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Old 12th December 2009, 12:46 AM   #1
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Default can auto, subs be used in a pro application?

Hey all,

I been lookin at some of the amazing subs the auto/mobile electronic industry is using, specifically, the JL audio 13w7, and dc audio level 4 and 5
these machines are truly amazing, with claims of 16k watts to burst, they have the none accordian type foam rubber surrounds, the car application seems to use these subs to get a uncompressed BOOMMMMMMM SOUND, which is long,, which i am not interest in. Im looking for a compressed "KUNK", very short , hard, KICK DRUM reproduction, a couple compressers in series microphone in kik drum, maybe two one by the hammer and one in the front hole,. I will probably never abuse them like these car application will.( probably a pair of 18s with 1200 watts a side, mostly sleeping..) questions... (a) is there anything obviously problematic, with my description? with the none accordian type of surround, longevity? any ideas, feedback? all is appreciated... thanx Don Metz yhvh@hotmail.com
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Old 12th December 2009, 01:05 PM   #2
Ron E is offline Ron E  United States
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Could you use them in a pro situation, yes. Typically these competition woofers have very stiff suspensions, and rather high mass This means they are rather low in efficiency and probably won't go all that low without the cabin gain you get in a car. Often the comp woofers have 1 or 2 ohm coils to get the sensitivity up... Pro woofers are just about exactly the opposite of that.

Would you get the sound you want, perhaps, but maybe not. There is a page out there where a gentleman used a hifi woofer for a small bass guitar rig and had good success.
Compact Bass Guitar Speaker Bottom

To be honest, it is not exactly clear what you want to do. Is this for a PA?
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Last edited by Ron E; 12th December 2009 at 01:12 PM.
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Old 12th December 2009, 08:04 PM   #3
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Default car sub, in pro/p.a application

Thanx so much for responding, yes im in a band, and the application would be a p.a set up in a medium sized room, say under 200 people typical. Currently for my mains speakers i been using a pair of Yamaha sw215, which is two 15" drivers with a hundred watt horn on top,we've tryed options of dual 15" jbl 2225h x 2 under the yamaha, they were in the biggest custom cabs ive ever been dumb enough to buy, lol got the unloaded cab for 100.00 with a cruise to pik em up, they are kinda cool , they got a big dual front throw fiberglass horn structure inside a huge wood cab sprayed with fiber glass,..they weigh a ton, and have to pounded through a 3/0 door. We just got 1 set of single peavey black widow 18s, in straight throw box with a 3" open port across the bottom of the cab. they do nice stuff for lowering our band with, but minimum "kunk".. i may be wanting something that you dont get with less than 10,000 watts for subs. my power is a carver pt1800, 1100 a side,. and a new crown 4000, which does 1200 a side or 3200 mono.. my other option is change the jbl 2225hs to a different cab, i was drawing a dual 15, down fireing scoop, which i think i can make less than 22" tall,. truly this is not my arena, im a electrician, lol. but i love messing w sound, im in the wrong field
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Old 12th December 2009, 09:49 PM   #4
jbell is offline jbell  United States
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is this close to what you are looking for?

LIVE SOUND Specific Tapped Horn thread...

LIVE SOUND Specific Tapped Horn thread...
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Old 13th December 2009, 10:42 AM   #5
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Sounds like you need to read this.
PA Systems

A kickbin would probably take care of the "kick" part of "kunk".
A well designed TH for the "umph" part.

And I would not do anything that would need more than one outlet or circuit breaker.
Meaning good efficiency instead of megawatts of power.
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Old 14th December 2009, 01:18 AM   #6
dangus is offline dangus  Canada
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There may some drivers with "pro" efficiency lurking in the car audio realm... maybe someone has compiled a table of all the known woofers in the universe and calculated reference efficiency from the T-S parameters.

Consider a bandpass box tuned for 60 to 120 (or even just 80 to 120 Hz).

And Speakerplans.com; there's plans there, and a lot of practical advice.
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Old 14th December 2009, 01:24 AM   #7
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Default reproducing kik drum.

i think ive rapped my mind around the tapped horn kinda. but whats a kik bin?
great article
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Old 14th December 2009, 03:28 AM   #8
jbell is offline jbell  United States
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kick-bin noun (kik - bin):
1. Cabinet style that cannot play 40hz.
2. Cabinet style that is loud as hell at 100-120hz. (aka, in the 'kick' range.)
3. 2nd cabinet in a 4-way system.

see also:
Speakerplans.com


(apologies for my weak attempt at humor)
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Old 14th December 2009, 04:24 AM   #9
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The narrow bandpass idea may be worth a shot, but don't over expect.

It's hard to grasp the magnitude of efficiency loss when going from PA woofers to small box car woofers without hearing it for yourself. It's severe, you'd be surprised how much power can be worthlessly consumed without the benefit of cabin gain.

If you want to play with it, I'd suggest first buying a couple of cheap/buyout woofers with similar efficiency to the woofers you're considering and knock up a quick cabinet as a test.
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Old 14th December 2009, 09:44 AM   #10
djk is offline djk
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Here is a cheap JBL car driver (on closeout).

Click the image to open in full size.

This is two cabinets stacked.

Click the image to open in full size.

Cone excursion and net volume of about 12 cu ft per box.
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Last edited by djk; 14th December 2009 at 09:48 AM.
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