The easiest way to identify a fake transistor is to weigh them on a digital gram scale. Please post weights of any output devices that you come up with. I have weighed several varieties of GENUINE Sanken TO3P's.... and they weigh exactly 6 grams. I bought a couple suspected Sanken fakes on ebay from China and will post the weight when they arrive.
Easy way to advise the counterfeiters how to improve their fakes too! You can be sure the Ebay guys follow this forum with translation software.
Fakes are a cat-and-mouse game with the counterfeiters striving to remain one step ahead. We hear of stupid fakes like the ones you refer to but I have seen MT100 (TO3Pn) and MT200 Sanken fakes with similar mass and internal construction to the originals. The difference was the die, bonding and wires.
If you really want to avoid fakes, stop going back to the same bunch of cut-rate sellers and unscrupulous local retailers. Buy from authorized agents or manufacturers since it only takes one batch of fakes to increase the cost to you several times over.
Fakes are a cat-and-mouse game with the counterfeiters striving to remain one step ahead. We hear of stupid fakes like the ones you refer to but I have seen MT100 (TO3Pn) and MT200 Sanken fakes with similar mass and internal construction to the originals. The difference was the die, bonding and wires.
If you really want to avoid fakes, stop going back to the same bunch of cut-rate sellers and unscrupulous local retailers. Buy from authorized agents or manufacturers since it only takes one batch of fakes to increase the cost to you several times over.
As much unlikely that it might be, if you can prove that they are fakes I think RS will happily take some action to fix the problem. Their customer service seems to work to me.
Good suggestion, but a little limited. I would add, together with other big distributors (just on top of my head, without particular order: Digikey, Mouser, RS, Farnell) , the own sites of the manufactrers (i.e. OSEMI). Some of them accept small orders for fair price. There you can get often some free samples, and you have the lowest probability to get fakes.
At the the end what I do not see is any advantage to buy from these unknowns on the Internet.
Where are these fakes made? I mean they're obviously not moulded together at home! So they're being mass produced in a factory somewhere who must also produce 'real' transistors and ICs too... A lot of effort is being expended just to counterfit some transistors. Wondering if there's any way the location of manufacture can be narrowed down by looking at the mouldings of the cases, materials used, a careful look at the insides etc. and working back from there? Surprised the law hasn't gotten involved in some capacity by now and instigated some kind of trace back to the manufacturers. The real manufacturers of transistors must be getting as pissed off as we are by now...
Most fakes are rebadged lesser components .. If the case fits change the nummbers.. The fakers will stop at nothing .. It was recently reported on the NEW's That there was a totally fake apple store full of fake apple goods .. Even the employees belived they where working for apple.. Just goes to show how far they will go.... I have to admit the report did make me chuckle. Just in case someone requires proof her is a link to the report
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-14503724
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-14503724
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The evidence on cracking open a unique case style component like an MT200 Sanken is no....rebadging is not the activity. Due to absurdly thin single layer heat spreaders, tiny 20W die and poor bonding technique, those are deliberate manufactures with the intent to defraud. IOW Fakes!
Where do they come from? Probably even the same fab. that has tendered for or even manufactured similar components under contract.
This goes even further to show that the fakers will stop at nothing .. It is a shame we cannot pay the fakers with countefeit money..That said renumbering componets is a large part of the problem for more common cased components..
In English
Counterfeit Transistors
In Spanish.
Try to translate it because it shows some useful test systems, both destructive and non.
Transistores falsificados
This is google translate:
Poor "me Tarzan you Jane" translation, callas "capability" which is "capacitance" and so on, just read it with a very open mind, but is the best I've found so far.
Traductor de Google
Non destructive include measuring die capacitance (works quite often, because it relates to die size), Hfe/beta (very different from original), etc.
Yes, careful weighting would have worked on some cases, as in those which skimp on the heat spreader size. (or simply don't use it).
Destructive testing rules, of course, and it's what I do: just mount the m*thaf*cka' on a heat sink, with mica, grease, the works, and subject it to torture:
apply rail voltage from the real amp, (remember to fuse the +V rail with a 2 or 3A fuse) and set current to what the datasheet SOA curve says, usually between 1.8 and 3A.
Time how long it takes for an original to die , which can take from 15 minutes to hours.
Fakes often *explode* or crack, or simply short, taking from milliseconds to a couple minutes.
Sure way to separate the men from the boys.
Should I have said "drag queens"?
They show a crude way to do that (which gave me the idea), using 120V and a series bulb, but it's too uncontrolled.
YMMV
Counterfeit Transistors
In Spanish.
Try to translate it because it shows some useful test systems, both destructive and non.
Transistores falsificados
This is google translate:
Poor "me Tarzan you Jane" translation, callas "capability" which is "capacitance" and so on, just read it with a very open mind, but is the best I've found so far.
Traductor de Google
Non destructive include measuring die capacitance (works quite often, because it relates to die size), Hfe/beta (very different from original), etc.
Yes, careful weighting would have worked on some cases, as in those which skimp on the heat spreader size. (or simply don't use it).
Destructive testing rules, of course, and it's what I do: just mount the m*thaf*cka' on a heat sink, with mica, grease, the works, and subject it to torture:
apply rail voltage from the real amp, (remember to fuse the +V rail with a 2 or 3A fuse) and set current to what the datasheet SOA curve says, usually between 1.8 and 3A.
Time how long it takes for an original to die , which can take from 15 minutes to hours.
Fakes often *explode* or crack, or simply short, taking from milliseconds to a couple minutes.
Sure way to separate the men from the boys.
Should I have said "drag queens"?
They show a crude way to do that (which gave me the idea), using 120V and a series bulb, but it's too uncontrolled.
YMMV
The only ones I trust on ebay is Electronics Salon and Audio Wind.
2SA1186 2SC2837 SANKEN Audio Power Transistor, x 2 items in Electronics-Salon store on eBay!
Member
Joined 2009
Paid Member
The best options in my view are:
- don't buy from China, at all.
- don't buy from individuals in general unless the parts are recovered from brand name amps
- some retailers do spend some effort to avoid selling faces, I use DigiKey in U.S.
- avoid using 'boutique' parts, they are the most tempting for fakers
- use vacuum tubes
- don't buy from China, at all.
- don't buy from individuals in general unless the parts are recovered from brand name amps
- some retailers do spend some effort to avoid selling faces, I use DigiKey in U.S.
- avoid using 'boutique' parts, they are the most tempting for fakers
- use vacuum tubes
The application for this machine says counterfeit device screening:
http://www.focalspot.com/pdf/Datasheet-Mini-V.pdf
X-Ray Source: 75kV, 33 micron, not so easy to DIY
http://www.focalspot.com/pdf/Datasheet-Mini-V.pdf
X-Ray Source: 75kV, 33 micron, not so easy to DIY
Member
Joined 2009
Paid Member
They are also made in China.
yes, but you don't need an x-ray machine to see what you got
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