Poor damping factor due to crossover?

moschfet · 4th February 2011, 03:26 PM

Will the damping factor of an amplifier is not made again by the resistors in the crossover to naught?

AndrewT · 4th February 2011, 03:40 PM

The speaker designer/manufacturer will, or should, design the crossover and how it integrates with the drivers using normal amplifiers for the market that he has targeted for his speaker.
They may even try to make their speaker work well with all reasonable quality amplifiers or even target their speaker performance to sound good with really poor performing amplifiers.

The designer makes that choice and it takes account of how the target customers will hook up their speakers.

Nrik · 4th February 2011, 04:20 PM

yes you are right - Use active crossovers!
Once you hear the improvement you will never allow passive crossover components in series with your speakerunits again.

Charles Darwin · 4th February 2011, 04:21 PM

What he ^^ said!

Groove-T · 4th February 2011, 04:36 PM

First the speakercable set down the damping factor, connectors do not make it better, and even if you use lowest loss x-over components, the factor will be reduced usually down to 10 in the real world, may be 20 in best case.

moschfet · 4th February 2011, 05:37 PM

No one has an argument for passive speakers in the high-end segment. That reassures me to hear

The next Amp I will construct is a high quality modul for aktive load.

djk · 06:57 PM

The DCR of the woofer inductor is the biggest problem.

The total series resistance should give a minimum damping factor of 20, or it has to be factored into the box design.

Remember, box size is roughly proportional to the square of the Qts, and that series resistance raises this. Going from a Qts of 0.3 to 0.4 can almost double the required box size.

BobEllis · 4th February 2011, 07:03 PM

I prefer active systems as well, but IMHO, damping factor is often overrated.

Extremely high damping factors are usually the result of very high amounts of global negative feedback. There are well regarded amplifiers like this as well as those with modest damping factors. Some amps are designed with intentionally low damping factors and work remarkably well with some full range drivers.

So, yes build more amps so you can make active systems. If high damping factor floats your boat, then by all means choose designs with that characteristic. But don't be afraid to try an amp with a lower damping factor. You may like it.

moschfet · 4th February 2011, 08:17 PM

I am not narrow-minded, and yes, I have heard a Tube-Amp on passiv speakers and it sounds fantastic.

Even with crossover.

4th February 2011, 03:26 PM	#1
moschfet diyAudio Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Hannover	Poor damping factor due to crossover? Will the damping factor of an amplifier is not made again by the resistors in the crossover to naught?

4th February 2011, 03:40 PM	#2
AndrewT diyAudio Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Scottish Borders	The speaker designer/manufacturer will, or should, design the crossover and how it integrates with the drivers using normal amplifiers for the market that he has targeted for his speaker. They may even try to make their speaker work well with all reasonable quality amplifiers or even target their speaker performance to sound good with really poor performing amplifiers. The designer makes that choice and it takes account of how the target customers will hook up their speakers. __________________ regards Andrew T.

4th February 2011, 04:20 PM	#3
Nrik diyAudio Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Copenhagen	yes you are right - Use active crossovers! Once you hear the improvement you will never allow passive crossover components in series with your speakerunits again. __________________ STOP - Hammertime!

4th February 2011, 06:55 PM	#7
djk diyAudio Member Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: USA	The DCR of the woofer inductor is the biggest problem. The total series resistance should give a minimum damping factor of 20, or it has to be factored into the box design. Remember, box size is roughly proportional to the square of the Qts, and that series resistance raises this. Going from a Qts of 0.3 to 0.4 can almost double the required box size. __________________ Candidates for the Darwin Award should not read this author. Last edited by djk; 4th February 2011 at 06:57 PM.

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4th February 2011, 04:21 PM	#4
Charles Darwin diyAudio Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Birmingham, UK	What he ^^ said!

4th February 2011, 04:36 PM	#5
Groove-T diyAudio Member Join Date: Apr 2008	First the speakercable set down the damping factor, connectors do not make it better, and even if you use lowest loss x-over components, the factor will be reduced usually down to 10 in the real world, may be 20 in best case.

4th February 2011, 05:37 PM	#6
moschfet diyAudio Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Hannover	No one has an argument for passive speakers in the high-end segment. That reassures me to hear The next Amp I will construct is a high quality modul for aktive load.

4th February 2011, 07:03 PM	#8
BobEllis diyAudio Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Upstate NY	I prefer active systems as well, but IMHO, damping factor is often overrated. Extremely high damping factors are usually the result of very high amounts of global negative feedback. There are well regarded amplifiers like this as well as those with modest damping factors. Some amps are designed with intentionally low damping factors and work remarkably well with some full range drivers. So, yes build more amps so you can make active systems. If high damping factor floats your boat, then by all means choose designs with that characteristic. But don't be afraid to try an amp with a lower damping factor. You may like it.

4th February 2011, 08:17 PM	#9
moschfet diyAudio Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Hannover	I am not narrow-minded, and yes, I have heard a Tube-Amp on passiv speakers and it sounds fantastic. Even with crossover.

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