Reverse engineers, I have a project for you...

[cmjohnson]

Are you good at reverse engineering solid state amplifiers when you have the circuit board(s) in hand?

Do you have an interest in reverse engineering some boards that are from a well known high end manufacturer of solid state amplifiers, that I shall not name on the board?


If so, check in here, or send me a private message. If you're able to take a board and map it, your help will be appreciated. All those who participate will get to share the results before anyone else.

For some boards, the ability to map out and understand digital control systems will be an absolute requirement. Other boards are dead simple, as simple as a board stuffed full of large reservoir capacitors, with just a couple of resistors and wires added in.

The amplifier in question is going to be in the 400 watt class, or larger, with fully balanced differential cascoded output circuitry, operating in pure class A at multiple program dependent bias levels. Output device type is OnSemi MJW21195/96 complementary bipolar power transistors, a few dozen per channel.

If you're interested in taking part in a project to reverse engineer a true high end heavyweight amp, PM me about this.

Your reverse engineering efforts should yield accurate schematics that can be followed, and generating comparable circuit board files is a bonus but not necessary.

CJ

[ontoaba]

I like reverse engineering of good amps, and examining where the good sounds coming from.
Sadly, you are far away, and I am on my own project..

[Audia]

I can help.

[mickeymoose]

I have done my share of reverse engineering for personal enlightenment. But if the info gained is used for commercial purposes it could be considered theft. E

[bear]

Why don't you just say what amp you are looking at?
It may have been covered already here on DiyAudio... save you a whole lot of effort.

_-_-bear

[Jay]

Originally Posted by cmjohnson

If you're interested in taking part in a project to reverse engineer a true high end heavyweight amp

That's the problem. True high end is subjective. Many high end amp circuits are already available on the internet. Enthusiasm on this project most probably be based on financial reason, not the amp itself.

It takes me only a few hours to reverse engineer circuits, as long as the PCB is not double sided (coz I cannot see the PCB trace under components especially the through-holes under an IC)

[Nico Ras]

Since the discovery of the photo copier reverse engineering is no art. Take a picture of the built PCB write down all the component values. This becomes the overlay.

Remove all components and photocopy (or if you have a modern facility consisting of a PC, scanner and printer) scan top and bottom of the PCB on overhead film. Produce the PCBs and populate them as per the photograph - the Chinese did this for years, why bother with a circuit if you can produce working clones. Would a schematic make any difference?

On the other hand design your own high end amplifier, it is a lot more satisfying knowing that what you have is your own rather than stealing another man's hard work.

[DF96]

My guess is that a PCB layout is covered by copyright law. I think that means that, at least in Europe, copying a PCB is unlawful (as would be copying a circuit diagram). Reverse engineering is specifically allowed, but only for the purpose of interfacing to the product without necessarily gaining the manufacture's permission. Product cloning is illegal. In theory the Chinese are now signatories to the international copyright convention (Berne?) but in practice they seem to ignore it.

[jcx]

Originally Posted by mickeymoose

I have done my share of reverse engineering for personal enlightenment. But if the info gained is used for commercial purposes it could be considered theft. E

anything that can be discovered by any level of inspection of a legally purchased product is considered "published" under patent law - it is "prior art"

the accumulation of knowledge thru adoption/adaptation of commercially successful designs/techniques is a major part of technology advancement

your only protection for "intellectual property" are active patents, copyrights, trade secret agreements/license contract terms - although copyright has been extended, twisted to cover software products with new legal limits on "inspecting" copy protection

US patents bar "make, build, use" of the protected inventions

an exact copy of a PCB may be covered under copyright, as would the manufacturer's service manual schematics - even there you are allowed (under copyright) "fair use" copies for your private use - not distribution
but it is perfectly legal to reverse engineer and post/publish your own drawing of the exact circuit schematic or to layout your own version of the PCB - as long as it isn't an exact copy/"mechanical derivation"

[MiiB]

getting something on the expense of others is crap....and moderaters should not allow posts/threads like this.....

inspiration and development is one thing... stealing designs and rights is absolutely not ok....