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Old 11th September 2009, 07:22 PM   #1
damosas is offline damosas  United Kingdom
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Unhappy Poor bass from my 10"s

hi I've just purchased 2 pioneer TSW2501-D2's but i'm not convinced i've wired them correctly. Previously i has 2 volicity's and they were ok but didn't give the punch i wanted so upgraded to these.

To give the whole picture so someone out there can give me a solution, I'm building a system in the back of my transit van, yes i know, why a transit van - if you've got the space why not!! Anyway i'm running a second battery with split charge system and zero guage power cable going to 2 four farad power caps, one for each Lanzar MXA282 amp. This is runs really well, i've got one amp driving the 15's and one for the 10's.

All the subs are DVC's, I've got 16 guage speaker cable bridged across the 2 channels on each set of subs. So basically i've wired them as follows - 2 wires coming from the + side of the bridged amp, 1 going to each sub and 2 wires coming from the - side of the bridged amp, 1 going to each sub. When they get to the sub i've got the + going to the + side of one voice coil and the - going to the - of the other voice coil, then one wire crossing from the - to the + of the other voice coils, 2 ohm wiring apparently. However i've doen this on these pioneers and it sound pants!!!! is it because they are 2 ohm speakers and its putting a 1 ohm load on the amp or something - I'm lost can any of you exoerts help, i want a trouser trembling bass, you all know what i mean.

Thanks
Damo:

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Old 11th September 2009, 07:51 PM   #2
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Yeah, that's 1 ohm (provided each coil is 4 ohm), so the amp will probably have some trouble powering that.

What kind of box are they in?
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Old 11th September 2009, 09:01 PM   #3
damosas is offline damosas  United Kingdom
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Originally Posted by chris661 View Post
Yeah, that's 1 ohm (provided each coil is 4 ohm), so the amp will probably have some trouble powering that.

What kind of box are they in?
The subs are D2's so each voice coil is 2 ohms. The box i designed for my van is made from 22mm MDF, jointed and drilled with gripfill and 70mm screws every 3 inches. The inside of the boxes are padded with wadding , and it's not far of the recommended 17 litres either.

Thanks for reponding so quickly, as you can imagine at the moment really miffed.

Damo
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Old 11th September 2009, 09:02 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by damosas View Post
This is runs really well, i've got one amp driving the 15's and one for the 10's.
...and that's likely where your problem starts. Why are you running two different size / model subs in your car?
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Old 11th September 2009, 09:18 PM   #5
damosas is offline damosas  United Kingdom
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...and that's likely where your problem starts. Why are you running two different size / model subs in your car?
This is my first big install and from reading posts on different forums and looking at other installs i wanted to be able to be able to adjust the bass according to the music i'm listening to. i wanted to ues two different size subs, 10's for the pure heart hitting puch and the 15's for the volume so to speak, and also because i still use the van for carry plasterboard & Building and two 10's and 15's work really well in the back, - what do i need to do?
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Old 11th September 2009, 10:13 PM   #6
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Try running only the 15's or the 10's and see if you have a phase issue. If you're lucky it may be as simple as swapping the leads around.
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Old 11th September 2009, 10:49 PM   #7
damosas is offline damosas  United Kingdom
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Originally Posted by Cal Weldon View Post
Try running only the 15's or the 10's and see if you have a phase issue. If you're lucky it may be as simple as swapping the leads around.
I haven't touched the 15's they are fine, their also running off a LANZAR mxa282 AMP, its just these pioneer 2 ohm DVC subs that i having a bit of a problem with and i don't want to spend even more hard earned cash on my van rather than my kids, Now i feel guilty!!!!!! but you now what i mean. I did try running the two 10's wired in a 2 ohm configuration with both going back to the amp bridged and itnworked for about a minute then it stopped, thankfully the amp must of cut in with a safety and has'nt damaged anything, so as i said its just the 10's i'm stuck! thanks for the reply though
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Old 11th September 2009, 11:44 PM   #8
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DVC stands for dual voice coils. This allows greater flexibility in achieving the correct impedance match for maximum power from your amplifiers. Your amp should optimally see a 4 ohm load in bridge mode, so the 2 voice coils need to be connected together on each speaker + to +ve & - to -ve to make a 2 ohm load. The 2 speakers then need to be connected in series to make a 4 ohm load for the amplifier.
So amp to both +ve terminals of one driver, Both -ve terminals linked to both +ve terminals of other driver, and then both -ve terminals of the second driver, back to the amp connection.
Of course you have the added complication of 2 subs and amps. Once you are happy with the wiring, simply reverse the speaker connections on one of the amps to see if this gives you the extra kick that you are after.
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Old 12th September 2009, 08:32 AM   #9
damosas is offline damosas  United Kingdom
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Originally Posted by Xoc1 View Post
DVC stands for dual voice coils. This allows greater flexibility in achieving the correct impedance match for maximum power from your amplifiers. Your amp should optimally see a 4 ohm load in bridge mode, so the 2 voice coils need to be connected together on each speaker + to +ve & - to -ve to make a 2 ohm load. The 2 speakers then need to be connected in series to make a 4 ohm load for the amplifier.
So amp to both +ve terminals of one driver, Both -ve terminals linked to both +ve terminals of other driver, and then both -ve terminals of the second driver, back to the amp connection.
Of course you have the added complication of 2 subs and amps. Once you are happy with the wiring, simply reverse the speaker connections on one of the amps to see if this gives you the extra kick that you are after.
This sounds a solution, so just so i get this right on one amp driving 2 subs
in bridge mode ----- AMP +ve wired to woofer 1 +ve 1st voice coil looped then joined to the 2nd +ve voicecoil on woofer 1. Then -ve on woofer 1 (1st voice coil) joined to (2nd -ve voice coil on woofer 1. This is then looped to the second woofer (1st voice coil) +ve, looped to the +ve on the second +ve voice coil on woofer 2 then, wire the -ve voice coil on woofer 2 to the 2nd voicecoil on woofer 2 then back to the -ve on the amp?
Basically going Amp +,woofer 1 +,+, woofer 1 -,-,looped to woofer 2 +,+,woofer 2-,-,Amp - . so Am i right in saying that i'm going to connect the one woofers -ve voice coils to the second woofers +ve terminals.

Really appreciate this, and sorry to clarify just need to get it in my head.

Cheers
Damo
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Old 12th September 2009, 09:39 PM   #10
Xoc1 is offline Xoc1  United Kingdom
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I assume that each voice coil is 4 ohms, by connecting the dual voice coils on each speaker in parallel +ve to +ve / -ve to -ve each driver becomes a 2 ohm load.
The 2 speakers are then connected in series : Amp to + & +ve speaker 1 / Speaker 1 -ve &-ve to speaker 2 +ve & +ve / Speaker 2 -ve & -ve to amp this makes a 4 ohm load.
A 4 ohm bridge load makes each half of the amplifier deliver the same amount of power as if it was connected to a 2 ohm speaker so provides the maximum rated power delivery for this amplifier.
Running a 2 ohm load in bridge will cause the amp to try to deliver too much current.
Hopefully the switch mode supply in the amp has current limiting and has prevented the output stage from failing.
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