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Old 29th November 2008, 12:19 AM   #11
andy_c is offline andy_c  United States
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Check out these measurements of the $350k Wavac amp! LOL!
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Old 29th November 2008, 12:37 AM   #12
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Originally posted by andy_c
Check out these measurements of the $350k Wavac amp! LOL!

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Old 29th November 2008, 01:05 AM   #13
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Wait a second how do you make a 1Meg Ohm output impedance tube amp with "no feedback at all"? I assume this includes bootstrapping and any other form of local feedback.

Looks like current source drive is the next big thing. Good to see that the speaker distortion will be replaced by lots of amp distortion.

The people involved must be quite excentric. I hear collectors are paying thousands for 60's - 70's "fuzzed out" psych and prog rock lp's from Italy, France, etc.
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Old 29th November 2008, 01:17 AM   #14
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Ultrasound: $600,000 amplifiers : $60 web site.
The pictures make the front panels look like a high school wood shop project. That site can't be real. Look what else $600k will get you:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercedes-Benz_SLR_McLaren
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Old 29th November 2008, 06:57 AM   #15
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The sad part is that they're probably not even that good.
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Old 29th November 2008, 07:25 AM   #16
dejanm is offline dejanm  Austria
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You have to hear Wavacs to be able to make your opinion. And you have to hear them with right speakers. For example with these already mentioned Kharmas. Concerning measurements - they do not tell the whole story - do they ... I listened the same Kharma speakers with Tensor amplifiers. I never really checked it but I am pretty sure that Tensors have much better measurements than Wavac. The sound was though bad. They do not play well together. Or maybe it was the room that made the difference ? Or maybe power supply ?

What I am trying to say is that the equation that leads to the good sound reproduction cannot be reduced to electrical measurements of one component. You cannot say actually much looking at them. Some things are though visible (and the comments from Stereophile are really interesting). But it is not the whole strory ...

Just try not to think about money and grab somewhere the opportunity to hear Wavac mono's. And afterwards ... well if you earn a million per day, I am sure you are going to buy them ...
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Old 29th November 2008, 07:38 AM   #17
h_a is offline h_a  Europe
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Hi dejanm,

I think everybody will agree here that measurements don't tell how an amp sounds like.

BUT measurements tell you to which extent the amplifier produces an error; personally I don't like the idea that my amp produces errors and everybody has his own limit of what is acceptable.

What I particularly don't understand is that many think that good measurement results and good sound contradict eachother? That could easily lead to the conclusion that these people just like the errors the amp produces...

Have fun, Hannes
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Old 29th November 2008, 09:27 AM   #18
dejanm is offline dejanm  Austria
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Originally posted by h_a
Hi dejanm,

I think everybody will agree here that measurements don't tell how an amp sounds like.

BUT measurements tell you to which extent the amplifier produces an error; personally I don't like the idea that my amp produces errors and everybody has his own limit of what is acceptable.

What I particularly don't understand is that many think that good measurement results and good sound contradict eachother? That could easily lead to the conclusion that these people just like the errors the amp produces...

Have fun, Hannes
h_a,

I fully agree with you. But let me remind you of something ... You remeber for sure many years ago that we had discussions about THD measurements and how important they were ... The amp was better if the THD was lower. So we had some 20 years ago a lot of amps with 0,000...1% of THD. And they were sounding average or bad. Lot of Tube amps with 1% of THD were better. And that is only one example - there are a lot of others ...

So is the measurement important at all ? Yes, I would say. But you have to be carefull not to make unqualified generalisations and you have to know what and how do you measure. I am not saying that these guys at Stereophile do not do their job well - on the contrary. This information is valuable. But definitely not sufficient so that you can make definitive statements.
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Old 29th November 2008, 09:54 AM   #19
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You can argue audibility of THD all you like, but that WAVAC doesn't even meet it's advertised power output even at stupid THD levels. That is a lie. And all that for $US350k.
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Old 29th November 2008, 03:39 PM   #20
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You have to hear Wavacs to be able to make your opinion.
The Wavacs deserve a good bit of respect for both the engineering and artistic sides. I recall reading the chassis is a solid aluminum slab and the cover is real glass. They look stunning just like a premium product should.

One of my favorite equipment reviews is from Glass Audio. They spent many pages showing fancy 3 dimensional graphs and waterfall plots and left out one small detail. How the thing actually sounds!
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