| The mods never end, adding Goudreau's triplets - Click HERE for Original Thread |
| Peter Daniel |
| After reading Pete Goudreu article about bypass caps http://groups.google.com/groups?sel...u&output=gplain I decided to do it in my DAC as well. I used 15nF X7R , 330nF X7R chip caps 0612 from DigiKey and Panasonic 120u HFQ. Mounting and stacking those tiny cap is not an easy job.;) |
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| Peter Daniel |
| Panasonic HFQ caps are mounted on the opposite side. So what's the improvement? My DAC already had a pretty good sound and it was better than my TT. By adding the caps I achieved another level of refinment (although not something that blows me off). It's just that reproduced music becomes slightly more real, the notes seem to be floating longer in the air and there is a bit more magic in performance. ;) The cost is not much and it took me an hour to do, so I would recommend it. The chips visible here are 2 stacked 1704 DACs. The shielding brought a big improvement. |
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| Peter Daniel |
| This is the look of main board which came from David Broadhurst. I placed damping material on most caps. However, I noticed that too much damping kills the liveness of music, so eventually I removed some of it. Damping the clock was really important on my board. I tried to put damping pads on top panel, but it sounds better without damping. So my recommendation is to experiment, because one never really know what's good and what's not.;) |
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| JasonL |
now if you had a soldering iron like mine it would have probably been alot easyer.
: O ) |
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| Peter Daniel |
| Yeah, too bad I had to use this one.;) |
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| JasonL |
| THATS HUGE now mine is stil smaller |
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| Peter Daniel |
I was only joking. I used 15W temp reg. iron. I usually use 4 different irons . The one before is 80W and is good only for big jobs, like soldering 14 ga wire etc.
The problem with chip caps was not that much soldering as positioning them properly and holding in place. |
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| JasonL |
| Yeha i know i need to get a new one too i like my weller ill be getting another temp controled one soon i need a bigger tip for soldering big wire and removeing parts off of boards. |
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| jwb |
| Did you get any resonance from stacking two chips of different capacitance in the same form factor? In my experiments this is sometimes the result, so I have taken the practice of using decreasing sizes for decoupling. For example, 4.7µF in 1206 in parallel with 0.1µF in 0805 for local decoupling. |
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| Peter Daniel |
| It didn't cross my mind. 0612 package is preferred and when I was ordering, those were the only sizes available from DigiKey. BTW, it was the first time I did something like that so my experience is limited.;) |
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| Jocko Homo |
| quote: | | Did you get any resonance from stacking two chips of different capacitance in the same form factor? |
I made some measurements years ago that showed stacking smaller film caps on top of larger ones definitely caused resonance problems.
Harry: do you remember that one? You were there that day......
Jocko |
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| Peter Daniel |
| quote: | Originally posted by Jocko Homo
I made some measurements years ago that showed stacking smaller film caps on top of larger ones definitely caused resonance problems.
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Fortunately I did it the other way, I put the larger one on top.;)
Anyway, how you check for resonances? |
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| Ren Hoek |
1.First get a degree in Electrical Electrical engineering.
2. Go to work for a company with a 500MHz Network Analyzer.
3. Read the directiions for Analyzer in step 2.
4. Measure resonances.
I am pretty sure that is how Pete did it but I think his degree in Physics.
Sin Bin by Sundown!
Ren |
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| JasonL |
OUCH what was with that..
THAT was mean.. |
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| Peter Daniel |
| I don't think it was mean. I just got what I asked for, unless he was not telling the truth.;) |
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| Ren Hoek |
Acually I was having a bit of fun. This kind of thing is pretty difficult to measure and I was just trying to make that point. I believe they probably is some advatange to this approach and I bet money Pete did measurements pretty much as described since he is an RF and signal integrity expert. No harm intended.
Measuring supply noise with a 100MHz scope is a good starting point for most of use mere mortals.
Ren
Maybe some info at www.sigcon.com |
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| ftorres |
| What about adding a high value ceramic 1206 or 1210 cap (4.7uF or 22uF) to the triplet, if you have room for it. I've made some measurements (no audio results yet), and found that these little chips do a tremendous job removing digital supply noise, when combined with such a triplet. |
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| Peter Daniel |
| I've seen your thread and this is what inspired me to do it. I just followed Goudreau's artcle and he didn't mention the other caps (4,7u). It might be interesting to add them later, when I get familiar with the sound and see for a difference. |
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