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Old 4th November 2009, 11:42 AM   #1
ataul is offline ataul  Bangladesh
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Default Need Better power amp for active x'over.

Hi friends
I have decided to make an active crossover setup for my personal listening.
I prefer good vocal and clean deep bass sound for classical music after many times spending to searching thousand of amp circuits for my amp I cannot decide to select an amp circuit.becaouse of I have already make several circuits but not satisfied. I Decide to make 2Way system; maybe amp output power shoud have 25 to 50 watts. If any friend have any practical knowledge or satisfied with active crossover power amp circuit pls help to build my dream sound. I have marchand 2-way x'over circuit.

thanks
Ataul
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Old 4th November 2009, 01:32 PM   #2
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I would prefer for the upper frequency aera so called "Single Ended" power amplifier, e. g. "ZEN" or "Aleph" (check out basic article by Pass Labs: Audio reproduction done right.)
For the lower frequency aera I would prefer the DOZ for the midrange, go to Death of Zen - A new Class-A power amp
(all this amps runs in "Pure Class A")
and below 500 Hz the "blameless Amplifier" from Douglas Self
Blameless Amp layout
this should be run at Class AB, i. e. 20-50mA idle current through the output
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Old 4th November 2009, 03:43 PM   #3
cbdb is offline cbdb  Canada
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You need about twice the power for the woofer compared to the tweeter.
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Old 4th November 2009, 10:22 PM   #4
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Relative power depends on XO frequency, slope and relative efficiency of the drivers. Rod Elliot says if you cross at 300 Hz, you fairly evenly split the power requirement.

I'm using equal power available for convenience, an A-75 per channel. Overkill on the top end crossing at 1500 Hz. I'd like to see 30-60W minimum for the tweeter, but I like lots of headroom. Unless you are using very efficient drivers, 50W is nowhere near enough for the woofers if you want to avoid clipping and be able to play loudly once in a while.

Take a look at the Leach amp. It will give you around 125W as designed, but is somewhat scalable to lower and higher rails. It is a very nice sounding amp, especially Jens' version.

Last edited by BobEllis; 4th November 2009 at 10:26 PM.
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Old 4th November 2009, 11:23 PM   #5
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Normally you'd put the most power to the woofers, but I like clean vocals and they can really sop it up in the midrange. Thus, for a 3-way system I have an old Marantz 250 that I fixed up powering the Dynaudio 5" mids (125x2), a diy Tiger amp for the bass (60x2), and a diy thing based on a Motorola app note for the tweeters, probably 50x2.

If I were building from scratch, I'd go with the blameless design for both woofers and mids, then maybe a modest class A for the tweeters. If I were on a strict budget, I'd have no problem using the National power amp chips. I also use the Marchand crossover boards and am extremely pleased with them.

I find a 3-way system is very tolerant of amps, cables and all the rest. Nothing in the power chain is being asked to do anything terribly difficult, so even modest equipment does very well.

Best,
CH
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Old 6th November 2009, 03:17 AM   #6
ataul is offline ataul  Bangladesh
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Thanks all for advice,Mr.tiefbassuebrtr yes I agree with u I build an aleph 30 and play with aleph p preamp with cherio tower speaker really it is very musical sound one of the best ever I heared.but it has some disadvantage it need very large heat sink. I am using 12x10x1.5inch heat sink per channel but not sufficient after 30 minuets it needs force cooling by air flow and my 15x9x10 feet room become hot environment after 2 hours music playing, although I love it, because of my dream sound. I have no room air cooler.
MR, Conrad H thanks for your advice Ic chip power amp may be good pls tell me the chip number which u are using for your active crossover sound system,

best regard
Ataul..
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Old 6th November 2009, 07:41 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ataul View Post
Thanks all for advice,Mr.tiefbassuebrtr yes I agree with u I build an aleph 30 and play with aleph p preamp with cherio tower speaker really it is very musical sound one of the best ever I heared.but it has some disadvantage it need very large heat sink. I am using 12x10x1.5inch heat sink per channel but not sufficient after 30 minuets it needs force cooling by air flow and my 15x9x10 feet room become hot environment after 2 hours music playing, although I love it, because of my dream sound. I have no room air cooler.
MR, Conrad H thanks for your advice Ic chip power amp may be good pls tell me the chip number which u are using for your active crossover sound system, best regard Ataul..
cherio tower speaker? I have never heard about this brand and I don't find informations on the web.
Do you mean the Italian brand "Chario" like this?
Chario Loudspeakers Academy Sovran Speaker - AVReview News and comment
Please let me know the exactly loudspeaker model, then I can give more exactly advices regarded optimal amplifier choices.

how much is in your music room the ambient temperature?
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Old 6th November 2009, 10:08 AM   #8
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Linkwitz uses the LM3886 for some of his projects, which is good for 50-60W with proper heat sinks. You'll need sinks, but nowhere near what you would for an Aleph.

Boards are available from a number of sources, like DIY Chip Amplifier Kits, PCB's, Components and Information., but you can also build it without a board fairly easily. The Chipamp.com kit is nicely done (I built one) and relatively inexpensive.

Last edited by BobEllis; 6th November 2009 at 10:12 AM.
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Old 6th November 2009, 11:08 AM   #9
AndrewT is offline AndrewT  Scotland
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cbdb View Post
You need about twice the power for the woofer compared to the tweeter.
only if the woofer needs extra drive due to a lower sensitivity.
If both drivers have the same sensitivity, then both need the same voltage drive to achieve the same peak transient signals in their respective passbands.
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Old 6th November 2009, 11:32 AM   #10
ataul is offline ataul  Bangladesh
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Conrad Hoffman View Post
Normally you'd put the most power to the woofers, but I like clean vocals and they can really sop it up in the midrange. Thus, for a 3-way system I have an old Marantz 250 that I fixed up powering the Dynaudio 5" mids (125x2), a diy Tiger amp for the bass (60x2), and a diy thing based on a Motorola app note for the tweeters, probably 50x2.

If I were building from scratch, I'd go with the blameless design for both woofers and mids, then maybe a modest class A for the tweeters. If I were on a strict budget, I'd have no problem using the National power amp chips. I also use the Marchand crossover boards and am extremely pleased with them.

I find a 3-way system is very tolerant of amps, cables and all the rest. Nothing in the power chain is being asked to do anything terribly difficult, so even modest equipment does very well.

Best,
Thanks all for advice,Mr.tiefbassuebrtr yes I agree with u I build an aleph 30 and play with aleph p preamp with cherio tower speaker really it is very musical sound one of the best ever I heared.but it has some disadvantage it need very large heat sink. I am using 12x10x1.5inch heat sink per channel but not sufficient after 30 minuets it needs force cooling by air flow and my 15x9x10 feet room become hot environment after 2 hours of music playing, although I love it, because of my dream sound. I have no room air cooler.
MR, Conrad H thanks for your advice Ic chip power amp may be good pls tell me the chip number which u are using for your active crossover sound system and its may be
my 2nd setup with active crossover sound system by your help.

best regard
Ataul..

CH
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