| Denis.BR |
Unfortunately, I literally burned 2 ICs, so I took a sandpaper to see how it is inside, and took some pics in the digital microscope:
 
The upper part is under the silicon, I sandpapered it too much.
The National N
This is another IC. The black part in the V+ bus is where the S$hit happened.
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| BWRX |
| Very neat. At least you know it was an authentic part. |
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| impsick |
holy fu#@!%g sh!*!!! i had seen one that i blew up and then opened but didnt see that. i guess i didnt investigate enough. amazing technology these days man, amazing.
nice shots thanks. |
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| impsick |
| oh my god now that i read your post im even more amazed. no wonder i didnt see that, you need a microscope. |
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| Denis.BR |
yep, no microscope, no sight. At naked eyes you an only see a tiny silver square with no details.
Maybe a good magnifying glass can help.
if this IC, that can be a mid end IC, is this complex, I was wondering how a Intel Dual Core can look like |
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| sq225917 |
| pretty damn complex, just think how long it would take to find the bit that say 'Bill gates sucks' |
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| impsick |
BILL GATES IS CHILL, YOU MUST BE AN APPLE GUY HUH, APPLE GUYS ALWAYS HATE ON US PC'ERS.;)
BUT YEAH AN INTEL PROCESSOR ONLY HAS SOME 2-3 "MILLION" TRANSISTORS.:eek: |
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| mr.duck |
| quote: | Originally posted by impsick
BUT YEAH AN INTEL PROCESSOR ONLY HAS SOME 2-3 "MILLION" TRANSISTORS.:eek: |
Is that all? how about a modern graphics card like the nvidia 8800 gtx? Have a guess how many transistors are just in the core...
It is more than 3 million..
But more than 10 million?...
681 million :hot: :eek: |
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| impsick |
| i correct myself. i just read that as of 2006 a microprocesser can have as much as "1.7 BILLION" transistors. (MOSFETS!):bigeyes: |
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| SmarmyDog |
| quote: | Originally posted by impsick
... can have as much as "1.7 BILLION" transistors ... :bigeyes: |
Yup, almost as many as a Halcro amplifier.:devilr: |
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| Nordic |
| I think laying out those chips must be a worse job than being a gastroentirologist. |
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| Spasticteapot |
| quote: | Originally posted by impsick
BILL GATES IS CHILL, YOU MUST BE AN APPLE GUY HUH, APPLE GUYS ALWAYS HATE ON US PC'ERS.;)
BUT YEAH AN INTEL PROCESSOR ONLY HAS SOME 2-3 "MILLION" TRANSISTORS.:eek: |
Last-gen single-core P4's had about 188 million, and the current four-core Clovertown processors have 588 million.
GPUs often have more transistors, as they have multiple units within them covering many different things simultaneously. The transistors run much slower (rarely over 600mhz), however, and are generally much larger. |
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| mr.duck |
| also don't forget that the vast majority of transistors in a CPU make up the cache. especially with intel CPUs with their huge caches of several MB. |
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| sansbury |
| quote: | Originally posted by Nordic
I think laying out those chips must be a worse job than being a gastroentirologist. |
I think a lot of it is now automated since there is just too much for a human being to do. I've read about some very interesting work that's been done with (for lack of a better word) "genetic" algorithms that can be used to computationally "evolve" circuit designs and physical layouts.
The economics of CPU design today are quite imposing, with a new incremental design now costing on the order of USD100m just to tape it out. Manufacturing facilities are priced in the billions.
I have a friend who runs a design group at one of the preeminent defense research labs here in the US, doing work on lasers, and he has a Ph.D. in physics from MIT. Some of the problems they have solved have taken literally decades to get to. It is amazing the things people can do given sufficient quantities of time and money--in this case, billions :bigeyes: |
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| Bazukaz |
1.7 Billion is for Itanium 2 processors.
Technology is amazing nowadays. Not only the design ( i wonder what kind of software is used to make the layout) , but also manufacturing process must be extremely precise... |
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| impsick |
precise!? these guys can pull off micro surgery blind folded!! haha
the thing that gets me is not the software or the design. The thing that gets me is the mofo that made the machine (or whatever) that makes such microscopic circuits. I mean how do you make something you cant see. What the hell is the process to make these chips? Im gonna have to do some research.
A. Bell... is a God! imagine our life without him. |
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| sansbury |
A lot of the process is done optically, using photolithography. Instead of using lenses to magnify an image, they use ones which reduce a printed mask to the correct size. IIRC Zeiss has quite a lot of business making these for companies like Applied Materials.
Of course, you can explain all you want, and logically it makes sense, but it is amazing that it can actually be done. This is like my friend (the laser guy) says: To prove the theory works is one thing, but to build something which can be manufactured in volume can ultimately be much harder.
What we know as ICs today is owed in large part to the Apollo and Minuteman missile programs, which by some estimates purchased nearly every IC made in the early 60s. At the start, chips cost up to thousands of dollars each (enough to buy a new car), while by 1970, they were showing up in TVs. That "money no object" mentality paid the bills while we started climbing up the ladder of Moore's law.
And don't forget--we went to the moon and back on a 1MHz processor with 21K of magnetic core memory :smash: |
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| impsick |
| yeah i heard that a Texas Inst. calculator was the backup cpu on our trip to the moon. |
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| -_nando-_ |
| quote: | Originally posted by mr.duck
Is that all? how about a modern graphics card like the nvidia 8800 gtx? Have a guess how many transistors are just in the core...
It is more than 3 million..
But more than 10 million?...
681 million :hot: :eek: |
WHAT THE *&$*(#...
I have a pretty old 6800Ultra, and it have 260million, right !?
GREAT PICTURES |
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| -_nando-_ |
| quote: | Originally posted by Bazukaz
1.7 Billion is for Itanium 2 processors.
Technology is amazing nowadays. Not only the design ( i wonder what kind of software is used to make the layout) , but also manufacturing process must be extremely precise... |
I aways wondered about this... Nobody will design this, only a software, so can I say that computers design newer computers? |
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