SAE 2200. Could use some hints. - Page 2 - diyAudio
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Old 7th September 2011, 11:14 AM   #11
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Before you go replacing every darn thing on the board why don't you beg or borrow a VOM meter. It is very simple to test the junctions of transistors and even simpler to test resistors. Open up any ECG or NTE catalog and there is a short course on checking transistors. Google checking transistors and I'm sure you will find something there also. This is not rocket science and anyone capable of using a meter should be able to repair this primitive amp.

There is another thread if you bothered looking... Repairing SAE 2200 started around 2002

I suggest that you read thru it also.

Last edited by Original Burnedfingers; 7th September 2011 at 11:17 AM.
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Old 7th September 2011, 02:47 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 6BG6GA View Post
Before you go replacing every darn thing on the board why don't you beg or borrow a VOM meter. It is very simple to test the junctions of transistors and even simpler to test resistors. Open up any ECG or NTE catalog and there is a short course on checking transistors. Google checking transistors and I'm sure you will find something there also. This is not rocket science and anyone capable of using a meter should be able to repair this primitive amp.

There is another thread if you bothered looking... Repairing SAE 2200 started around 2002

I suggest that you read thru it also.
I've "bothered" to look for and read all of them. I have a Fluke 70 and am very capable with it. I have also known how to check transistors for about 25 years. This is just one of my many hobbies. The amp is so simple, I thought I would compile a parts list that might help others in the future. The list is so short, I thought I would price a complete components replacement. All of this information is available in a few places. I'm just trying to get it into one place. I think the components will be cheap. I really don't see myself desoldering/soldering all of them. But you never know.

Steve
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Old 7th September 2011, 11:04 PM   #13
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Sorry about that.

From your earlier posts it didn't sound as if you had much experience. My suggestion is relace all the electrolytics on the driver boards as well as the small transistors (TO92's) replace the bias transistor on the heat sink as well as the outputs and insulators. I'm making this suggestion because of the age of the amplifier and the fact that I'm sure you do not want it to nickle and dime you to death in the future. Remember to check all the diodes also that are on the driver board. Remember that ther is a missprint on the schematic if my memory is correct. When your done either employ the light bulb trick or use a variac just to be safe.

To answer your question there is no answer as to what is going to need to be replaced because when they go up in a puff of smoke they don't all take the same path.
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Old 11th January 2012, 05:07 AM   #14
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Update. It's alive! I ended up replacing all the electrolytics (except for the big pair) with cerafines. 3 resistors. Two small transistors in the limiting circuit. The four drivers and the four finals(all On Semi). I got it all back together and brought it up with a variac. The relay clicked(never did before) and nothing smoked! I wanted to check with a cheap speaker and I didn't feel like carrying it down to hook up to my pre. I hooked my phone up and played some music. Both channels work. No bad leds. It's dead quiet when the input signal was nil. Is there a procedure to set the bias? I imagine I'm just looking for a certain voltage at some point in the circuit and use the pots to get it there?
Thanks,
Steve
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Old 12th May 2012, 09:00 AM   #15
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Question This seems like a really good amp...

I have the possibility to acquire one of these amps. This one works, yet needs quite a bit of input gain, (more then 1.5 volts) and has bulb tester issues.

My system is a PC based source thru an M-Audio DAC on Avebury Speakers. I am currently using 40 watt chip amps, but the Aveburys could use more power on dynamic peaks. The chip amps sound more transparent then this SAE 2200 in its current condition. But I like the power and body of the SAE 2200. Is it worth restoring this amp? My gut is telling me this amp has a lot of potential.

Thoughts anyone???

Allen
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Old 12th May 2012, 09:32 AM   #16
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It has a lot of potential, but is not the best on 4Ω loads.

I suggest replacing the electrolytics in the signal path first (8x 100F/10V), and consider tacking a film bypass across them.
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Old 14th May 2012, 02:52 AM   #17
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Default Thanks for your reply djk

I have done more research on this amp and from the responses I am gathering from the other thread I am involved in here at diyaudio, I am getting the impression that if I was to put in the time, money and effort to restore a vintage amp like this, I am better off going with a Kenwood M2/M2a or Yamaha B1/B2. The SAE needs a high gain pre-amp by design (the SAE pre-amps of this generation had peak outputs of 9 volts!). I read that the SAE is not as reliable as its comtempories, but how does that apply to the sound?

As far as 4 ohm loads go, the Avebury Speakers I am using are a full-range backloaded double mouth horn system using the Alpair 12 driver rated at 8 ohms. I prefer if an amp can handle lower loads to handle future builds.

So with these cavets in place, is the SAE 2200 worth overhualing, or would I be better off restoring a Kenwood or Yamaha? I am being lead to believe the latter is the way to go...

The SAE amp I have is a freind's. He loaned it to me to give it a quick look over so that he could sell it... (Maybe to me)

Allen
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Old 14th May 2012, 07:04 AM   #18
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The B2 outputs are basically not available. If you blow one, the amp is scrap.

The outputs for the M2 are not common, and very expensive when you find them. The last one I fixed I was barely able to recover the repair cost after it was abandoned by the owner and I had to sell it.

They aren't much newer than the SAE.

I would rather have the SAE.

The gain of the SAE is 26dB, that's standard. It will be 3dB into clipping when driven by a CD with peaks at digital 0, so all you need is a passive volume control to get full output, no preamp is required.

If you replace the stock outputs (usually the 2SD424/2SB554) with MJ21193/94 it would handle a 4Ω load.
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Old 15th May 2012, 07:45 AM   #19
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The gain of the SAE is 26dB, that's standard. It will be 3dB into clipping when driven by a CD with peaks at digital 0, so all you need is a passive volume control to get full output, no preamp is required.
Okay, I gave that a shot. I hooked up a Pioneer CLD-3070 laser disk player thru my lightspeed attentuator into the SAE, and got full output. At full output, it sounded like the SAE was struggling, esp with bass. I then hooked up a dummy load and ran 100, 1000, and 10,000 Hz tones thru the SAE at full power (100 watts). I only measured 23.13 volts (66 watts) and that kept gradually decreasing... So needless to say, I have not really heard this amp at it's full potential. I like the resolution and spaciousness of my chip amps, but I like the body and "meat" of this amp. So if I where to undergo the process of overhualing this amp, will I attain the best of both worlds?

I am really considering this, as I am not interested in hard to get parts.

How does the SAE sound compared to the Kenwoods and Yamahas? If they are similiar, then I will commit to this amp.

Thanks djk,

Allen
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Old 15th May 2012, 08:16 AM   #20
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It sounds like it may need all the electrolytics replaced.

A friend of mine likes his, it replaced his B2 that broke.

The meters are way sexy on the B2, but the parts just aren't available.

He uses a Conrad Johnson preamp, a table with a Shure V15 type 5 on it, and Spectrum 208B loudspeakers. His system is very listenable.
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