New Patent Laws

[Conrad Hoffman]

I'm not saying it never happens, but the percentage of patents that ever make any money for the person filing is pretty small. It's sort of like deciding to get rich by becoming a pro basketball player. There's a huge amount of luck involved beyond just having the basic talent.

 

[SY]

I'm not saying it never happens, but the percentage of patents that ever make any money for the person filing is pretty small.

There I'll agree. Just because something is novel doesn't mean anyone wants it.

 

[Pano]

Ha!

I have very little experience with patents, but did try to file one once. It was for a process, not a device. Having to do with railway locomotives.
Fortunately an old friend of the family is a big patent and IP attorney in L.A. He said "Forget it." Even tho no one is using it that way, it still not a non-obvious use of the technology (I thought it was). Good idea, but not novel enough to get a patent.

So not all patent attorneys push for frivolous patents, quite the opposite.

 

[Trevor White]

Not been my experience. I'm not little (six foot, 210 lb), but I've seen lots of independent inventors rake in money from large companies. The cost of litigating against infringement claims is much higher than paying some royalty or "go away" money. In one case I was involved with, an independent inventor with a totally bogus patent raked in $3.5MM from a megacorp (rhymes with "dicroloft") after spending about a year running up their litigation tab. Now admittedly, his attorneys got 40% for contingency, but $2.1MM net for a year plus perhaps $4k in patent costs is a nice ROI.

The basic message is correct: what a patent is, fundamentally, is a license to sue.

That's totally contrary to what Don Lancaster says on his website:-

"Guru's Lair: Patent Avoidance Library"

For most individuals and small scale startups, patents are virtually
certain to result in a net loss of time, energy, money, and sanity.

One reason for this is the outrageously wrong urban lore involving
patents and patenting. A second involves the outright scams which
inevitably surround "inventions" and "inventing".

A third is that the economic breakeven needed to recover patent costs
is something between $12,000,000.00 and $40,000,000 in gross sales.

It is ludicrously absurd to try and patent a million dollar idea.

This library explores many tested and fully proven real-world alternates
to patents and patenting.

 

[SY]

Unlike Don, I'm not trying to sell books. His view here is either grossly outdated or far too narrow.

 

[Trevor White]

Unlike Don, I'm not trying to sell books. His view here is either grossly outdated or far too narrow.

but you don't have to buy any of his books to read what he has written on his website.

which part of what he has written don't you agree with ??

regards
Trev

 

[JLH]

I have a friend that has invented a new kind of power tool. He tried to shop the idea around to the major tool companies. Dewalt is interested, but wanted him to get a patent on it first. They were only interested in licensing the technology. My friend told me that it will cost him $12,000 to get his patent. He's not going through an expensive law firm. In fact he is trying to do as much himself as he can. However, the system is setup such that you better have a very well vetted patent application otherwise it will be rejected and you'll be out of a lot of money. If anyone has been able to get a patent approved for anything under $2000 I’d like to talk to that person and forward them onto my friend.

The European system makes it expensive for independent inventors. But (and I say this having some experience), an independent inventor can get a US patent for under $2000 and an EU patent for under $10k. There's no rule that you have to pay top dollar for a law firm, most of it can be done yourself and/or by a patent agent (much cheaper than an attorney). Strategically, that's not the path to take, you'll do much better filing a provisional ($100), then spend the year of breathing room that it gives you trying to find a licensee.

If you go the patent route, all that money doesn't have to be spent at once, it's cumulative over 4-5 years or so. If a big company starts infringing in the meantime, it's very easy to get investment or representation on contingency since there's $$$ at the end. I would LOVE to have someone like Microsoft rip me off, that's money in the bank.

 

[Conrad Hoffman]

I don't think it can be done for $2k. The patents I've been involved with were at least $5k and probably over $10k when all was said and done. And that was a few years ago. You might do better if you know the ins and outs and can do every single thing yourself, but almost nobody is in a position to do that. BTW, I agree with Don Lancaster 100%.

 

[SY]

My friend told me that it will cost him $12,000 to get his patent. He's not going through an expensive law firm.

Clearly it IS an expensive firm. I've been through the process a few times and have a relatively good idea of costs.

First, he can do a provisional application himself. That will cost him $100. At that point, he has a year to shop his invention around before he has to file a "real" application.

Second, no matter how well vetted, the first "real" application WILL be rejected. Your friend will have to go back and forth with the examiner a few times to get the claim language and coverage to be satisfactory to him/her. If you have an idiot examiner, it will tax one's patience, but if you have a good examiner, you'll end up honing the claims to something quite strong. Since patent records are on-line your friend can do the searching himself, or hire a good search guy for about $500 (unless the claims are extensive and esoteric). But, at that point, he will have had a chance to show his invention and get an idea what his reception will be. If he's got a bite, he can pay a lawyer- if he doesn't, he can make an informed decision whether it's worth the effort.

I can't speak to the wisdom of his monetization strategy (i.e., showing it to some large tool companies in hopes of a license).