What kind of wire is good for internal amp wiring? - Page 2 - diyAudio
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Old 9th December 2002, 11:08 AM   #11
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Default Best cable gauge

Quote:
Originally posted by fezz
i was wondering the same thing, but on the other end of the spectrum - is thicker wire better - i am (or was, depending on how the question is answered) going to use a very thick (1-2mm) solid core copper wire for the internal wiring of my zen - would this work and sound better then thinner wire

keep in mind i am shilding the internal wire with braiding and teflon sheath
If you want to find out a bit more on cables, wire gauge and metals used, you should have a look at Jon Risch papers. His findings have helped a lot of people without breaking any bank. Do a Google search to find them. The URL I have doesn't work anymore.

In my experiences, thicker wires tend to sound not too good on higher frequencies. They may be good for power supplies though. They are not too easy to handle, so you may do better using several thinner wires.

If you want to do some experiments, buy those enameled wire rolls that Radio Shack sells. They call them magnet wire, but it's pure copper. They come in several thicknesses.

I did several braids myself (you should learn how to braid, which is easy), using several combinations of these RS wires. The interconnects using thinner wires ten to sound cleaner, with better instrument separation. But it's worth mixing several thicknesses and listen to results for yourself.

Speaker wires are less critical, but projects using CAT-5 cable are a good place to start. CAT-5 is not too good for interconnects.

Hope this helps.


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Old 9th December 2002, 11:38 AM   #12
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Here's the URL for Jon Risch site. It provides a good basic reading on cables for audio applications:

http://www.geocities.com/jonrisch/index2.htm



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Old 9th December 2002, 01:49 PM   #13
Philo is offline Philo  United States
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Here is another good sight about DIY cables especially CAT5.
http://www.tnt-audio.com/
I have also cooked up some interconnects using Kynar, which is silver plated 30AWG w/ a teflon jacket. I like them for digital interconnects.
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Old 9th December 2002, 01:52 PM   #14
Philo is offline Philo  United States
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Damn, didn't read all the replies closely enough. Thomas already listed TNT-Audio. To early in the morning I guess.
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Old 9th December 2002, 02:29 PM   #15
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Default Cable dielectric

Quote:
Originally posted by Philo
Here is another good sight about DIY cables especially CAT5.
http://www.tnt-audio.com/
I have also cooked up some interconnects using Kynar, which is silver plated 30AWG w/ a teflon jacket. I like them for digital interconnects.
There's CAT5 cable with Teflon dielectric on the individual wires. Might be an improvement over the original TNT design.

Kynar is not Teflon. That same 30AWG wirewrap you mention can be bought in Tefzel, which is closer to teflon. Dielectric constant of Kynar is 6.4 versus 2.6 for the Tefzel. Teflon is even lower, and nowadays can be found everywhere.

Teflon is great for soldering, as it stands the heat quite well if you are not a too fast solder.



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Old 9th December 2002, 02:35 PM   #16
fezz is offline fezz  United Kingdom
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thankyou very much for the replier - i have used 2mm diameter solid core cable for speaker cable, but it didn't sound better then the CAT5 cable i use at the moment (although much better then the shop bought multicore stuff) i attributed this to the insulation.

thanks for the advice, i am now looking for teflon insulated silver wire in the UK - i have seen a website called something like white noise which sells silver wire but i cant find it now - should have really bookmarked it.
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Old 9th December 2002, 02:45 PM   #17
Philo is offline Philo  United States
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Calmart,
I guess I was mislead. When I have soldered it it held up well much like teflon so I had no reason to doubt my friend. BTW, what source did you use for those properties? I am always interested in good sources. Is it available online?
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Old 9th December 2002, 03:21 PM   #18
fezz is offline fezz  United Kingdom
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found the website www.wnaudio.com - they sell silver coated copper wire with teflon insulation, i have heard that silver coated copper is a bit hard - is it very noicable, and would it benifit some systems (uch as mine as i have a marantz CD6100 OSE which sounds quite soft)
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Old 9th December 2002, 03:33 PM   #19
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apparently silver-plated copper used to sound really awful (bright and harsh) but in the last several years or so there have been some good-sounding cables using it (DH Labs Silver Sonic comes to mind). i think a lot depends on the grade of wire you get - not all silver-plated copper is created equal. i've heard some theorize that the plating process has something to do with the sound, the ones with a better, smoother finish sounding better, but who knows. i do know that different kinds of it sound better or worse though, so you may have to do some experimentation to find a good one. i think there is a Belden stranded, silver-plated copper in teflon jacket that sounds ok, i have some in 18 gauge. haven't really listened to it much but it seems ok.

FYI here's a comprehensive table of AWG (american wire gauge) sizes:

http://www.axon-cable.com/ToolBox/Gauges/gauge1.htm

they show slightly different thicknesses for each gauge number but you can just take the middle value as an average. you'll see that it's a inverse logarithmic system like dB, so every 6 gauge corresponds to a factor of 2 difference in diameter, or factor of 4 in cross-section area. so a 19 gauge wire will have half the resistance of a 22 gauge wire.
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Old 9th December 2002, 03:35 PM   #20
Philo is offline Philo  United States
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I had read that as well but after modifying my Sony SACD player I wanted to try a wide range of DIY interconnects and this one sounded the best to me. However, my current speakers don't reproduce the high end detail I am looking for and are an upcomming project. They maybe masking the harshness people are refering to.
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