Hi,
Tubes or solid state, it makes no difference to the software....
Eagle (www.cadsoftusa.com) has some libs with tubes.
\\\Jens
Tubes or solid state, it makes no difference to the software....
Eagle (www.cadsoftusa.com) has some libs with tubes.
\\\Jens
I use the Eagle software for all of my tube PC boards. The freeware version is limited to a small sized PC board that is not useful for complete amplifiers. The full "professional" version that I use is not suitable for casual hobbiests. It costs $1500 USD.
I know a person who makes several small PC boards with the freeware version, then uses a image editor to put them all together. This sounds like a pain to me.
I know a person who makes several small PC boards with the freeware version, then uses a image editor to put them all together. This sounds like a pain to me.
I currently am making the move from Eagle to Kicad (http://www.lis.inpg.fr/realise_au_lis/kicad/), for a couple of reasons.
The freeware version of Eagle is limited in utility (1/2 eurocard board, one schematic sheet, two PCB layers) and application (no commercial designs). Kicad is GPL software and has neither of these limitations. Kicad's also got a built-in gerber viewer, which I like better than most standalone programs.
Now, there is some adjustment time required to get used to kicad. It's by no means "easy" to use software, but if you stick with it I'm sure you'll be rewarded. Having board size and schematic sheet requirements lifted from me is like a breath of fresh air. The dealmaker for me: there's a library converter that takes Eagle .lib files and turns them into kicad format .lib and .mod files.
--k
edit: I wanted to agree with tubelab here in that if you've got the cash to spend, Eagle's the way to go. It's worth every penny.
The freeware version of Eagle is limited in utility (1/2 eurocard board, one schematic sheet, two PCB layers) and application (no commercial designs). Kicad is GPL software and has neither of these limitations. Kicad's also got a built-in gerber viewer, which I like better than most standalone programs.
Now, there is some adjustment time required to get used to kicad. It's by no means "easy" to use software, but if you stick with it I'm sure you'll be rewarded. Having board size and schematic sheet requirements lifted from me is like a breath of fresh air. The dealmaker for me: there's a library converter that takes Eagle .lib files and turns them into kicad format .lib and .mod files.
--k
edit: I wanted to agree with tubelab here in that if you've got the cash to spend, Eagle's the way to go. It's worth every penny.
I'm trying to find software (freeware) to do a 6 3/8'' x 3 3/8'' board. The limitations on most freeware is 4'' x 3.2''
Can't quite afford $1500 in software to do a larger board. However, maybe the light just turned on. I could probably do one
channel of a driver board in 4'' x 3.2'' if I get lucky.
Can't quite afford $1500 in software to do a larger board. However, maybe the light just turned on. I could probably do one
channel of a driver board in 4'' x 3.2'' if I get lucky.
You might want to check into ExpressPCB
They have a free PCB and schematic software on their website. They also offer a PCB service that is not to outragous.
Just a thought.
Trout
They have a free PCB and schematic software on their website. They also offer a PCB service that is not to outragous.
Just a thought.
Trout
If you're only making a few boards, have a laser printer, an iron, and some Staples Photo Basic Gloss # 648181 paper. Any drawing program will work if you use the toner transfer method. You'll have to create your own symbols, routing etc and etch your own boards from copperclad, but it does give you a lot of freedom and flexability and can be almost as fast as breadboarding and have some really nice results if the project only needs single sided boards. Absolutely no size limitations.
You do your drawing, print it on the gloss paper, iron it to the copper clad (the iron re-melts the toner - actually small plastic particles) on to the copper. Put the bord in water for a while and peel off the paper backing. The tomer is left as a resist. clean up the residue of the paper with your fingers or soft bristle tooth brush and etch your board. Etch the board, then remove the toner with acetone.
The process is well documented, just do a Google search. There's even a YouTube video or three out there. Been doin this for one off's fo over 10 years. Unless I need mass quantities of PCBs and more than one side, this is the bees knees. Oh, and you'll need to drill the holes... use small diameter carbide bits that available and prefereably a drill press to get straight vertical holes. I use a product called "Cool-Amp" that puts a silver plate on the raw copper traces by simply rubbing the powder with water over the traces. Then after the boards are stuffed, I give them a conformal coating.
JD
You do your drawing, print it on the gloss paper, iron it to the copper clad (the iron re-melts the toner - actually small plastic particles) on to the copper. Put the bord in water for a while and peel off the paper backing. The tomer is left as a resist. clean up the residue of the paper with your fingers or soft bristle tooth brush and etch your board. Etch the board, then remove the toner with acetone.
The process is well documented, just do a Google search. There's even a YouTube video or three out there. Been doin this for one off's fo over 10 years. Unless I need mass quantities of PCBs and more than one side, this is the bees knees. Oh, and you'll need to drill the holes... use small diameter carbide bits that available and prefereably a drill press to get straight vertical holes. I use a product called "Cool-Amp" that puts a silver plate on the raw copper traces by simply rubbing the powder with water over the traces. Then after the boards are stuffed, I give them a conformal coating.
JD
I have become addicted to Diptrace, that was easy for me to learn.
No limit in board size, but a max. of 250 pins in the free version.
The reason i love it so much, is amongst other things, that i can make single sided boards. I'm using the toner transfer method.
It comes with quite a big library, and possibilities to define your own parts.
Best regards
Ebbe
No limit in board size, but a max. of 250 pins in the free version.
The reason i love it so much, is amongst other things, that i can make single sided boards. I'm using the toner transfer method.
It comes with quite a big library, and possibilities to define your own parts.
Best regards
Ebbe
... even when you have a simple cad software you can try the method of engraving 
Example here: a Servo circuit ...
best regards
artQuake
Example here: a Servo circuit ...
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
best regards
artQuake
Diptrace for me
My favourite so far has been Diptrace. I found it easiest to use and more instantly accessable than Eagle. i suspect that I have yet to learn all that it can do for me, but found I could make a board up in an afternoon, print and develop it without reading the instructions!
As said before you can get it in the freeware version which is 250holes max. However they also do a 30 day trial which you can use for that one off project with more holes if need be.
It outputs to Gerber, and various other formats. The only bit I have found so far has been Gerber output. But I think that I have worked it out.
Hobby licence is for 1000 holes, fully featured for $125 which I think is not bad.
My favourite so far has been Diptrace. I found it easiest to use and more instantly accessable than Eagle. i suspect that I have yet to learn all that it can do for me, but found I could make a board up in an afternoon, print and develop it without reading the instructions!
As said before you can get it in the freeware version which is 250holes max. However they also do a 30 day trial which you can use for that one off project with more holes if need be.
It outputs to Gerber, and various other formats. The only bit I have found so far has been Gerber output. But I think that I have worked it out.
Hobby licence is for 1000 holes, fully featured for $125 which I think is not bad.
Proteus is a good tool for quick-and-dirty, or at least, the version (4) I'm using is. It's a bit lightweight for fullscale CAD-CAM but they're up to version 7 so it's probably improved a lot. It costs about UKP140 for the entry-level 500-pin (it's pin-limited not area-) educational package. It has a good UI, you can figure out how to do everything without a manual, and the schematics are easily produced and are second-to-none in readability (unlike SPICE which is naff). It's straightforward to create new devices and packages and select them into your design. I have experience of PCAD (now Altium Designer), Orcad, and Mentor Graphics and I can tell you that this is not always the case. I find Eagle a bit idiosyncratic too... If I have to dig too far to get started, I lose patience. On principle.
I just completed a 32 * 9 inch ss layout in Proteus with ~50 1.5 * 10mm side-firing LEDs at various angles that slot into a lasercut perspex lightguide with virtually zero tolerance, using an imported Autocad dxf for positional reference. We've etched the board in 3 pieces using laser-printed transparencies, and the fit is good. We're going to mill it for production.
500 pins is fine if you're not doing larger digital stuff.
If you can find a copy of even an old DOS-based program, these are often still perfectly adequate to most purposes.
w
I just completed a 32 * 9 inch ss layout in Proteus with ~50 1.5 * 10mm side-firing LEDs at various angles that slot into a lasercut perspex lightguide with virtually zero tolerance, using an imported Autocad dxf for positional reference. We've etched the board in 3 pieces using laser-printed transparencies, and the fit is good. We're going to mill it for production.
500 pins is fine if you're not doing larger digital stuff.
If you can find a copy of even an old DOS-based program, these are often still perfectly adequate to most purposes.
w
TinyCAD and FreePCB are free Sourceforge projects. They don't have any artificial pin, layer or size limits. The learning curve isn't too bad, and FreePCB generates Gerber files that can be used by anybody. I've dumped my quirky mid priced "hobby" programs and use these two for everything now.
audiowize, Trout,
zigzagflux, conrad hoffmann,
thanks for the hint ... to pcbexpress !
This software is really great ... i downloaded it and got a small pcb done in 2 1/2 hours !
I tryed starting with eagle a few times, but in my eyes / understanding it's not intuitive as pcb express ... for this small project it's approved outreaching from my side ... 10 Point's from me ... well done.
Draw the schematic and it shows in pcb where to connect wires when using the correct ID ... great ... autoroute would be a nice to have ... whatever ... for free it's much what you get.
@conrad
How do you create gerbers with it ? When exporting dxf i only get the silk screen out of the proggie ...
best regards
artQuake
zigzagflux, conrad hoffmann,
thanks for the hint ... to pcbexpress !
This software is really great ... i downloaded it and got a small pcb done in 2 1/2 hours !
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
I tryed starting with eagle a few times, but in my eyes / understanding it's not intuitive as pcb express ... for this small project it's approved outreaching from my side ... 10 Point's from me ... well done.
Draw the schematic and it shows in pcb where to connect wires when using the correct ID ... great ... autoroute would be a nice to have ... whatever ... for free it's much what you get.
@conrad
How do you create gerbers with it ? When exporting dxf i only get the silk screen out of the proggie ...
best regards
artQuake
Ups i see on the second view ... conrad mentioned FreePCB ... 
... i just mailed pcbexpress before because the library isn't really huge and i'm missing for example OPA1632 LM4562 and specially LM4780 and many others ... and they do not have more than that. Are there other librarys from other proggies who could match into pcbexpress ?
The lib of for example Altium Designer is huge but there's definetly a need of taking a course or many lessons getting into it ... to difficult for now ... maybe i should sit down a while and try eagle again ... or however start to make custom components with pcbexpress ... it's possible ... but if it's as easy as drawing a pcb with pcbexpress ? donno wouldbeverynice
Any suggestions or experiences out here ?
Cheers & thx
artQuake
... i just mailed pcbexpress before because the library isn't really huge and i'm missing for example OPA1632 LM4562 and specially LM4780 and many others ... and they do not have more than that. Are there other librarys from other proggies who could match into pcbexpress ?The lib of for example Altium Designer is huge but there's definetly a need of taking a course or many lessons getting into it ... to difficult for now ... maybe i should sit down a while and try eagle again ... or however start to make custom components with pcbexpress ... it's possible ... but if it's as easy as drawing a pcb with pcbexpress ? donno wouldbeverynice
Any suggestions or experiences out here ?
Cheers & thx
artQuake
My suggestion? If you're not willing to pay for Eagle, start off with a free but harder to learn program, like gEDA/PCB or kicad. I say this because once you've run up against the artificial complexity limits of whatever shareware/crippled software you chose to start out with, you're now back at square one at the very bottom of the learning curve with new (free) software, software that you could've started out with in the first place.
None of these packages are particularly complicated, and once you're accustomed to their various quirks, you'll be a master in no time. I know for certain that both Eagle and kicad have respectable HOWTOs and tutorials in the public domain.
--k
None of these packages are particularly complicated, and once you're accustomed to their various quirks, you'll be a master in no time. I know for certain that both Eagle and kicad have respectable HOWTOs and tutorials in the public domain.
--k
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