Hi guys, I recently heard a rumor that class A electronics are going to be outlawed as anything that consumes full power while idle is to be discontinued. is there any truth to this? I mean it wouldnt surprise me the way things are going and until they start sending out inspectors I dont think us DIYers have much to worry about, plus of course a solution is to simply power down the unit when not in use.
but this could end in tears
but this could end in tears
If you had stated that it was coming out of California. I wouldn't have doubted it for a moment.
Hehehe, no ****!
se
It would be difficult to define idle. For a Class A amplifier, when does "idle" begin and "listening at really low volume" end? Or if I'm playing music while I'm out of the house, is my amplifier really being "used"?
Personally, I suspect this is gossip. The situation is totally different for equipment that has a standby mode, but that's not the case here.
The best analogy is probably the car industry - you can still buy a gas guzzler, even if govt. would prefer you didn't.
Nigel
Personally, I suspect this is gossip. The situation is totally different for equipment that has a standby mode, but that's not the case here.
The best analogy is probably the car industry - you can still buy a gas guzzler, even if govt. would prefer you didn't.
Nigel
I have heard something like this happening in Australia in the future. I think I may have read it in Australian Hifi magazine.
The challenge is to design stuff which is both efficient and performs equally well if not better
That shouldn't be hard regards
trev
As said by Trevor White, in the latest Australian hifi mag, there was a review on a Class A amp, and as part of the review the writer mentioned the bringign in of new laws in Australia that will set new efficiency standards for all consumer electronic equipment which will basically outlaw all Class A amplifiers, and even some Class A/B amps.
But this won't stop DIYers!
But still it will be a shame to loose all that lovely equipment to the market.
But this won't stop DIYers!
But still it will be a shame to loose all that lovely equipment to the market.
I suspect this is wishful thinking on the part of the review writer. I've seen nothing on this anywhere.
I think also that laws should be introduced rationing hydrocarbon fuels (or their equivalents) for domestic households/vehicles of no more than 50 litres per week, including electricity, gas, and the energy content intrinsic in desalinated water.
Honestly, the use of energy by modern societies is clearly wrong, and should be immediately curtailed. Laws should be passed, with stiff penalties.....
This is frightfully important. There should be a G8 summit about this.
I think also that laws should be introduced rationing hydrocarbon fuels (or their equivalents) for domestic households/vehicles of no more than 50 litres per week, including electricity, gas, and the energy content intrinsic in desalinated water.
Honestly, the use of energy by modern societies is clearly wrong, and should be immediately curtailed. Laws should be passed, with stiff penalties.....
This is frightfully important. There should be a G8 summit about this.
It sounds like just a silly urban legend trying to get started. There's plenty of electronics that 'consumes full power at idle', including almost all digital that will never be outlawed.
Indeed, class A amp are often power hogs.
I understand such designs at low powers, about 10 W rms is
a maximum for a push pull topology which is more efficient
than single ended siblings.
Besides, where is the quality of class A when one propose a single
ended design that yield 1 % distorsion (recently impoved to 0.25%)
at a power output of 1 W rms and with a TDP of 60W ?...
The extra consumed energy is not synonym of quality.
Seems people prefer amps that run hot, the style " hey , wait, it s
warm, i can hear it breathe, it s alive !!!"...........
I understand such designs at low powers, about 10 W rms is
a maximum for a push pull topology which is more efficient
than single ended siblings.
Besides, where is the quality of class A when one propose a single
ended design that yield 1 % distorsion (recently impoved to 0.25%)
at a power output of 1 W rms and with a TDP of 60W ?...
The extra consumed energy is not synonym of quality.
Seems people prefer amps that run hot, the style " hey , wait, it s
warm, i can hear it breathe, it s alive !!!"...........
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interesting idea, but I imagine our banker friends would rather we just paid for addditional carbon credits rather than limit them, or am I just being cynical
If its true then it would probably only apply to mass manufacture.
Its the same for EMC and power factor rules, they dont apply to prototypes.
A very quick google search reveales
Products Being Considered for Regulation
E3 Committe Cost-Benefit Analysis: MEPS and Alternative Strategies for Home Entertainment Products
What's New
A draft proposal for: Minimum Energy Performance Standards for Home Entertainment Equipment
Standby Power
Electronic Library
Standby Power - Product Profiles
I'm not going to go through and point out all the particular areas of interest but in 15mins I'm sure you can see there is definite reason for concern.
But as stated earlier I doubt DIYers have any reason for concern, it's a bit hard to regulate DIYers.
Products Being Considered for Regulation
E3 Committe Cost-Benefit Analysis: MEPS and Alternative Strategies for Home Entertainment Products
What's New
A draft proposal for: Minimum Energy Performance Standards for Home Entertainment Equipment
Standby Power
Electronic Library
Standby Power - Product Profiles
I'm not going to go through and point out all the particular areas of interest but in 15mins I'm sure you can see there is definite reason for concern.
But as stated earlier I doubt DIYers have any reason for concern, it's a bit hard to regulate DIYers.
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ok plenty of replies, sorry been out all day and this was started just before I went to bed at 7am. right yeah like I said i'm just seeing if anyone else had heard this rumour. like I said it really doesnt effect us in DIY unless they start to send inspectors around unannounced they are in fact trying to do away with things that sleep; things of all sorts not just amps but Tvs computers etc.
for instance I really dont know how much they would think of the latest dac build i'm working on, using 3 transformers, 4 regulated supplies and 8-9 shunt regs; all to power a set of highly efficient custom in ear monitors (JH13) with an impedance of 28 ohms. I will also be using it with powered studio monitors and some less efficient headphones, but I have a feeling it may be frowned upon. the whole discrete output stage will be running in class A. but when i'm not using it, it will be off, so hopefully there goes that anyway.
they are in fact trying to do away with things that sleep; things of all sorts not just amps but Tvs computers etc.for instance I really dont know how much they would think of the latest dac build i'm working on, using 3 transformers, 4 regulated supplies and 8-9 shunt regs; all to power a set of highly efficient custom in ear monitors (JH13) with an impedance of 28 ohms. I will also be using it with powered studio monitors and some less efficient headphones, but I have a feeling it may be frowned upon. the whole discrete output stage will be running in class A. but when i'm not using it, it will be off, so hopefully there goes that anyway.
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The only true thing that i have seen happening is power factor correction for smps. As of now half the power they suck cant be used or billed to the customer. In the uk i believe if it is an external smps or a 300watt+ internal smps it has to have power correction.
Also based on the standby (which i hate, ive seen tvs suck 40watts OFF at the shop) i think all diy is good and green. Really who as a diy that sits in standby mode?
Also based on the standby (which i hate, ive seen tvs suck 40watts OFF at the shop) i think all diy is good and green. Really who as a diy that sits in standby mode?
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interesting, i'm pretty ignorant when it comes to SMPS, so i'm not really savvy of what you mean. so the power is not used but it cannot be recycled into the grid??
yeah no way would I ever build a sleep function. I think its evil as nobody benefits at all.
With all due respect, it would go a long way if anybody actually spent 2 seconds to READ this stuff so we can just avoid all the freak-out conspiracy theory FoxNews-style panic.
- First of all - open the links and check the dates... this stuff is all 2006-2007-2008. Old news. Way old news.
- More importantly and the bottom line: As others have pointed out this is ONLY aimed at power-sucking standby mode equipment bu11shi4. Not a bad idea at all really. That is NOT "class A draws power at no signal", but "unit draws power when consumer has unit 'switched off'". End. Of. Story.
- Even if it didn't also as pointed out this stuff virtually never applies to DIY anyway. aka I'm off to solder with lead. Weeee!
- Aside from standby the only other thing that might REALLY happen would be like more 'Energy Star' and nutritional labeling - aka consumer information & voluntary standard compliance rather than hard-regulation. Again not bad idea, and again, nothing to do with DIY. So your hipster booteek Class A tube amp would have some big "sucks lots of power not green!" label on it and nobody who would ever want to buy one would ever care (in fact they'd probably love it...)
Power factor is the offset of current vs voltage in power supply due to either a inductive or capacitive load. Most smps have a power factor of 0.5. So they suck 1amp, but the generator has to supply 2amps, and they can only bill you for 1amp. The generator supplies volts-amps but they can only bill you for watts.
The other way to thing about it is a mug of beer:
The glass is how much VA your need to run your stuff
the beer is watts the power company can bill you for
the foam is how much extra VA the power company must give you for free to keep your glass full
The beer and foam cost the power company the same amount to produce
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