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Old 14th July 2004, 12:08 PM   #61
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So your telling me that the 0.1% track is actually the worse one? and the 9.6% is the one which sounds slightly hazey? how does that make sense, or are they two different types of distortion?

I just went on what you would expect to be there, thinking you must have got the order wrong when loading them into foobar, because intuition would tell you the 9% would be worse then the 0.1%. Now that your telling me the 0.1% is the worse would you mind explaining to me why? or is that located somewhere on the website which I had a brief look at.

Cheer Matt
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Old 14th July 2004, 12:36 PM   #62
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Default The worst equipment inside an audio chain will determinate the result quality

Speaker is the guilty.

five parts.... you will be nervous, if heart problems, do not read this.

regards,

Carlos
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Old 14th July 2004, 12:38 PM   #63
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Default I am not responsible of your frustration, reality always there..

You could see that.... i expent 20 years to perceive that.

regards,

Carlos
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Dx Mark One - The lowest THD amplifier ever made! - LOADED
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OC3_AdPbLvc, Unbeatable Dx Mark One; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u4tGBiqMnzQ
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Old 14th July 2004, 12:39 PM   #64
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Default Speaker cannot go front and back same time.

This way, it is not capable to reproduce complex wave forms.

Carlos
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Dx Mark One - The lowest THD amplifier ever made! - LOADED
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OC3_AdPbLvc, Unbeatable Dx Mark One; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u4tGBiqMnzQ
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Old 14th July 2004, 12:42 PM   #65
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Default Room have acoustics, ears have defects, and emotion contribute a lot

This way, the thing is a little bit more complicate to normal man discover the answer.... all of us in the wrong way.... the earth remains squared!

regards,

Carlos
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Old 14th July 2004, 01:03 PM   #66
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Quote:
Originally posted by 5th element
So your telling me that the 0.1% track is actually the worse one? and the 9.6% is the one which sounds slightly hazey? how does that make sense, or are they two different types of distortion?
Yes, that's what we've been saying all along. The one with the nasty and obvious distortion is 0.1% THD.

THD represents individual harmonic distortion figures taken in total. The problem is that some are much more important than others, so much so that totalling them together gives you a nonsense figure.
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Old 14th July 2004, 09:54 PM   #67
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Konnichiwa,

Quote:
Originally posted by 5th element
So your telling me that the 0.1% track is actually the worse one?
Abso-*****ing-lutley.

Quote:
Originally posted by 5th element
and the 9.6% is the one which sounds slightly hazey?
Yup. You got that right.

Quote:
Originally posted by 5th element
how does that make sense,
Because "THD" is a measure of distortion that has absolutley NO CORRELATION WHATSOEVER to percieved distrotion, which was the point I tried to get across.

Quote:
Originally posted by 5th element
or are they two different types of distortion?
Both tracks have been subjected to algorythms that produce distortion but use very different approaches. However, if you measure the results with classic THD and IMD tests the MEASURED distortion is as indicatced. The point is that low THD & IMD is NO GARANT WHATSOEVER for undistorted sound with music.

Quote:
Originally posted by 5th element
I just went on what you would expect to be there,
Based on exactly that particular EXPECTATION (or shall we call it prejudice?) which is absolutely false and which to expose was the point of the test.

Quote:
Originally posted by 5th element
because intuition would tell you the 9% would be worse then the 0.1%.
Exactly. Hence such measurements like THD & IMD where used in advertising and led to the measurement methodes to be standardiesed and so on, all based on the assumtion that low measured THD actually correlates with low percieved distortion, except it does not.

Quote:
Originally posted by 5th element
Now that your telling me the 0.1% is the worse would you mind explaining to me why?
At a guess form the sound, all the distortion is high order and odd order only, but I do not know for sure.

Quote:
Originally posted by 5th element
or is that located somewhere on the website which I had a brief look at.
The website explains the background to this, yes.....

Sayonara
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Old 14th July 2004, 10:28 PM   #68
sam9 is offline sam9  United States
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"Both tracks have been subjected to algorythms that produce distortion but use very different approaches. However, if you measure the results with classic THD and IMD tests the MEASURED distortion is as indicatced. The point is that low THD & IMD is NO GARANT WHATSOEVER for undistorted sound with music."

This makes sense with regard to speakers since there are such a huge range of physical construction options. However, if you limit the comparrison to being within a class such as "MTM configuration with sealed enclosure" would you limit the possible distortion mechanisms sufficiently that relative THD might be meaningful that class. I'm thinking that perhaps the distribution of harmonic components might be similar. I'm not arguing foe this, just speculating.

The speculation arrises from the casual observation of FFT plots of various amplifiers of similar design. For instance, dual rail, BJT, conventional Lin topology seems to produce pretty similar relative harmonic components. Add mirrior image IS and VAS aqnd you get a different typical pattern. This may weel have no parrallel in the case of speakers. Still, if someone really wants to investigate this for various types that would be very informative. Are there typical harmonic signatures for sealed, vented, transmission line vs ESL etc?? Even if there is no typical pattern, THAT would be interesting.
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Old 14th July 2004, 10:52 PM   #69
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32 years ago or more, my associates and I wondered why speakers could have so much distortion and amps could not! Even more, some amps with LOW distortion sounded worse than amps with high distortion. It has to do with extra distortions generated by the amps, BUT not measured with normal audio measurements. Feedback IS an important factor.
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Old 15th July 2004, 05:13 AM   #70
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does anyone know how to calculate, or even approximate, this GedLee metric?
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