speaker distortion - Page 2 - diyAudio
Go Back   Home > Forums > Amplifiers > Solid State

Solid State Talk all about solid state amplification.

Please consider donating to help us continue to serve you.

Ads on/off / Custom Title / More PMs / More album space / Advanced printing & mass image saving
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 11th July 2004, 07:58 AM   #11
diyAudio Member
 
mikee12345's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: NZ
Quote:
Originally posted by cunningham



A-MEN

also typically you can almost eliminate speaker distortion by never exceeding 60% or so of rated RMS power.
Certainly power compression will be reduced...but the actual cone movements is the worrying thing if talking of low frequencies.

hundred or two watts applied to a shiva 12" can bottom it at 20hz,but whatabout at 90hz! its only thermally limited there.......
  Reply With Quote
Old 11th July 2004, 08:43 AM   #12
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: The Netherlands
Quote:
you did not get the point. At what input power, and whats the rated input power.
I think the point the starter of this thread wanted to make was that speakers produce distortion, and they do that happely 1 or 2 orders of magnitude worse than a typical amplifier.

Makes me think that maybe the lineairity of the amp is not critical as I used to think.

greetz,
Thijs
  Reply With Quote
Old 11th July 2004, 10:00 AM   #13
Banned
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Germany, Clausthal
Quote:
I think the point the starter of this thread wanted to make was that speakers produce distortion, and they do that happely 1 or 2 orders of magnitude worse than a typical amplifier.
this is not really the case.

I did measurements with my speakers and Zen / chipamp. At low volumes the crossover distortion of the chipamp has a larger number that the distortion caused by the speaker.

In case they measured 1m from speaker at rated power, and this were PA speakers, i doubt they had a mic they did not overdrive. And speakers distortion starts at very small numbers and gets larger with power. Just like SE class a amplifiers. Not so psuh pull amp, they start with bad THD, get better with more power, and worse when going near to rated max. power.

So yor conclusion is right in case you listen at high volume levels / high power feed into speakers. Thats not the typical usage.

All one needs to test the speakers distortion is a PC with soudncard and a good mic. Why not measure?

The numbers above without giving power, spakers data, measured bandwith etc.. are meaningless. I suspect the thread starters point is the same kind of "point" he has for his ridicolous postings in off topic forum.
  Reply With Quote
Old 11th July 2004, 10:52 AM   #14
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: The Netherlands
Hi Till,

You could be right about the low power lineairity of speakers. I suspect the distortion figures of a speaker to be more of less proportional to the input voltage (below it's rated power). And indeed it should be interseting to try to measure that. I think Linkwitz has done such measurements and publshed them on his website.

Could you elaborate a bit on the quantitative data of your measurements. I am a bit scepitcal about your remarks on your Zen/Chipamp measurements, as my gainclonne has 0.01% THD at 1 Watt (measured). Can you measure such low aucoestical distortion figures?

Best regards,
Thijs
  Reply With Quote
Old 11th July 2004, 11:07 AM   #15
Banned
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Germany, Clausthal
Thijs,

My TD2001 will produce about 109dB at 1m distance at 1W.

I do not claim my measurements beeing of scientific quality, but be sure i measured at much below 1Watt also. A FFT will be able to detect THD also at very low signal levels.

The very low power levels i use for normal listening may be the reason why chips etc. sound worse than the ZEN with my speakers.
  Reply With Quote
Old 11th July 2004, 11:32 AM   #16
Account Disabled
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: US
Quote:
Originally posted by till
Thijs,

My TD2001 will produce about 109dB at 1m distance at 1W.

that figure is totally meaningless if we don't know what mic you are using, how it is measured, what frequency, room acoustics, etc.

Quote:
Originally posted by till
Thijs,

I suspect the thread starters point is the same kind of "point" he has for his ridicolous postings in off topic forum.
that's precisely the mental state I would like you to be in. ;0
  Reply With Quote
Old 11th July 2004, 01:43 PM   #17
Banned
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Germany, Clausthal
Quote:
that figure is totally meaningless if we don't know what mic you are using, how it is measured, what frequency, room acoustics, etc.
you did not understand anything, go back to schoold please. (or is you educational system over there that bad, do they only teach creationism and war on terror)

i donīt need any mic to get this number.
  Reply With Quote
Old 11th July 2004, 01:50 PM   #18
diyAudio Moderator
 
pinkmouse's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Chatham, England
Guys, calm down please, let's keep this polite.
__________________
Rick: Oh Cliff / Sometimes it must be difficult not to feel as if / You really are a cliff / when fascists keep trying to push you over it! / Are they the lemmings / Or are you, Cliff? / Or are you Cliff?
  Reply With Quote
Old 11th July 2004, 11:36 PM   #19
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: The Netherlands
Hi Till,

I don't expect you to have done acoustical distortion level measurements at 109dB, your speakers seem to be a bit above average efficientcy... But I am not so much interested in speaker efficinetcy (I asume you use average listening levels (80-90dB?) for testing?) , but I am interested what acoustical distortion levels you did measure and what distortion levels you have measured at the output of your amp as comparison. You stated that
Quote:
At low volumes the crossover distortion of the chipamp has a larger number that the distortion caused by the speaker
.. I'm still a bit scepical, but I am sincerely interested in such meusurements..

Also.. after some thinking.. . it is the SPL related excursion that gives rise to the speaker distortion, so high efficient speaker in it self don't help against speaker distortion, or does it? It does however help agianst amplifier distortion, so in your situation, speaker distorion sould be especially domminating? The Zen amp btw has >0.01% THD at 100mW (about 89dB SPL from your speakers), which is higher than a GainClone?


Cheers,
Thijs
  Reply With Quote
Old 12th July 2004, 12:09 AM   #20
Banned
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Germany, Clausthal
I did not write down notes about it, i remeber the following: measurements done at frequencies above 600Hz, the cone speaker used below does distort more at higher volumes. All THD values measured were below 1% at about 1W. With the Chip about 2 to 4 times higher than with the Zen in the range below 1W. Unless very loud not really more THD with speakers than measured electrical at amps output. There is some level of volume were speakers THD increases drastically, below the rated power of the speaker. I measured at lower volume levels (no absulolute dB meter here) and the distortion from the amp was dominating here, and with really loud levels (ear protection!) and speakers distortion was dominating. My conclusion was measurement confirm my ear: at last with my high efficient speakers SE class a are better. In case there is interest i will do better measurements, but not in the next few weeks as i have to move all audio gear in a new room first.
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Hide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Measuring speaker distortion ak_47_boy Equipment & Tools 0 12th September 2008 02:22 AM
Speaker Workshop Distortion Question arc2v Multi-Way 47 27th July 2007 02:38 PM
Distortion Measurements with speaker workshop noodle_snacks Multi-Way 1 6th September 2006 02:28 AM


New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 05:53 AM.


vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright Đ1999-2014 diyAudio

Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2