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Old 18th October 2012, 04:56 PM   #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay View Post
Hehehe...
if you cannot really understand your taste and its relation to circuit, and if you know that you like the darlington amp, I think you owe it to yourself to build the SSA, or any of the CFB amps. Hehehe what else can you use as a guidance?
1)Believe me, some of us know the sound of a circuit simply from looking at the color of the PCB
Hello
I wrote I did built similar amp the Megalith in Class A, it was not a keeper!
The Profet far better amp!
1)These is one of the biggest lie was written on the forum or just simple the biggest joke!
Even the sim result and the listening result not 100%!!!!
Come on please let s remain at the reality
I tested so many similar amp I do not want waste time on the SSA,but because you bugging me probably I'll test it.
Min. I chose JFet on the input. That was a big improvement in may amplifier when I replaced the BC550/560
Which SSA better Sawn or the Nico type???

Greetings Gabor

Last edited by gaborbela; 18th October 2012 at 05:06 PM.
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Old 18th October 2012, 08:20 PM   #112
Jay is offline Jay  Indonesia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gaborbela View Post
Hello
I wrote I did built similar amp the Megalith in Class A, it was not a keeper!
The Profet far better amp!
Min. I chose JFet on the input. That was a big improvement in may amplifier when I replaced the BC550/560
Okay, it seems you like the sound of JFET The CFB has low PSRR and the JFET is low noise. Often you need a very good power supply filtering. But the Megalith uses battery so no issue, unless you didn't build it using battery? (I believe so )

Quote:
Originally Posted by gaborbela View Post
1)These is one of the biggest lie was written on the forum or just simple the biggest joke!
Even the sim result and the listening result not 100%!!!!
Come on please let s remain at the reality
I tested so many similar amp I do not want waste time on the SSA,but because you bugging me probably I'll test it.
You are the one who praised the darlington CFB amp! Yes I know it is class-A, but you can make heavily biased T/SSA, like the one made by Sonnya. Most people I believe will prefer Sonnya's version. That's if you want to build your last solid state amp But you haven't built even F5, have you???

Quote:
Originally Posted by gaborbela View Post
Which SSA better Sawn or the Nico type???
For beginners, Shaan version is easier to get the bias right. Nico's version is more professionally build. But if you're an experienced builder, it doesn't matter which, they have the same topology and you may come to different setting, or cross between the two. In terms of operating point, I think I prefer Shaan's, but I never used the same circuit. I'm after higher power with latfet. For low power I have class-A.

Your darlington circuit has a good characteristics for heavily biased version. I believe it will "work" (tho not professionally) with latfet, where you can decrease the feedback impedance. In my book they are all the same topology.
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Old 18th October 2012, 10:45 PM   #113
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Hello
I do not praise the Darlington, I just wrote the simple facts.
Believe it or not that not makes me happier or frustrated.
I didn't wanted to write about that amp (not even mentioned here) in these thread at all.
To be honest I didn't built the F5 yet (it is a reason, it was compared with the ProFet)
It is not much better at least not with IRF type mosfet, please do not argue over these.
I didn't made the test or these statement not from me. I didn't heard the test!
Reason I'll build my F5 with Toshiba devices.
You right the SSA low power (40W max or less). I think the same way like you, if low powered at least must be Class A.
I'll ask Sakis if he compared to the P3A which one he likes better..
I just don't know why nobody tested JFet in the SSA?? Can be replace one in one no need any mode for the 2SJ74BL/2SK170BL
Just need to be turned 180 degree.
Sound way better than BC550/560.
How much experience do I have? At least 22-23 years. Way over 100 amplifier built or built and just tested. I do not talk about I helped a guy in a TV shop 3 years and repaired a lot of commercial amp to. All do I'm not a technician.
Again I did biased the darlington up to 3A and just little improvment.
It does not worth to take all that heat for that little improvement.
Around 400-500mA sound excellent, but even under 100mA sound very nice.
With low bias it has less problem with the thermal runaway.
The Megalith I built with normal PS not with battery.
Even Ruiz built that amp to his friend with normal PS.
I believe if battery powered is better but that much, no I don't think so
Did you built any KSA clone??

Greetings Gabor
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Old 19th October 2012, 01:27 AM   #114
Jay is offline Jay  Indonesia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gaborbela View Post
Hello
I do not praise the Darlington, I just wrote the simple facts.
I understand. My point is that if you like the sound of the circuit you may want to find out what parameters responsible for that sound.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gaborbela View Post
To be honest I didn't built the F5 yet (it is a reason, it was compared with the ProFet). It is not much better at least not with IRF type mosfet, please do not argue over these. I didn't made the test or these statement not from me. I didn't heard the test!
I didn't try to convince you of anything. I have built many variations of NP amps. The difference is, nothing is ever a surprise for me anymore.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gaborbela View Post
You right the SSA low power (40W max or less). I think the same way like you, if low powered at least must be Class A.
T/SSA is suitable for high power class-A: the distortion doesn't go exponentially with increasing voltage and frequency (like F5).

Quote:
Originally Posted by gaborbela View Post
I'll ask Sakis if he compared to the P3A which one he likes better..
Very good idea!

Quote:
Originally Posted by gaborbela View Post
I just don't know why nobody tested JFet in the SSA?? Can be replace one in one no need any mode for the 2SJ74BL/2SK170BL
Just need to be turned 180 degree.
Sound way better than BC550/560.
I have simulated and yes it is possible. SSA is very symmetrical and require symmetry. Most PJF do not match NJF well. I like BJT than JFET, from dynamic point of view.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gaborbela View Post
Again I did biased the darlington up to 3A and just little improvment.
It does not worth to take all that heat for that little improvement.
Around 400-500mA sound excellent, but even under 100mA sound very nice.
With low bias it has less problem with the thermal runaway.
My simulation showed that the extra bias is required only for high power listening. Especially with such a very high gain setup you don't need it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gaborbela View Post
Did you built any KSA clone??
Yes. After that I'm convinced that both emitters of double EF outputs meeting at the output will create "terrible" sound.
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Old 19th October 2012, 03:43 AM   #115
wahab is offline wahab  Algeria
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay View Post
OTOH, the Hitachi topology has been examined to detail. It is very old topology and has been used many times. You can even add a beta-enhancer for the VAS. An important criteria for this topology is the high voltage rail. Goldmund Mimesis is the best I have seen/tried (as a result of such topology).

Because the other topologies that we can see here and there are recent.??..

Btw, the amp discussed in this thread has as much as 30dB lower
harmonic distorsion residuals at 1khz than the Goldmund Mimesis....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay View Post
Have you tried F5? Tho F5 is very small in power and selective with the speaker, it is an improvement over the Grand Mos and ProFet, in the driving of the latfet (it is a criteria you will find critical in all NP's mosfet amps).
It seems that there s some kind of irrationnal CFB mania that makes
people trust what is actually myths and are left worshipping amps like
tHe Grand Mos , wich has extremely high THD levels such that i wouldnt even
call it HiFi according to current standards , but for some people , no matter
the perfs providing it s a CFB , then it is automaticaly good even if the numbers say completely otherwise.

Same goes for the F5 whose Intermodulation distorsion is huge while
THD ratios are on on par with amps from the 50s/60s , but why complain ,
surely that it "sound good"..
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Old 19th October 2012, 04:06 AM   #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay View Post
I understand.
1) My point is that if you like the sound of the circuit you may want to find out what parameters responsible for that sound.

2)I didn't try to convince you of anything. I have built many variations of NP amps. The difference is, nothing is ever a surprise for me anymore.

T/SSA is suitable for high power class-A: the distortion doesn't go exponentially with increasing voltage and frequency

3)My simulation showed that the extra bias is required only for high power listening. Especially with such a very high gain setup you don't need it.

4)Yes. After that I'm convinced that both emitters of double EF outputs meeting at the output will create "terrible" sound.
Hello Jay
1) I would love to know that me to
2) No need to convince I'm working on at these moment 4 NPass amplifier.
The Aleph2, A40, F5 low power (one pair Toshiba 2SJ201/2SK1530) from 17-18V rail voltage.
F5T V1 with 4 pair Toshiba 2SJ200/2SK1529. I have A 24-0-24VAC 820VA transformer for these project. Need some resistors and right now I work on the enclosure of the amp.
Pass amplifiers are great.
3) That is what I heard, the amp sound excellent biased for a few Watt in to Class A. Even with low bias sound great!
With the right PS and 2 par BDW83C/84C you can get 100W at 4 Ohms.
The amp has more power my speaker can handle.
4) Very bad to know because I have a set stuffed boards.
Thank you
I started to work on the layout of the latest LFet amplifier wahab came up.
Greetings

Last edited by gaborbela; 19th October 2012 at 04:12 AM.
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Old 19th October 2012, 04:28 AM   #117
wahab is offline wahab  Algeria
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There s a little mistake on the final schematic post 99.

R10 and R12 are marked 100K while they should be 33K each.

I re edited the schematic with the correct values.
Attached Images
File Type: gif HITACHI FFET MOD3 SCH.gif (18.1 KB, 313 views)
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Old 19th October 2012, 07:13 AM   #118
gk7 is offline gk7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wahab View Post
...
Same goes for the F5 whose Intermodulation distorsion is huge ...
Do you have any intermodulation distorsion measurements of the F5 to
support this statement ? (havenīt seen any yet.)
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Georg
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Old 19th October 2012, 12:59 PM   #119
wahab is offline wahab  Algeria
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Originally Posted by gk7 View Post
Do you have any intermodulation distorsion measurements of the F5 to
support this statement ? (havenīt seen any yet.)
Only simulations but that s accurate enough to give the trend.

I made a comparison of simulated perfs and the F5 is in line with
what can be extracted from the topology given the components
limitations.

Diy audio popular amps simulations
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Old 19th October 2012, 01:10 PM   #120
gk7 is offline gk7
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Originally Posted by wahab View Post
Ok, so no real world results.
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