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Old 31st October 2012, 04:17 PM   #1
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Default why do old amps sound is liked by many serious audiophiles even though...

i have seen many talk about the vintage Marantz 170DC or Pioneer 1980 etc

what is so unique of those amps that someone cant build such stuff these days?

I have even seen ceramic and mylar caps in those which are generally not encouraged in audio ckt.

but why does they sound that great that one eventually calling me many times that do you have any old amp like them....

we can get better toroidal these days better caps but whats wrong...

i sometime see the polystyrene capacitors in the old amps is that one of the strong reasons why they sound good?
ofcourse design is one aspect but example...

people say Rotel was good few decades ago but now its not as good as old...

i understand the cost and features competetions but is there anything apart from that what makes them so unique...
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Old 31st October 2012, 04:31 PM   #2
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Originally Posted by rhythmsandy View Post
i have seen many talk about the vintage Marantz 170DC or Pioneer 1980 etc

what is so unique of those amps that someone cant build such stuff these days?
Why build new ones when you can buy the originals on eBay or Craig's List?

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Old 31st October 2012, 06:18 PM   #3
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Personally, I don't know of anyone waxing poetic about early japanese solid state receivers...

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Old 31st October 2012, 06:20 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by rhythmsandy View Post
what is so unique of those amps that someone cant build such stuff these days?

Dunno. Sounded horrible in 1980, still sound horrible today. It's just old geezers going soft in the knees with nostalgia. And, of course, they can finally afford them
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Old 31st October 2012, 06:20 PM   #5
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lol...
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Old 31st October 2012, 06:40 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by rhythmsandy View Post
what is so unique of those amps that someone cant build such stuff these days?......i understand the cost and features competetions but is there anything apart from that what makes them so unique...
Distortion - Older amps used ever different and complex, innovative circuits to woo the public who bought them en masse, not as now, where Home Theatre is king. Some of these old models still sound great to those guys who grew up in that era and even some who are much younger but find the smoother distortion of old amplifiers a pleasant experience. Those amplifiers that didn't really sound so good are often modified with new circuitry or the whole contents of the box is replaced with something better.
To answer your query about building these today, there is little incentive as the electronics wouldn't meet commercial standards and for DIY, they aren't necessarily better sounding than simpler and already popular designs. They are simply available ready built, have stacks of knobs and features and look way better in a retro way, than anything we can build with the same old thick slabs of brushed aluminium. That's all, IMHO.

To paraphrase SE's previous post; Why build new ones when the old ones are still around? They still work and most still look good too.
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Old 31st October 2012, 06:46 PM   #7
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Back in the days, they may have designed by ear and some calculations on a scrap of paper. I did amplifiers that way for a while, then got introduced to the simulator. The simulator can only do so much.......
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Old 31st October 2012, 06:53 PM   #8
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Lets say you have a model m of a real universe U, the model m<= U at any one time. Yes the model does its best to respect U, however.....
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Old 31st October 2012, 07:44 PM   #9
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As an oversimplified example, ...Open up a vintage Marantz 2275 receiver........then open up a current 5, seven channel Name brand receiver.
Comparing the two you will find the Marantz layout logical, orderly...spaced out enough to actually get your fingers inside....the tuner section is clearly marked with silkscreened printing INSIDE showing the various available adjustments....a near total lack of ICs' inside, what ICs exist are of the ful-size DIP versions...........truely an enthusiasts vision to behold.
On the outside, revel at the full-size aluminum brushed knobs, sized all the same, more silkscreened writing...no symbols to dechipher........the pushbutton switches, again sized for regular humans. With the brand of the receiver elegantly written on the front, the model number logically placed thankfully devoid of " RGB nixrr " or some stupid moniker..........a subtle blue glow full length of the tuner.....in analog of course......not some smattering of red, blue or yellow glowing dots.....with the obligitory numerals besides...
Next......open up a current multi-channel set.......marvel at the flat mega-chips, and all the smaller chips that the monster chips seemed to have spawned...those god awful ribbon cables and the ultra billions of SMD devices. Take out the boards & feast your eyes on the bunches more of SMDs.

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Old 31st October 2012, 07:51 PM   #10
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Generally speaking, the build quality and repairability of amps/receivers of the 70s and early 80s is superior to today's units by a wide margin, with a price tag that is an order of magnitude lower even after a restoration. Sound quality is a matter of perception.
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