesMeSick View Post
Right now I have 4-6.5 tang bands in a TH configuration but it is just not near enough (SPL or frequency depth) for my taste.
From four 6.5 Tang Bands to eight Epic 12", like going from a skateboard to a semi truck .

To get full output from the drivers will require 4000-10,000 watts.

What are your amplifier plans?
Is your house wired with 10 gauge?
What top speakers are you using?
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Old 18th January 2012, 06:50 PM   #23
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I havent bought the power amps yet but I plan on using pro audio QCS amps. 4k minimum should not be a problem. House has dual 12 gauge breakers. Mids and highs is 10 Hiquphon tweeters, 10 seas excel 4.5" and 10 7" seas excel drivers for a total of 30 drivers.

Right now I am more concerned with the box(es) that i will be using to house the 8-12"s that fit within my space.
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Old 19th January 2012, 12:37 AM   #24
tb46 is offline tb46  United States
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Hi 2MuchRiceMakesMeSick,

Here ist a drawing for the 14"x19"x80" box. I did not work out the access panel detail, but otherwise everything is there. The frequency response shifted up a little bit, as the drawn dimensions are a little different from the first rough try at it, you also gain a few dB.

Let me know what questions pop up.

Regards,
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Epic_12in_14x19x80_Input.jpg (40.4 KB, 160 views)
File Type: jpg Epic_12in_14x19x80_SPL.jpg (32.2 KB, 160 views)
Attached Files
File Type: pdf Epic_12in_Dual_14x19x80_dwg.pdf (32.2 KB, 26 views)
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Last edited by tb46; 19th January 2012 at 12:39 AM.
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Old 19th January 2012, 12:56 AM   #25
tb46 is offline tb46  United States
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Hi 2MuchRiceMakesMeSick,

As to the power requirement, according to Hornresp you will exceed the Xmax slightly @ 23Hz w/ 900W into 8 Ohms. Hornresp does not account for compression or losses, probably you'll be able to easily drive 1000W into one of these boxes (that's for two drivers). Always approach power limits carefully, I recommend against high power sine wave testing. You will need low-cut and high cut filters.

I'll attach the Hornresp displacement and SPL graphs. For me one of these would be plenty. :-)

Regards
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Epic_12in_14x19x80_900W_SPL.jpg (31.7 KB, 155 views)
File Type: jpg Epic_12in_14x19x80_900W_Excursion.jpg (36.2 KB, 150 views)
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Last edited by tb46; 19th January 2012 at 01:00 AM.
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Old 19th January 2012, 04:24 AM   #26
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Very nice and thank you very much.
How did you create the PDF? Did hornresp do that?

Just for comparison can you give me one on 3 or 4 RE XXX 15's (80 x 76 x 15-16)? I have one of these in my car and it is the best sub I have ever heard.

Electrical Q Value -Qes: 0.58
Mechanical Q Value -Qms: 3.62
Total Speaker Q Value -Qts: 0.501
Free Air Resonance -Fs: 19.10 Hz
Equivalent Compliance -Vas: 207.0 liters
One-Way, Linear Excursion -Xmax: 54 mm
Efficiency -SPL 1W/1m: 85.81 dB SPL
Effective Piston Area -Sd: 810 cm^2
DC Resistance -Re: 4.2 ohm
Nominal Impedance -Znom: Dual 2 or 4 ohm
Thermal Power Handling -Pe: 2000 W
Force Factor -Bl: 18.16

Mounting Depth - 13.5 inch
Mounting Hole Diameter - 14.5 inch
Overall Diameter - 16 inch
Bolt Hole Circle - 15.25 inch
Motor Width - 10.5 inch
Motor Depth - 5 inch
Basket Depth - 8.5 inch
Displacement - 0.27 cu. ft.
Weight - 76 lbs.


Thanks again WOW. That is outstanding!
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Old 19th January 2012, 02:06 PM   #27
tb46 is offline tb46  United States
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Hi 2MuchRiceMakesMeSick,

I do my drawings in AutoCAD, and print from there to PrimoPDF for the output. The whole thing is actually quite time consuming, so I'll have to wait on finding the extra time for the Re XXX 15; I quickly entered it into Hornresp, and I'll attach what I came up with. Hornresp has the volume @ 362.4 L_net (v. 266.6 L_net for the 14x19x80 Epic 12), so you're looking at substantially bigger boxes. Maybe you can find a link with at least a dimensioned side view drawing for this new driver; without that it basically not possible to draw this, and without a reasonably accurate drawing you won't know how much space this one needs.

Regards,
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Re_XXX_15_T_TQWT_15_Input.jpg (38.5 KB, 21 views)
File Type: jpg Re_XXX_15_T_TQWT_15_SPL.jpg (31.5 KB, 27 views)
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Old 19th January 2012, 02:38 PM   #28
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The XXX's except for the 12" do not like horns, tapped horns or pipes really. Also they are extremely problematic to fit and design in with the weight being near to 80lbs and the depth on even the 12" being 13". Yes it is deeper than it is wide. The motor is 10.5" diameter as well. Then there is the extra long excursion which must be cleared on the throat side and the fact that the MMS is high and coupled with the displacement available creates extremely high forces on the cabinet baffles and walls at low frequencies which requires extensive bracing. I had an interesting double 12" XXX TH design but I aborted mission after trying to fold it and make it actually buildable. It was a nightmare.

Try TC LMSR series or the previously mentioned Epic's are good for deep extension. Alpine Type R 1223 or 1243 in multiples can be great as well.
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Old 19th January 2012, 02:44 PM   #29
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cool, im glad I checked on this forum before buying. I am going to get the epic 12"s.

Now for power. In my experience 100 watts of car or even home audio (consumer) is not the same as pro audio.

An example is, I have an 130wrms pioneer SC-57 that barely powers my tang bands (100wrms). I recently purchased a measley '90w rms' qsc amp and I cannot turn the gain up more then 5-10% before bottoming out the TBs.

Will these subs really handle 500w rms of pro audio QSC amps?
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Old 19th January 2012, 03:36 PM   #30
bjorno is offline bjorno  Sweden
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Hi,

FYI,

Here is a suggestion of a T-TQWT variant that have low enough Gldy at 80 Hz, thus there is no need for signal-delaying the mains to integrate well:

b
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 2xTC-Sounds-Epic-12in-DVC_T-TQWT.JPG (227.4 KB, 69 views)
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