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Old 24th July 2014, 06:15 AM   #81
Vostro is offline Vostro  South Africa
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I've had a low power chip amp, and desired a higher power amp when it distorted when played on those occasions when I needed (wanted) the music to play for party.
Yes under normal listening conditions it was great, but life is not the median, there are occasions when situations peak.
But this lead to regret, with me wanting to get a higher power amp.

I now have a higher power amp, 180W and I must say, I never look back and say, I wish this was a 1W amp.

I still say enough cannot be defined as the minimum that is desired, but just that bit higher than what's needed, whatever that is to the specific person
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Old 24th July 2014, 08:36 AM   #82
AndrewT is offline AndrewT  Scotland
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but just that bit higher than what's needed,
exactly.
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Old 24th July 2014, 10:33 PM   #83
rawbas is offline rawbas  Philippines
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vostro View Post

I still say enough cannot be defined as the minimum that is desired, but just that bit higher than what's needed, whatever that is to the specific person

agree!

I'd say it will depend on what is needed.
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Old 28th July 2014, 07:04 AM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vostro View Post
I've had a low power chip amp, and desired a higher power amp when it distorted when played on those occasions when I needed (wanted) the music to play for party.
Yes under normal listening conditions it was great, but life is not the median, there are occasions when situations peak.
But this lead to regret, with me wanting to get a higher power amp.

I now have a higher power amp, 180W and I must say, I never look back and say, I wish this was a 1W amp.
Well, I did the opposite.

Despite having several high power amplifiers, I actually missed my LM1875's. In particular I missed the dark voiced parallel LM1875. There's something oddly interesting and really relaxing about that. Sure, it can't play jet plane loud like the big amplifiers, but what is interesting is that it doesn't need to.

My big amplifiers are a bit different, with rather fantastic concert sound when the volume knob is all the way, but they only work well when loud and shaking everything. Quiet playback with those is like driving as slowly as possible, and that is actually annoying.

It seems true that the amplifier power is all about what you need. But sometimes I just need to relax. Apparently, I need two different sorts of amplifiers. It depends on the mood.
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Old 30th July 2014, 06:52 AM   #85
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Maybe I need three sorts of amplifiers?
For example, a rather fantastic 2 watts. . .
I also do like a very strange thing in the office and bedroom. The old late 1960's solid state amplifier that had a ruush (a muffled hiss) sort of like a star trek soundtrack.
Panasonic RE7300 (see ebay) will do that if careful adjustment of the tone dial and very conservative adjustment of the volume dial. I'm sure it has at least 2 watts. But, apparently, that is optimal if you're in need of a most excellent quality nap.

So, do I need the most piercingly well imaging audiophile amp or the most excellent bass during a nap? No, Neither, because only the opposite will work at that particular time.

I'm just saying that it is highly likely that ALL of the different sorts of audio amplifiers do have an optimal use and therefore it is highly unlikely to measure it in watts.

Also, if you can name a figure in watts that is not enough, you'd have to Quadruple that to get 6db more out of a speaker (and 6db is still pitiful). Therefore I'm curious about possible answers to this thread that don't involve wattage.

. . . such as, please use a *series element* such as a cable, resistor, diode, capmulti, regulator, in-between any two different size caps in the power circuit, rather than directly parallel different size caps.
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Old 30th July 2014, 02:29 PM   #86
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.... but they only work well when loud and shaking everything. Quiet playback with those is like driving as slowly as possible, and that is actually annoying.....
Which is really telling you that your speakers don't work well at low levels, unless your amplifier also has strange problems at low power.

Try using the chipamp speakers on the big amplifier for interest, or is this more a distortion quality of the chipamps with their speakers that you enjoy - perhaps you simply don't require so much low bass?

The OP though, simply asks "what is the best power" which is a nebulous question since unless you assume a standard speaker and bandwidth for all comparisons, it could be anything from 5-500W. I say bandwidth, because sub-bass requires a lot more power than than typical full-range loudspeakers require but not all of us use them. Other folks, such as the frugal-philes, use tiny amps and full range miniature drivers in optimised enclosures. I'd say some of those guys are using single ended small tubes with only a bit over a watt in them, so this gets pretty silly.

Define a standard speaker for all and then you have your "best power" for any particular group of audio fans or DIYs you care to name.
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Old 1st August 2014, 02:38 PM   #87
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Simple question,complex answer!Like all aspects of engineering,compromises have to be struck.Type of music ? Chamber requires far less power than Heavy Metal.Small bed-sit less than a large lounge,then there is the question of speakers.Small book shelf types are far less sensitive than big Transmission lines ,Horns, etc.with a bewildering range in between!
Sound quality is also a factor.As a very rough rule of thumb (and for this comment I expect a lot of flack!),the higher the quality,the lower the efficiency.For a low power ,high quality amp.:Class A,next,Class AB run with a high quiescent current,next AB with lower Iq and last,Class B (little or no Iq),for driving things like "Butt-kickers".
Commercial amps.have to appeal to as wide a market as possible,to maximise sales,so their designs have to compromise both on quality and production costs.
The wonderful thing about DIY is that amps can be optimised for one's personal requirements,often at much less expense!
There is such a wealth of designs and info.on Diyaudio,there is truly an embarrassment of riches!
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Old 1st August 2014, 08:12 PM   #88
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Dangerous Decibels How Loud is Too Loud?
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Old 2nd August 2014, 10:26 AM   #89
AndrewT is offline AndrewT  Scotland
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I just took delivery of my first SPL meter, yesterday.
I discovered that I listen at 60 to 85dB for my normal listening. Kinda explains why my measurements show just a few hundred milliwatts at the speaker terminals.
I walked around the house closing doors behind me to find out how the sound attenuates. Not much, a closed door is about 15dB to 25dB,
Two closed doors and a short corridor between my Lounge and my Living room resulted in 40 to 50dB attenuation. (the meter indicates "under" and the bar-graph goes to zero markers at 30dBA). I turned up the stereo to hear what "others" might hear around the house.
My meter gave average readings (slow and fast) around about 30dBA.

This "30dB was certainly not silence. I would find it very disturbing if I was reading. It could be described as "distracting" if I was having a conversation. I would be complaining to environmental health to get the noise stopped, if I were trying to sleep.

My house when "quiet" is well below 30dBA.
Difficult to guess how much below 30dBA, might be 10dB, or more likely be >20dB below that 30dBA
Back to the "loud" room, the meter reads average around 85dBA and peaks at 96dBA.
I can shout louder than that at 500mm. It went to 98dB. So in my view 100dB peaks are not that loud.
I would need a noise to peak ratio exceeding ~90dB to get full use of listenable audio.

Looking at Still4's link: I wonder how many 110dB 10us peaks fit into 90seconds to reach the continuous time weighted average noise limits?
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Last edited by AndrewT; 2nd August 2014 at 10:35 AM.
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Old 2nd August 2014, 09:28 PM   #90
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I just took delivery of my first SPL meter, yesterday.....
May I ask what type of SPL meter this is? Some popular and affordable types use standard, uncalibrated mic. inserts and others appear to have good linearity and correlation to standards, even coming with (apparently) individual calibration charts - a practice once reserved for high priced instruments. I'm sure there many more brands, types and quality out there that I haven't even seen either.

I was surprised though, to find that neither of these Chinese made types I compared was very expensive but the results were certainly different - by up to 5 dBA within the home audio listening environment. Prices? around $95 and $140 US, before freight or duty.

Integrating types by TES, Minipa, Rigol etc. for serious environmental noise assessment, are at least 6 times those prices - well out of my league but thankfully, not something I need.
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