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Old 18th December 2009, 08:53 PM   #101
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A further question I'd like clarified is whether the thermal tracking diodes on the OnSemi and Sanken (anyone else?) transistors are part of the transistor's silicon die or are the just mounted adjacent to the die? I'd like to think they are integral for fastest response time, but I'll take what I can get.
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Old 18th December 2009, 09:11 PM   #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stinius View Post
Lumba

Since this thread is about audio power output stages what about comparing 2SA1943/2SC5200 with onsemi 3281/1302?
At the first look basicly not great differences. The 3281/1302 both available from TOKYO SHIBAURA ELECTRIC and On-Semiconductor - look at my first post (post #1).

In this case this thread could be also of interest:
Evaluation results: MJL3281A/MJL1302A SPICE Models
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Old 18th December 2009, 09:25 PM   #103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Damon Hill View Post
A further question I'd like clarified is whether the thermal tracking diodes on the OnSemi and Sanken (anyone else?) transistors are part of the transistor's silicon die or are the just mounted adjacent to the die? I'd like to think they are integral for fastest response time, but I'll take what I can get.
Hi Damon
The OnSemi tracking diodes is not a part of the silicon die.
Have a look at this thread, a lot of info.
On Semi ThermalTrak

Cheers
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Old 18th December 2009, 09:44 PM   #104
mjf is offline mjf  Austria
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[QUOTE
The 3281/1302 both available from TOKYO SHIBAURA ELECTRIC and On-Semiconductor - look at my first post (post #1).

hello.
i think magnatec (semelab ) has them too.
Magnatec | Semiconductors | Discretes | Bipolar Transistors | PNP Power |2SA1302-0
greetings
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Old 18th December 2009, 11:12 PM   #105
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stinius,
thanks again for your kind help.

I`m extraordinarily glad to see that Motorola took the effort to develop the MJL3281/MJL1302 for linear applications. Copying the readily available 2SC3281/2SA1302, however, would have significantly reduced the high product development costs.
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Old 18th December 2009, 11:13 PM   #106
wahab is offline wahab  Algeria
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[QUOTE=Ultima Thule;2017244]Let me see, I had a second look to try understand how the information should be interpreted given in the data sheet and test circuit in attachment of post #71

It says 28,3 V RMS and 100 Watt @ output into 8 Ohm..
Let's see if we do the Ohms law calculation the 28,3^2 = 800...
P = U^2/R >>> 800/8 = 100 Watt
Upk (for sine) = U RMS * sqr2 >>> 28,3 * 1,414 = 40 Volt peak

alternatively we can calculate the power also as follow:

28,3 U RMS / 8 Ohm = ~3,54 A RMS
28,3 * 3,54 = 100 Watt

As I can see we have 10 Volts of headroom to the 50 Volt rails supply before clipping occures.

Wahab, correct me if I'm wrong here!?

If we do the simulation again with 80 Volt pk-2-pk and for both 240 mA and 52 mA what how would the distortion look then?
(Re for output transistor as in pots #71, eg. 0,5 Ohm)

Cheers Michael[/QUOTE

hi, michael

Peak current is 5A, so the maximum loss in the emitter degeneration
resistance is 0.5 X 5 = 2.5V....on each rail..
add the transistors losses..
here the graphs of THD for Iq of about 230 mA...

regards,

wahab
Attached Files
File Type: zip EF THD.zip (10.6 KB, 50 views)
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Old 18th December 2009, 11:52 PM   #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lumba Ogir View Post
stinius,
thanks again for your kind help.

I`m extraordinarily glad to see that Motorola took the effort to develop the MJL3281/MJL1302 for linear applications. Copying the readily available 2SC3281/2SA1302, however, would have significantly reduced the high product development costs.
Lumba

You are too generous.

Since you liked the MJL3281/1302 (switching) devices, maybe you could have a look at the NJW devices as well, and the most interesting parts the NJL series aka TT ( these are the devices that Bob are talking about)

NJW

NJL

Last edited by stinius; 18th December 2009 at 11:56 PM.
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Old 18th December 2009, 11:53 PM   #108
wahab is offline wahab  Algeria
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Default more numbers..

i added the figures for a 10Khz frequency...
quite interesting..

regards,

wahab
Attached Files
File Type: zip EF THD.zip (29.9 KB, 42 views)
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Old 19th December 2009, 12:00 AM   #109
wahab is offline wahab  Algeria
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stinius View Post
Lumba

You are too generous.

Since you liked the MJL3281/1302 (switching) devices, maybe you could have a look at the NJW devices as well, and the most interesting parts the NJL series aka TT ( these are the devices that Bob are talking about
the MJL3281/1302, more or less good copies of the (old) toshiba
2SA1302/2SC3281 are better than the MJL21193/21194...
the latter are gross rugged devices which are neither good in audio
nor in switching, unless it s slow frequency...they lack gain linearity..
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Old 19th December 2009, 12:07 AM   #110
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Hi Wahab,

I think we can agree now it's far from clipping however we want to define headroom may be a semantic question anyway.
Thanks for making another simulation, it is interesting the simulator indicate the Toshiba having higher odd orders than even order in comparison to the ON-Semi, but these are anyway just simulations.
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