Crown amps, transistor replacement (long)

[Eaulive]

Hi all, I am new to this forum and so far it seems very interesting.

I often have to service Crown amplifiers and I wonder if anybody knows for sure what output devices are used.
I recently had a MA5000VZ and a MA3600VZ to fix.

Original devices for the 5000VZ were, according to the manual:
PNP 103285-1 and NPN 103286-1 but on one of the channels, I had also a set of PNP C8188-2 and NPN C8187-4

In the 3600VZ I have the same C8188-2 and C8187-4 pair.

Now I know these transistors are made by ONSEMI, I use regularly MJ21195-96 and MJ15022-23 that YORKVILLE SOUND uses in their amplifiers, and the crown transistors have the same pattern, and same batch number format.

Anybody can tell me what motorola (onsemi) device his hidden behind these strange numbers?

I searched the forum for more than an hour and there is a lot of speculation about using different types like the MJ21193-95 or the MJ15024-25, but nothing very conclusive

I have easy access (and cheap) to the MJ21195-96 and MJ15022-23 because of Yorkville, the transistors from crown are almost US$7 each... it hurts.

Another question:

I see from the datasheet that the MJ21195-96 have basically the same specs, except for a slightly higher gain and SOA, than the MJ15022-23, but one says uses the "perforated emitter technology" while the second are "powerbase"...

Anybody can shed some light on this?

Thanks for reading me and sorry for the long post.

[Eaulive]

So... nobody?

And of course, Crown won't tell me

[Eva]

As far as I know, MJ15022-23 are older technology devices from 1980s while MJ21195-96 are newer technology iproved ones from 1990s. Essentially, that is what makes the difference. I've also checked the datasheets and I can't think of any reason for MJ21195-96 not working properly in place of MJ15022-23.

[Enzo]

I think either will work, but I wouldn't mix the types for current sharing and thermal tracking reasons.

Who says Crown won't tell you? They have always been vary helpful to me. SOmewhere I have a master parts list from Crown, and it tells the generic for all their house numbers. If I can find it I will post the data.

Crown also tests their power semis and stamps a rating number on them. As far as I know, it is a speed number rather than gain.

COntact Crown and ask if there is a parts listing that included your types. For that matter ask them directly to identify those part numbers. And if you really feel friendly, ask them if they can ship some to you. They told us that you can be one number off on the rating and they will still play together nicely. Just don't m,ix a 3 and an 8.

In any case, if you need a quick sub, those high end Motorola/On Semi types will be fine, just check the power rail voltages

[Workhorse]

Originally posted by Eaulive

Original devices for the 5000VZ were, according to the manual:
PNP 103285-1 and NPN 103286-1 but on one of the channels,Thanks for reading me and sorry for the long post.

hello Eaulive,

The original Crown Macro-Tech 5000VZ [variable impedance]uses MJ15024 and MJ15025 devices.

get rid of confusion and fix the amp...

K a n w a r

[djk]

The SOA at 80V is 240W on the MJ21195/96 vs 160W on the MJ15024/25, plus the newer ones have a bit better HFE at high currents.

[mrx23]

Here you can find a lot of service manuals from crown!
http://www.crownaudio.com/gen_htm/legacy/legacamp.htm

[saj888]

For yrs I ahve been using Mj15024, 25, Mj21193,94,95,96. ON hundreds of qsc , crown, crest etc.
They run for years,

[krmaudio]

HELLO,

HERES SOME INFO, HOPE IT HELPS IN SOME WAY.......

103285-1 = SJ7195
103286-1 = SJ7196

C8188-2 = SJ7147
C8187-4 = SJ7148

AND THE REST IS ANYBODY'S GUESS!

[crissty]

I own a Crown Macrotech 3600VZ, with 3 blown transistors C8188. After asking for replacement part from Crown they mailed me that SJ7147 can be substituted. but i cant find datasheet.

Can someone post datasheet for SJ7147-SJ7148
Also suggest if i can use MJ21195-96 OR Mj15024-25 instead.

Regards.