Hello all, this seems like a great forum.
I have been into hi-fi for a long time. Having gone through many systems, in both my car and home. I have always been into accurate full range systems. I am now looking into DIY for my home hifi for the first time.
I am very good at wood working but am a total newbie when it come to designing solutions. I intend to read up on the subject over time, but for now I'd appreciate some help with the design. Before I have simply made enclosures using the recommended specs supplied with drivers. I have made dozens of enclosures, using both MDF and birch ply with internal matrix bracing. Typically I have gone sealed, but the most natural enclosure I ever owned was my pair of PMC speakers (transmission lines).
So anyway, I wish to construct an enclosure over the winter weeks ahead. These are my parameters...
1. Location - bedroom system, measures 14' x 12', sub to sit in one cormer.
2. Music - various electronica soundscapes with ultra low notes, to hendrix, paramore, nirvana. Will be used for films too.
3. Volume - Low levels in the evening
4. I want ultra low extension (My PMC had some info at 10Hz with a test disc)
5. Notes must be crisp - I hate blurred bass notes. So a 'one note' ported sound might not be my cup of tea. Musicality is key.
6. Ideally it would be around 4cuft, butup to 6cuft might be ok too.
7. I have a cone fetish! I'd love a 15" or 18" if possible, but am open to suggestions. For example, some of you might say a small 12 in a TL enclosure might be better than an 18 sealed?
8. Finally I need to get this gear in the UK, or at least posted to the UK.
Ok chaps, fire away with your wonderful ideas... Thankyou in advance!
Paul
I have been into hi-fi for a long time. Having gone through many systems, in both my car and home. I have always been into accurate full range systems. I am now looking into DIY for my home hifi for the first time.
I am very good at wood working but am a total newbie when it come to designing solutions. I intend to read up on the subject over time, but for now I'd appreciate some help with the design. Before I have simply made enclosures using the recommended specs supplied with drivers. I have made dozens of enclosures, using both MDF and birch ply with internal matrix bracing. Typically I have gone sealed, but the most natural enclosure I ever owned was my pair of PMC speakers (transmission lines).
So anyway, I wish to construct an enclosure over the winter weeks ahead. These are my parameters...
1. Location - bedroom system, measures 14' x 12', sub to sit in one cormer.
2. Music - various electronica soundscapes with ultra low notes, to hendrix, paramore, nirvana. Will be used for films too.
3. Volume - Low levels in the evening
4. I want ultra low extension (My PMC had some info at 10Hz with a test disc)
5. Notes must be crisp - I hate blurred bass notes. So a 'one note' ported sound might not be my cup of tea. Musicality is key.
6. Ideally it would be around 4cuft, butup to 6cuft might be ok too.
7. I have a cone fetish! I'd love a 15" or 18" if possible, but am open to suggestions. For example, some of you might say a small 12 in a TL enclosure might be better than an 18 sealed?
8. Finally I need to get this gear in the UK, or at least posted to the UK.
Ok chaps, fire away with your wonderful ideas... Thankyou in advance!
Paul
Hi Paul, ( I'm responding with a question, and not as someone even close to the title of this thread)..
Have you considered an IB set up, or could the room work in that way? If there is a closet or area underneath or behind the room?, then you could really get some low notes and nice bass with an IB system perhaps.. Here's a link to a great site on the subject http://ibsubwoofers.proboards51.com/
Dave
Have you considered an IB set up, or could the room work in that way? If there is a closet or area underneath or behind the room?, then you could really get some low notes and nice bass with an IB system perhaps.. Here's a link to a great site on the subject http://ibsubwoofers.proboards51.com/
Dave
I had considered that approach. In fact I have a loft space above me that is available. However that will open a can of worms as that is a conversion project all in itself for a later date (I need to lay flooring and tidy it all up for a start).
So for now I had intended to make a stand alone cabinet. I am open to the ideas of sealed, ported, or even my favorite = Transmission Line. However I suspect a TL for a 15 will be way too large! So I am guessing my size requirements may push me closer to a 10" TL or 15" sealed. But I am purely guessing here... so ideas welcome!
So for now I had intended to make a stand alone cabinet. I am open to the ideas of sealed, ported, or even my favorite = Transmission Line. However I suspect a TL for a 15 will be way too large! So I am guessing my size requirements may push me closer to a 10" TL or 15" sealed. But I am purely guessing here... so ideas welcome!
Well, I'm no genius, but it doesn't take one to know that at low SPLs in a relatively small room it doesn't require much of a sub system, so even an acoustically too small TL for a given driver's specs can be EQ'd flat to a very low corner frequency, especially if corner loaded, so what XO point/slope do you plan to use and what driver brands are local and/or in your budget?
GM
GM
One of the 12" Rythmik audio kits would suit your needs perfectly
http://www.rythmikaudio.com/DS1200ci.html
Or go for the 15" if you want to make your whole house wobble
I've been using a DS12 in my 11'x13' room for a couple of years now and am very pleased with it!
I have mine away from corners, with the HP filter set to 28Hz and maximum damping, it's still +10db at 10Hz without EQ
http://www.rythmikaudio.com/DS1200ci.html
Or go for the 15" if you want to make your whole house wobble
I've been using a DS12 in my 11'x13' room for a couple of years now and am very pleased with it!
I have mine away from corners, with the HP filter set to 28Hz and maximum damping, it's still +10db at 10Hz without EQ
I've not had any experience with the VD subs, but I can't see there being a massive difference in sound quality.
I've found with subs if they are properly engineered none really sound better or worse than others, thats all down to setup and how they integrate with the room and rest of the system. The main differences are output and extension, both of which improve with size.
The main things the RA kits have is they are simple and very good value for money
I've found with subs if they are properly engineered none really sound better or worse than others, thats all down to setup and how they integrate with the room and rest of the system. The main differences are output and extension, both of which improve with size.
The main things the RA kits have is they are simple and very good value for money
Indeed. The shop prices for velo are rather high. This is one aspect I prefer with DIY. For the price of a 10" velo I could likely end up with a top level 15 or 18 DIY.
I guess some people think I amy be going a little OTT for a bedroom set up. However I want to have the option of perhaps moving it to a larger room at some point. Also I seem to notice a lot of people keep upscaling their subs. So in a sense I may as well 'go large' from the outset.
What other amp packages are out there which offer a lot of signal tweeking, or even servo feedback?
I guess some people think I amy be going a little OTT for a bedroom set up. However I want to have the option of perhaps moving it to a larger room at some point. Also I seem to notice a lot of people keep upscaling their subs. So in a sense I may as well 'go large' from the outset.
What other amp packages are out there which offer a lot of signal tweeking, or even servo feedback?
Aura
Can anyone tell me what's the smallest ideal cabinet design for these two Aura models please - the 15 and 18. Specs are on this site... thankyou...
NS18-992-4A
NS15-992-4A
http://www.aurasound.com/
Can anyone tell me what's the smallest ideal cabinet design for these two Aura models please - the 15 and 18. Specs are on this site... thankyou...
NS18-992-4A
NS15-992-4A
http://www.aurasound.com/
I would like to point out that, provided with a decent driver, almost anything is possible, as long as you have a seeled box (Linkwitz circuits), so find a meaty amp and a driver with sufficient cone excursion to be equalised and you will be fine. This technique is used ofter in retail home cinema systems and works well until you get to "busy" bass. So I think something around 10-12" + linkwitz would be fine...
Does the room you are using give enough gain to affect the sound output????
If so, you may not need to make the sub go as low as you this when the room is helping it out
As I said above, the linkwitz circuits work until the bass gets busy, so make you own would be best, and use the best parts you can get, to ensure you won't have the same problem, then sit back and enjoy.
Does the room you are using give enough gain to affect the sound output????
If so, you may not need to make the sub go as low as you this when the room is helping it out
As I said above, the linkwitz circuits work until the bass gets busy, so make you own would be best, and use the best parts you can get, to ensure you won't have the same problem, then sit back and enjoy.
PD2150 - 21"
Ok, just another mad thought. I see these PD are UK made so easily available.
I also note this particular driver is their only model with a particuarly low Fs at 22Hz (all others are close to 30). Although the xmax isn't too impressive at 12mm (hopefully that is one way!)
So would this driver be any good? If so, what size cab would it need?
http://www.precision-devices.com/showdetails.asp?id=16
Ok, just another mad thought. I see these PD are UK made so easily available.
I also note this particular driver is their only model with a particuarly low Fs at 22Hz (all others are close to 30). Although the xmax isn't too impressive at 12mm (hopefully that is one way!)
So would this driver be any good? If so, what size cab would it need?
http://www.precision-devices.com/showdetails.asp?id=16
Actually it's a bit less then 12 mm (for PA that's a lot) one way. It's however a 21" so Sd is that of a 12" times three. It's truely designed for horn loaded or BP PA-purposes (6" VC, low Qts).
That low Qts will make it roll off long before it reached it's Fs, something that would be compensated for with the mentioned LT
IIRC One of my follow country men used 2 just standing on their sides, I know from using 18" that way, that it can be quite sufficiënt. (I think he's active here under the name Genius) It's rather expensive though, for that price you probably could get 2 x a quality 18" driver as well.
Best regards Johan
That low Qts will make it roll off long before it reached it's Fs, something that would be compensated for with the mentioned LT
IIRC One of my follow country men used 2 just standing on their sides, I know from using 18" that way, that it can be quite sufficiënt. (I think he's active here under the name Genius) It's rather expensive though, for that price you probably could get 2 x a quality 18" driver as well.
Best regards Johan
Mmm, i'm not an expert on this but, looking at the technical paper, I see an fs of 22hz. With roomgain, the eq and the monoblocks, -3db 15hz is explainable.
What they mean with the mentioned 30-300 range, I don't know. Perhaps the way they measured?
I think there are others here to explain that
Perhaps you could send Tony an email to, since he builded those monsters
What they mean with the mentioned 30-300 range, I don't know. Perhaps the way they measured?
I think there are others here to explain that
Perhaps you could send Tony an email to, since he builded those monsters
B1tneuker said:Mmm, i'm not an expert on this but, looking at the technical paper, I see an fs of 22hz. With roomgain, the eq and the monoblocks, -3db 15hz is explainable.
What they mean with the mentioned 30-300 range, I don't know. Perhaps the way they measured?
I think there are others here to explain that
Perhaps you could send Tony an email to, since he builded those monsters
Tony's using them in a very different alignment than they're meant to be used. They're designed for prosound duty, and in the appropriately sized prosound enclosure, they'll be hitting 30 or so, which is actually deep for prosound 'sub' standards.
For home it's reasonable to attempt to get down to the teens, but in prosound, we don't need the super low stuff, especially given the huge increases in displacement and power required to get the bottom octave or octave and a half, and the spectral content of most amplified music.
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