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Old 25th November 2003, 07:25 PM   #1
Asbjorn is offline Asbjorn  Denmark
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Question Best BJT's in the world.

Hi!

I would like you to recommend some bipolar transistors to be used in preamps. Recommendations based on listening tests are of great interest! Have you for instance heard a good preamp, and remember what transistors it used?

/Asbjørn
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Old 30th November 2003, 02:03 PM   #2
Pan is offline Pan  Sweden
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I can imagine the small signal bjt´s LC Audio uses in their Zapfilter would be at the top of the list. Sounds very nice IMO.

/Peter
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Old 30th November 2003, 07:51 PM   #3
sreten is offline sreten  United Kingdom
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Sorry but there is no such thing as the 'best' transistor.

Each part of a pre-amplifier circuit requires transistors suited
to that sub-circuit, getting the the correct type of transistor
for the application is far more important than the actual
transistor used.

You need several 'types' of transistor for pre-amplifier circuits.

If you have the correct type of transistor from a reputable maker
you won't go far wrong. As far as I know no-one has ever claimed
btween the reputable manafactures a particular makers transistor
of a particular type sounds any different to another makers.

Looking at various quality pre-amp designs will quickly identify
the 'usual suspects' to be used in each circuit position.

I'll just add the quality of the circuit design IMO is the
basic feature that determines the sonic characteristics.

/sreten.
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Old 30th November 2003, 10:12 PM   #4
Asbjorn is offline Asbjorn  Denmark
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Quote:
Originally posted by sreten
Sorry but there is no such thing as the 'best' transistor.

Each part of a pre-amplifier circuit requires transistors suited
to that sub-circuit, getting the the correct type of transistor
for the application is far more important than the actual
transistor used.

...

I'll just add the quality of the circuit design IMO is the
basic feature that determines the sonic characteristics.

There is sonic difference between transistors - there really is! In several cases there are alot of types that fits well within an application - and at least I don't know how to tell from the datasheets if for instance the bcx56 i sonically better than the bc850. I believe you have to sit down and listen to them, just as if you were to choose an opamp. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Ofcause the quality of the circuit design is very important, but transistors have some influence too!

/Asbjørn
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Old 30th November 2003, 10:15 PM   #5
Asbjorn is offline Asbjorn  Denmark
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Quote:
Originally posted by Pan
I can imagine the small signal bjt´s LC Audio uses in their Zapfilter would be at the top of the list. Sounds very nice IMO.

/Peter
Hi Peter

How would you describe the sound of the zapfilter, and do you know what transistors i uses? It's hard to tell from their homesite...

/Asbjørn
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Old 1st December 2003, 01:48 PM   #6
sreten is offline sreten  United Kingdom
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Default Hi Asbjorn .......

The actual transistors do matter if the choice of a
type are not direct equivalents of each other.

Then one particular transistor may suit the circuit
better than another, but only in that particular
application IMO. It is not a 'better' transistor than
the others IMO, just better suited in this case.

I did mention reputable makers - because IMO
cheap transistors are absolutely a false economy.

I'd love to see some-one try a build a circuit and
select the the transistors ONLY by listening tests,
would be very amusing.

How do you know that the circuit with a changed
resistor value wouldn't sound better with all the
transistors you've tried - compared to the transistor
you've 'selected' ?

It all gets very silly, very quickly IMO.

/sreten.
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Old 1st December 2003, 09:29 PM   #7
Asbjorn is offline Asbjorn  Denmark
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Default Re: Hi Asbjorn .......

Quote:
Originally posted by sreten
How do you know that the circuit with a changed
resistor value wouldn't sound better with all the
transistors you've tried - compared to the transistor
you've 'selected' ?
Well, within some "limits" a transistor sounds reasonable the same. In practice for instance a transistor without good bass reproduction never gets this just by replacing some resistors. I mean - yes - a transistor sounds different when used with different resistors, but within some "limits" you really are able to hear whether a transistor has some sonic capabilities or not!
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Old 1st December 2003, 11:31 PM   #8
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I agree with sreten. The "best" transistor is no good if your circuit design isn't good. And if your circuit design is good, you will probably find that a wide range of transistors work well in it.

Transistors themselves don't actually have "good" or "not good" bass reproduction--that's a function of the circuit design, too.
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Old 2nd December 2003, 05:30 AM   #9
Asbjorn is offline Asbjorn  Denmark
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Quote:
Originally posted by AudioBob
I agree with sreten. The "best" transistor is no good if your circuit design isn't good. And if your circuit design is good, you will probably find that a wide range of transistors work well in it.

Transistors themselves don't actually have "good" or "not good" bass reproduction--that's a function of the circuit design, too.
That's simply not true. based on countless listening tests I can say for sure that transistors really have a sound of their own (again within som limits)!
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Old 2nd December 2003, 02:34 PM   #10
sreten is offline sreten  United Kingdom
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Quote:
Originally posted by AudioBob
I agree with sreten. The "best" transistor is no good if your circuit design isn't good. And if your circuit design is good, you will probably find that a wide range of transistors work well in it.

Transistors themselves don't actually have "good" or "not good" bass reproduction--that's a function of the circuit design, too.

Don't quite agree with this . if your design is good then you
should know what transistor parameters are important for the
transistors in each application.
Often your choice of transistor is surprisingly limited.

I keep mentioning 'reputable' manafacturers. Even they have
transistors that look good on paper but can exhibit parasitic
effects in some applications - which you obviously don't want.

Re Asbjorn :

If your willing to say this about transistors with near identical
parameters, similar construction and quality control fair enough.

Personally think there must be some real differences between
the transistors you are talking about.

/sreten.
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