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Old 29th October 2013, 10:45 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by tinitus View Post
is it for professional use ?
Can easily be. The case is designed for rack mounting and the heatsinks oversized with extra room below for airflow in case someone puts it on some flat surface, table, flycase, etc...

The goal is a reliable, stable amp that will stand up to abuse, so I guess yes, it's aimed also at pro usage.
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Old 29th October 2013, 10:50 AM   #12
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might be a good idea to put a lid on the heatsinks of each amp module (inside the vented box)
There is a lid, full of hole, just because it must breathe. There is heat to evacuate all over and the more air flows, the better. It would be a pitty to block that air flow.

Now if you are thinking about someone dropping some tiny metal part through the vent holes on top of the pcb, then it's true this could cause an issue, but who would find something that small and metal, that could pass through those holes, and who would go drop it there? Unless it's done on purpose, I don't see why this would happen in normal use.

Plus, why also block the view from all that electronics inside? That too is a sight that I like in the amp. Seeing the guts of it is a plus to me
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Old 29th October 2013, 11:13 AM   #13
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I don't see how this could be dangerous in any way. Can you explain what you mean?

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Now if you are thinking about someone dropping some tiny metal part through the vent holes on top of the pcb, then it's true this could cause an issue, but who would find something that small and metal, that could pass through those holes, and who would go drop it there?
that was my main concern, yes

imagine yourself bending over your amp, and dropping a small solder bit from your clothing

when using amp for PA/instrumnet I might have a bad habbit of placing various things on top of it
but could be anything really ... never dropped a component, like a resistor, or a screw ?

anyway, venting would not be limited, but maybe even improved

here is what I 'expect' the convection will look like, with and without the 'inner sub lids'
its about controlling air flow to avoid possible turbulent chaos
Attached Images
File Type: png vent box.png (13.5 KB, 444 views)
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Old 29th October 2013, 11:36 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by tinitus View Post
here is what I 'expect' the convection will look like, with and without the 'inner sub lids'
its about controlling air flow to avoid possible turbulent chaos
I see what you mean, but then the central area above the pcb would no longer have convection and would be enclosed.

Only a "hacker" messing around with tools and soldering iron over the amp could drop something in those vents. I doubt in the field when putting amps in a rack and during their use there would be any chance of small bits of metal falling inside the amp. It's so unlikely that I would prefer leaving the air flow than block it from flowing.

I've seen so many diyers making good looking layouts, big heatsinks, and then enclose the whole thing in some wooden box with hardly any air circulation...

In this design, I make use of the inner room to have double the heatsinks. Of course the convection won't be the same between the inner sinks as it is for the outter sinks, but I think this should work anyway. Short of going forced convection, this overdesign should ensure some level of reliability. As long as any pcb layout related considerations have been addressed.

I want to aim for the best layout possible, so I am open to suggestions that help in all respects this layout.
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Old 29th October 2013, 11:43 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by spookydd View Post
I see what you mean, but then the central area above the pcb would no longer have convection and would be enclosed.
no, you could have increased airflow coming through the ends of each amp module

but basicly, route the air between the heatsink towards the top of heatsink, and the air escaping there will increase the outside airflow at fins
and that is also where it really makes a real difference
the inner side of the heatsink is not very effective, only the fins are
so basicly you want the inside 'trapped' air to escape such that it 'supports' the outside airflow

but ok, its very cool
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Old 29th October 2013, 11:50 AM   #16
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no, you could have increased airflow coming through the ends of each amp module
There is no gap at the end of the modules on the input side, as the edge of the module butts against the back plate, for the XLRs to poke through. And on the front side near the vu-meter, the gap is small, mostly to let the few wires from the transformer come through and leave a little air come in to cool the small heatsink placed on top of the rectifier bridges. The distance between the ends is about 40cm, so that is a very long way for air to flow.

I'll output a top view of that area so you understand how it's layed out inside that case...
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Old 29th October 2013, 11:52 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by spookydd View Post
There is a lid, full of hole, just because it must breathe. There is heat to evacuate all over and the more air flows, the better. It would be a pitty to block that air flow.

Now if you are thinking about someone dropping some tiny metal part through the vent holes on top of the pcb, then it's true this could cause an issue, but who would find something that small and metal, that could pass through those holes, and who would go drop it there? Unless it's done on purpose, I don't see why this would happen in normal use.

Plus, why also block the view from all that electronics inside? That too is a sight that I like in the amp. Seeing the guts of it is a plus to me
I like your amp! But, as mentioned before, I would not use that top cover with that "much" ventilation. I know ventilation is good for the amp, but that much is bad.
How bad? Well it is not only that some kind of metal can go inside by mistake, But also water or any liquid too...ooh and do not forget that "dust" is a bad thing for electronics too and with that much ventilation it will be easy to accumulate dust inside. if you want to see the guts inside your amp....well take a few pictures.
Do not take it wrong, it is a recommendation only...at the end it is your amp and you can do anything you want to it. if amp is well design, the "only" parts that will be hot when it is in use will be the heatsinks and those have to be very well ventilated. My amp is completely sealed and the heatsinks are located on the outside so ventilation is very good and I do not have to worry about dust or liquids splashing inside amp. I would like show the guts of my amp and leave the cover off, but I know it is a bad idea!.
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Old 29th October 2013, 01:09 PM   #18
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I like your amp! But, as mentioned before, I would not use that top cover with that "much" ventilation. I know ventilation is good for the amp, but that much is bad.
How bad? Well it is not only that some kind of metal can go inside by mistake, But also water or any liquid too...ooh and do not forget that "dust" is a bad thing for electronics too and with that much ventilation it will be easy to accumulate dust inside.
I agree for the dust issue, but for the liquids and even food issues, I see that some are working around amps and other such equipments with a beer in their hands and maybe eating food while working on them... That has never been any issue for me and anyone around me, as I would never never be drinking and eating while doing this stuff.

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My amp is completely sealed and the heatsinks are located on the outside so ventilation is very good and I do not have to worry about dust or liquids splashing inside amp.
If you're carrying food and drinks around your amps, that's a concern.

I wanted more heatsink, and I could not put them in such an arrangement with only one sink on each side. This is the classic way of doing it, it's been done for ever...

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I would like show the guts of my amp and leave the cover off, but I know it is a bad idea!.
Why a bad idea? Do you have a beer in your hand right now???
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Old 29th October 2013, 01:58 PM   #19
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Better safe than sorry!
I fixed many amps in the store where I worked and some of them got broken because of the accumulation of dust that shorted out parts inside. Dust plus humidity....it is bad
I had some that had liquid damages (parties, accidents).
I am not saying that your amp will brake because of the "open" chassis, but you should always think the worse case scenario.

PS: I remember one amp that had a lot of dust inside (most parts were under dust) and when I checked the DC offset, it was very high, I vacuumed all that dust. after the boards were cleaned, I checked the bias and Dc offset and guess what?.....all readings came back to original specification
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Old 29th October 2013, 02:13 PM   #20
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Better safe than sorry!
Hee hee, right you are!

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I fixed many amps in the store where I worked and some of them got broken because of the accumulation of dust that shorted out parts inside. Dust plus humidity....it is bad
No kidding!!! I have 2 amps right now that I won't even dare plugging in.

Those amps were sitting unused in a basement (moist) for a good 15-20 years. They are the solid types from the 80s, they don't build them that way any more. Strong amps, robust, and they are enclosed as you mentioned, but the dust and mostly moisture got into them and they are rusted all over the place. Those need a lot of restoration work, but should work again with some TLC!!!

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I had some that had liquid damages (parties, accidents).
I am not saying that your amp will brake because of the "open" chassis, but you should always think the worse case scenario.
Yes, perhaps if they were to be sold on the open market, they could end up being subjected to such stupid abuse. This won't be the case right now, as they're not meant to be sold that way. It's for diy build and usage, and some changes can easily be made in that respect by those who would want to protect against such possibilities.

Even thought they will be used in PA type settings, in a pro environment (discotheque possible) or at least in a semi-DJ type of use, they are not aimed at the average idiot who knows nothing about electronics.

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PS: I remember one amp that had a lot of dust inside (most parts were under dust) and when I checked the DC offset, it was very high, I vacuumed all that dust. after the boards were cleaned, I checked the bias and Dc offset and guess what?.....all readings came back to original specification
I bet!! I worked on some pcbs in a factory, although they were brand new, just made and soldered, some dirt can sometimes come in and ruin the fun. A simple cleaning with freon (no longer available) cleared up issues too...
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