hey guys. im looking to build up a substage. i need sound for 800-1500 people in a 4,000 SQ venue. need response down to around 38hertz. ive been looking threw designs for a while now and am having hard time picking what to do. right now ive been looking at the speakerplans HD15 and BFM titan48 or tuba 60. witch would you recommend? are there others that i should look into?
1500 persons in 4000SF complete with a stage? Really? I sure hope they're friendly. I am guessing these persons are standing? Not enough room for chairs is there?
That's not a lot of room but it is a lot of bodies so I would think you should consider around eight 15" horn loaded woofers. I wouldn't worry about 38 Hz unless there is a reason. To go that low means pretty big horns or many of them. Usually 50 or 60 as the F3 is more than enough for live music.
That's not a lot of room but it is a lot of bodies so I would think you should consider around eight 15" horn loaded woofers. I wouldn't worry about 38 Hz unless there is a reason. To go that low means pretty big horns or many of them. Usually 50 or 60 as the F3 is more than enough for live music.
I think you first decide on your size restrictions and then transfer that over to the commercially available plans and see if you can get your 38Hz. After that you scale down to what will actually fit. 
Have you measured the available area for these boxes? It may be that you can't fit eight 15" horn loaded woofers. Besides, that's just a guess anyway. How high is the ceiling is another consideration. There's a lot of ground work to do before real recommendations can be made.
Have you measured the available area for these boxes? It may be that you can't fit eight 15" horn loaded woofers. Besides, that's just a guess anyway. How high is the ceiling is another consideration. There's a lot of ground work to do before real recommendations can be made.
The HD 15 sounds OK but really needs a 2 wide x 3 high, 6 speaker stack to work.
One issue with 6 bass speakers is that the width of the cabinets if lined up at the front of the stage are wider than the bass frequencies you are trying to reproduce. This causes excessive beaming of the mid bass.
Have you ever heard of a cardiod subwoofer array? You would need an active crossover with delay to make it work.
The rear facing subs are phased and delayed compared with the front facing cabinets. This reduces bass spill on to the stage and increases the front of house area thet gets a full range bass response.
Picture shamelessly lifted from wikipedia.
A good explanation of cardoid arrays is available on the Void Accoustics website.
http://www.voidaudio.com//pdf/bass guide.pdf
One issue with 6 bass speakers is that the width of the cabinets if lined up at the front of the stage are wider than the bass frequencies you are trying to reproduce. This causes excessive beaming of the mid bass.
Have you ever heard of a cardiod subwoofer array? You would need an active crossover with delay to make it work.
The rear facing subs are phased and delayed compared with the front facing cabinets. This reduces bass spill on to the stage and increases the front of house area thet gets a full range bass response.
Picture shamelessly lifted from wikipedia.
A good explanation of cardoid arrays is available on the Void Accoustics website.
http://www.voidaudio.com//pdf/bass guide.pdf
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Hey Guys,
There's a little bit more to the Glastonbury sub array than meets the eye.
It's a broadside cardiod array that has Arc-delay added to it.
Each "cell" of 3 subs (2 forward one back) has incremental delay added, starting from the center and adding more delay as you move towards the ends, this has the effect of opening up the array coverage from the narrow beam typical of broadside arrays.
One thing about cardioid arrays is if driven out of their non-linear region they can suffer from "pattern-flip".
Given the fact that the OP said he had DJ's in his space this is likely to occur.
Another issue is the loss of efficency using these type of arrays, Glastonbury uses 54 cabinets, 36 forward 18 back, that's 1/3rd of the cabinets to reduce the back wave
I would suggest a broadside array with arc delay (incremental taps) to open up coverage using conventional reflex (2 x 18") cabinets if the artists onstage aren't upset by having the subs in front of them
There's a little bit more to the Glastonbury sub array than meets the eye.
It's a broadside cardiod array that has Arc-delay added to it.
Each "cell" of 3 subs (2 forward one back) has incremental delay added, starting from the center and adding more delay as you move towards the ends, this has the effect of opening up the array coverage from the narrow beam typical of broadside arrays.
One thing about cardioid arrays is if driven out of their non-linear region they can suffer from "pattern-flip".
Given the fact that the OP said he had DJ's in his space this is likely to occur.
Another issue is the loss of efficency using these type of arrays, Glastonbury uses 54 cabinets, 36 forward 18 back, that's 1/3rd of the cabinets to reduce the back wave
I would suggest a broadside array with arc delay (incremental taps) to open up coverage using conventional reflex (2 x 18") cabinets if the artists onstage aren't upset by having the subs in front of them
you don't even have to go to the big cabinet. 16 of the cubes, stacked 2x8 in front of the stage would give you about all you could ask for from your required 38hz on up. At $200 per cube, that's some pretty cheap noise.
And yes, on anything 4 or more, you'll want to start delaying the outer boxes, or you'll end up with too narrow of a bass pattern.
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Plans can be found early in my TH thread. However their big claim to fame is that they go low, and in a pack of 8, go REALLY low. You are xmax limited to 50v on the big cabinet.
Here is an eye opening comparison between the cube and the big cabinet.
And if I were really building in your situation, I'd probably build screamers cabinet, and not either of mine. (page 53 or 54 of the live sound only TH thread.)
The big cabinet is big, and in my opinion should be used install only. The cube is the polar opposite, doesn't go low, (barely makes it below 40hz) but is loud, portable, and was designed around using only a single sheet of plywood per box. Looks like you want something that is a good 'all around' cabinet -- that would be the furybox.
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UNDER the stage
Put that empty space to good use. Consider using a delay on the outer subs to control directionality of the horizontal array.Or as stage extensions ->
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Yes, it kicked a** with six loaded with the HL10c. 3600W and F3=36Hz for a bit greater than 134dB(SPL) max at 40Hz.
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