well another of my confused questions. Lets solve the mystery
woking around with JL 13W7 subwoofer i found some thing amazing.
4 designs were condiered.
sealed, vented, passive , sealed with LT figure 1 (transfer function plot)
clolours
yello=sealed
Orange=LT transform
Grey=vented
Pink PR
the vented c4/chebyschev showed maximum output , deepeset with a little hump at 20 hz, the closest was passive with 21 inch exodus PR with 1000 g mass. next was LT transform having good transfer function but the maximum SPL remained same as that of sealed figure 2.
The box size and tuning frequnecy is given in Figure 3.
The group delay is given in Figure 4.
Such a large disparity in SPL out leaves me wondering why JL decides to go sealed ??????????
What route diy should take ???
Perhaps they just didn't like what a multi-resonant box sounds like, precise calculation of parameters not withstanding?*
B.
* Do you believe your model encompasses all that can be said about the sound of a speaker? Most of what matters? Or, um, not a bad starting point but no more than that? Ptolemy thought he had the heavens figured out pretty good and to a crude approximation, he did.
B.
* Do you believe your model encompasses all that can be said about the sound of a speaker? Most of what matters? Or, um, not a bad starting point but no more than that? Ptolemy thought he had the heavens figured out pretty good and to a crude approximation, he did.
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You have to take WinISD suggested box choice with a grain of salt!!!
This means who cares if WinISD suggests ported over sealed. There are many, many other factors that go into a design and if you really look at the JL driver you will understand it will perform very, very well in either alignment.
Honestly, I have never even cared with WinISD suggested when I model any driver. I choose the alignment that fits the project and I see if the driver works in that alignment.
For the size of the box, its still one of the most impressed subwoofer designs out there I have seen. Ikka's measurements on HTS show it holds its own against many, many monster designs.
btw, in any single box design ported WILL ALWAYS have more output then its sealed cousin!! Its not an apples to oranges comparison either since alignments are usually used for different applications.
The route that fits your objectives/boundaries/constraints the best!!
This means who cares if WinISD suggests ported over sealed. There are many, many other factors that go into a design and if you really look at the JL driver you will understand it will perform very, very well in either alignment.
Honestly, I have never even cared with WinISD suggested when I model any driver. I choose the alignment that fits the project and I see if the driver works in that alignment.
For the size of the box, its still one of the most impressed subwoofer designs out there I have seen. Ikka's measurements on HTS show it holds its own against many, many monster designs.
btw, in any single box design ported WILL ALWAYS have more output then its sealed cousin!! Its not an apples to oranges comparison either since alignments are usually used for different applications.
The route that fits your objectives/boundaries/constraints the best!!
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Hi,
Vented PR boxes and/or vented boxes are typically twice the size of sealed.
They will always have max SPL advantages over sealed but at very low
tunings this is barely a real advantage unless you like organ music.
If you don't need the max SPL of vented/PR, sealed with possibly some
bass boost makes a lot of sense, half the size and with better transients.
rgds, sreten.
Note maximum SPLs generally have nothing to do with frequency response.
Vented PR boxes and/or vented boxes are typically twice the size of sealed.
They will always have max SPL advantages over sealed but at very low
tunings this is barely a real advantage unless you like organ music.
If you don't need the max SPL of vented/PR, sealed with possibly some
bass boost makes a lot of sense, half the size and with better transients.
rgds, sreten.
Note maximum SPLs generally have nothing to do with frequency response.
that means that Jl line is for music consideration and not HT.????
my question is out of curoisity that how could the sealed design be that good in output as widely reported without any LT equilization. while being advertised mostly for HT why it is selaed which is usually for music subs. i would like a comparision with wilson audio watch dog which is passive around 6000 usd using one 12 inch driver and twice the cabinet size with vented design but reported tooo musical ???
my question is out of curoisity that how could the sealed design be that good in output as widely reported without any LT equilization. while being advertised mostly for HT why it is selaed which is usually for music subs. i would like a comparision with wilson audio watch dog which is passive around 6000 usd using one 12 inch driver and twice the cabinet size with vented design but reported tooo musical ???
You do not really know the specs of the driver found in the JL line. They are custom designed, high Xmax drivers, probably the best 12" choices out there.
As for the marketing, is there really a reason to use marketing as fact? JL has to advertise their sub to the HT crowd because that is where the volume is.
For its small footprint, its an amazing HT choice but only someone that wants a very small sub and is very concerned about looks is going to buy it.
Even for its size, I know of a few 4cuft designs that are superior. Let's face it, JL's market really isnt anyone that understands T/S parameters and knows how to model a subwoofer design.
Here is Ilkka's measurements.
JL Audio Fathom f113 - Home Theater Forum and Systems - HomeTheaterShack.com
If you go through that archive there is a great summary showing where the F113 sits amongst the best subwoofer choices (4+ years).
Sadly Ilkka now works for an audio company and does not do free analysis. Josh Ricci has started doing some amazing testing..and is helping audioholics....Powered Subwoofer Testing: Outline and Procedures Overview — Reviews and News from Audioholics
See some recent measurements here...Data-Bass
JL Audio Fathom f113 - Home Theater Forum and Systems - HomeTheaterShack.com
If you go through that archive there is a great summary showing where the F113 sits amongst the best subwoofer choices (4+ years).
Sadly Ilkka now works for an audio company and does not do free analysis. Josh Ricci has started doing some amazing testing..and is helping audioholics....Powered Subwoofer Testing: Outline and Procedures Overview — Reviews and News from Audioholics
See some recent measurements here...Data-Bass
Its not a marketing stunt really, That driver has 6.3 Liters of displacement. You have to understand how impressive that is when many 18" woofers are less then 5 liters!!!
You also have to understand how impressive that performance is for a 19.75 in x 16.50 in. x 19.25 in box!!! Its very special.
JL decided they want to have performance in a small footprint. No one else does it!!! That is their niche, that is their advantage.
Should you abandon your JL driver?? Its not the same driver first of all but if the model works for you then use it. Are you trying to create a DIY version of the JL 113? You really can't.
Rather preposterous, isn't it?
I'd like a Ferrari, but this is probably the wrong thread to ask for one.
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