While doing some listening today I noticed the LLL LED was flickering, so I guess it's doing its thing just fine. When I finished up the pre I wasn't sure it was working at all or correctly.
Let me first preface my comments with this.... I don't own any high-end gear, or what I like to call esoteric equipment. No Pass Labs amps, ML speakers, or exotic cables. I've been drawn back in to vintage gear, but I think some of my newer and DIY solid-state gear sounds very good indeed. The sounds is not necessarily better, just different. Also, I have not connected up any of my turntables, so I have no comments on how the pre handles LPs, but I can't wait to test that too.
How does it sound? Even with the limited amount of listening I've done, I can heartily say this pre has raised the bar on my stereo rig. I immediately noticed a much more transparent, unveiled sound across the entire frequency range. The tone controls provide a very nice range and you can easily 'dial-in' the exact sound you prefer. I've been leaving them mid-way, which to my ear is where the defeat switch is effective.
With digital sources the sound is very crisp, clear and clean. It's a sound that can be edgy for a lot of people, but I prefer an 'in-your-face' sound. I like to hear the fingers slide on the guitar strings and the breathing of the vocalist.
For me, the mids are right where I like them with a slight emphasis on vocals. The bass appears tight and solid.
My son came in the other day and while I was playing a favorite CD of mine, he said, "Man those vocals sound great. I can hear sounds I've haven't heard on that CD before"! I agree completely. I guess it goes without saying that I am very pleased with the final product and outcome of this project and the sound signature this pre is leaving on my system and more importantly my ears. Kudos again to Doug Self!
Let me first preface my comments with this.... I don't own any high-end gear, or what I like to call esoteric equipment. No Pass Labs amps, ML speakers, or exotic cables. I've been drawn back in to vintage gear, but I think some of my newer and DIY solid-state gear sounds very good indeed. The sounds is not necessarily better, just different. Also, I have not connected up any of my turntables, so I have no comments on how the pre handles LPs, but I can't wait to test that too.
How does it sound? Even with the limited amount of listening I've done, I can heartily say this pre has raised the bar on my stereo rig. I immediately noticed a much more transparent, unveiled sound across the entire frequency range. The tone controls provide a very nice range and you can easily 'dial-in' the exact sound you prefer. I've been leaving them mid-way, which to my ear is where the defeat switch is effective.
With digital sources the sound is very crisp, clear and clean. It's a sound that can be edgy for a lot of people, but I prefer an 'in-your-face' sound. I like to hear the fingers slide on the guitar strings and the breathing of the vocalist.
For me, the mids are right where I like them with a slight emphasis on vocals. The bass appears tight and solid.
My son came in the other day and while I was playing a favorite CD of mine, he said, "Man those vocals sound great. I can hear sounds I've haven't heard on that CD before"! I agree completely. I guess it goes without saying that I am very pleased with the final product and outcome of this project and the sound signature this pre is leaving on my system and more importantly my ears. Kudos again to Doug Self!
One note I forgot to mention earlier... I noticed when testing the balance control that when rotating either to full R, or L, the opposite channel still bleeds through and cannot be totally silenced. Not sure if this is intrinsic in the design, or perhaps as a result of an error in my construction.
Well done Rick!!
I would have to look at the design ( Elektor articles that i have) to answer your balance question. Hardly ever need complete muting of one channel, as it is.
Always a pleasure to listen to the final product after all that hard work. Reminds me of my first pre-amp I did back in College (1979), simple design with the new NE5533 OP-AMP. Thought that it sounded nicer than my Pioneer SX-950 pre-amp section.
Nice to see that Front Panel Express did good job as well. What thickness of Aluminum plate did you specify?
Cheers
Rick Savas
I would have to look at the design ( Elektor articles that i have) to answer your balance question. Hardly ever need complete muting of one channel, as it is.
Always a pleasure to listen to the final product after all that hard work. Reminds me of my first pre-amp I did back in College (1979), simple design with the new NE5533 OP-AMP. Thought that it sounded nicer than my Pioneer SX-950 pre-amp section.
Nice to see that Front Panel Express did good job as well. What thickness of Aluminum plate did you specify?
Cheers
Rick Savas
Hi Rick,
I'm very happy with the results! Frankly, it came out much better (and more costly) than I ever imagined, but then I started work on it back in March - whenever the first Elektor article was published. So I took my sweet time. This DIY process is a lot more involved, and takes longer then building Heathkit's back in the 70's and 80's.
Yes, I'm extremely satisfied with Front Panel Express and their quality product/service. On this project I supplied my own front and rear panels that came on the enclosure I used. You can find it here on eBay if interested. The aluminum plate used for the front panel is 8mm thick. That can present some challenges mounting a lot of standard hardware. My little micro toggle switches were glued from the back using JB Weld metal epoxy.
The 4 pots were mounted using a special 3/8" ring nut in a cavity on the front. But the knobs hide them so it wasn't an issue.
Edit: One more very important thing... This pre is dead silent. I can't hear any hum, or noise whatsoever. And as another posted mentioned to me, it does have a lot of gain. It doesn't take much on the volume control to make it sing.
I'm very happy with the results! Frankly, it came out much better (and more costly) than I ever imagined, but then I started work on it back in March - whenever the first Elektor article was published. So I took my sweet time. This DIY process is a lot more involved, and takes longer then building Heathkit's back in the 70's and 80's.
Yes, I'm extremely satisfied with Front Panel Express and their quality product/service. On this project I supplied my own front and rear panels that came on the enclosure I used. You can find it here on eBay if interested. The aluminum plate used for the front panel is 8mm thick. That can present some challenges mounting a lot of standard hardware. My little micro toggle switches were glued from the back using JB Weld metal epoxy.
The 4 pots were mounted using a special 3/8" ring nut in a cavity on the front. But the knobs hide them so it wasn't an issue.Edit: One more very important thing... This pre is dead silent. I can't hear any hum, or noise whatsoever. And as another posted mentioned to me, it does have a lot of gain. It doesn't take much on the volume control to make it sing.
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In this case (no pun intended), there is an 1/2" aluminum ridge that runs the length of the front plate on the top and bottom used to help support the case top and bottom. And with rectangular plastic housings the switches could not have been screwed in because they rest right on this ridge. I might have been able to raise them up some, but still it would have been a dicey.I can well imagine the costs & time to put it all togther. Glueing the switches, just like the ole days
Cheers
Rick
As I mentioned in another post, this case was just a little to small and having more room on the front(and back) panels would have allowed for more mounting options. Always a good thing when DIY'ing
But, I made it work, even with the tight spaces inside and happy with the result. I think it looks and sounds great!Yes I know what you mean by the mechanical design issues. I have my own dilemma with my latest project. Packaging is a big deal in electronics, most put it off til the end, but actually it should be done first or in parallel with the rest of the design.. Happy to hear about your new project.
Rick
Rick
Really beautiful work!
I have some questions about the front panel.
Case suppliers can typically do front panels with clear or black anodize, and with printing or engraving (and, if engraved, inked or not inked).
Your front panel is clear with inked engraving. Did you look at other options, and, if so, how did you select what you selected? Are you happy with your selection?
Hey Thanks. The project was a long time coming together, but I'm pretty fastidious about things.
See PM I sent you.
Elektor now has an exclusive with Eurocircuits. Actually it helps because it allows a long availability. Single quantity pcb's are expensive period. The problem is the demand is low.
Eurocircuits prices are inline with other suppliers. They are now offering batch services which really helps in prototyping, where pcb prices can be expensive because of setup charges.
One criticism I have, is the amount of pcb's required. For one thing, wiring is best done on the pcb to begin with, minimizes assembly time and errors.
Eurocircuits prices are inline with other suppliers. They are now offering batch services which really helps in prototyping, where pcb prices can be expensive because of setup charges.
One criticism I have, is the amount of pcb's required. For one thing, wiring is best done on the pcb to begin with, minimizes assembly time and errors.
Elektor PCB pricing
Elektor is trying to sell to the DIY market, but there prices are so high that
DIY customers cannot afford to purchase these PCB's. If they priced their
PCB at a level that DIY people can afford, they would sell many more
PCB's and sell more magazines. Elektor says it's the quality of their PCB
is the reason there PCB's cost so much. I have purchased many PCB's
via DIYAUDIO.COM Group Buys and the quality of these PCB have been
outstanding and even better than Elektor PCB's.
Using their from America has not worked via well. I have tried to order
a few PCB from Elektor's PCB service. I'm in the USA and the VAT does not
apply, but each time I tried to check out, it kept saying I was from Europe
and added back the VAT. I wish Elekor would work on their PCB. In addition,
add support for group buys from DIY groups via the Internet. I stopped buying
from Elektor because of these and other problems.
Elektor is trying to sell to the DIY market, but there prices are so high that
DIY customers cannot afford to purchase these PCB's. If they priced their
PCB at a level that DIY people can afford, they would sell many more
PCB's and sell more magazines. Elektor says it's the quality of their PCB
is the reason there PCB's cost so much. I have purchased many PCB's
via DIYAUDIO.COM Group Buys and the quality of these PCB have been
outstanding and even better than Elektor PCB's.
Using their from America has not worked via well. I have tried to order
a few PCB from Elektor's PCB service. I'm in the USA and the VAT does not
apply, but each time I tried to check out, it kept saying I was from Europe
and added back the VAT. I wish Elekor would work on their PCB. In addition,
add support for group buys from DIY groups via the Internet. I stopped buying
from Elektor because of these and other problems.
Look at Q-watt & 500ppm LCR meter
Eurocircuits :: View article details
110656-1
Original price : 18.05 EUR 25% Discount (Valid till end of November 2013)
Price : 13.54 EUR VAT : (0.00%) 0.00 EUR Gross price : 13.54 EUR
Also 2 boards for 500ppm
Total price 54.82
You call that expensive? I don't.
Parts cost for 500ppm LCR meter, I think it was around $250 USD.
Eurocircuits :: View article details
110656-1
Original price : 18.05 EUR 25% Discount (Valid till end of November 2013)
Price : 13.54 EUR VAT : (0.00%) 0.00 EUR Gross price : 13.54 EUR
Also 2 boards for 500ppm
Total price 54.82
You call that expensive? I don't.
Parts cost for 500ppm LCR meter, I think it was around $250 USD.
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Elektor is trying to sell to the DIY market, but there prices are so high that
DIY customers cannot afford to purchase these PCB's. If they priced their
PCB at a level that DIY people can afford, they would sell many more
PCB's and sell more magazines. Elektor says it's the quality of their PCB
is the reason there PCB's cost so much. I have purchased many PCB's
via DIYAUDIO.COM Group Buys and the quality of these PCB have been
outstanding and even better than Elektor PCB's.
Using their from America has not worked via well. I have tried to order
a few PCB from Elektor's PCB service. I'm in the USA and the VAT does not
apply, but each time I tried to check out, it kept saying I was from Europe
and added back the VAT. I wish Elekor would work on their PCB. In addition,
add support for group buys from DIY groups via the Internet. I stopped buying
from Elektor because of these and other problems.
I vaguely remember I had some trouble checking out on Elektor's website after purchasing the first PCB in the DS series, a couple years ago, but figured it out. All the boards are expensive, but I figured it was the price of admission for the project. It was my first DS project and took several months to build. Anyway, I was delighted with the results - albeit the project turned out to be much bigger and involved than originally anticipated. My only mistake was an op-amp inserted wrong. No damage was done and easily rectified once I found the culprit.
Rick
In the Elektor Preamplifier 2012 article it doesn't list anything of the type of cable/interconnections to use, so for wiring up my nearly finished PCB's looks a difficult task.
I see you've used ribbon cable.
Is this available from Farnell?
that's alot of op amps in there.
I don't see a schematic for this preamp.
I'm using 3 op amps. 1 in the FM tuner , 1 in the phono preamp (MM) and 1 before the volume pot.
A 6922 tube provides the amplification after the pot feeding passive tone then power amp.
I can't see how this preamp would outperform mine @ 110db CD / AUX signal / noise and virtually no op amp distortion. , plus tube warmth and musicality.
I don't see a schematic for this preamp.
I'm using 3 op amps. 1 in the FM tuner , 1 in the phono preamp (MM) and 1 before the volume pot.
A 6922 tube provides the amplification after the pot feeding passive tone then power amp.
I can't see how this preamp would outperform mine @ 110db CD / AUX signal / noise and virtually no op amp distortion. , plus tube warmth and musicality.
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