| Kofi Annan |
OK-- so some time ago I asked for some advice on a new, inexpensive TT. The advice came back: Thorens TD-160, which I bought and I liked very much! Much better than my Music Hall MMF 2.1. Until....
Disaster 1:
It played a little fast, so I thought maybe the belt was bad or wrong. Got a new belt and it played EVEN FASTER. Asked on DIYAudio and response was: wrong spindle on motor.
Cost to get a new spindle: Between $30 used on Ebay (if you can find them) or $100 from a specialty shop.
Reaction: Yikes.
So, I thought I'd play with it anyway for a while. Then it started skipping when it got close to the center of the record. Thought maybe the anti-skate was bad and messed with that for a while. Then...
Disaster 2:
The anti-skate tension line / tonearm wire snapped. So did Kofi.
Reaction: Rrrrr... arrghhh... Blblblblblblblblblblbl!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
OK, OK, no big deal. Just need to rewire the whole thing as recommended by audio-kraut (that's his avatar name, folks) and get a new pulley or a new motor or, as recommended by Carondimonio, take the sander to the original pulley.
Reaction: Pop! Fizzzzzz..... <gurgle, gurgle, gurgle...>, (repeat until drunk).
So, here's the deal. Running low on patience and having built up some serious karma for the holidays, I'm thinking about buying another TD-160 off Ebay. I know, I'm a glutton for punishment. I may be able to bag one for around $125, and use this one for parts. I suspect that the tonearm on this one is shot, since even the removal of the wire did not fix the inner record skipping issue.
And now, the question:
Should I:
(a) stick with this one and try to fix it?
(b) buy a new-to-me TD-160 and use the old one for parts?
(c) buy a linear tracking TT (theres an HK linear on Ebay that looks neat)? OR
(d) make my own music by cupping my hand under my armpit and squeezing?
Please respond by selecting the correct letter and elaborating on the reasons for your choice. All answers will be reviewed by the Secretary General as a possible remedy to his dilemma. The winning response will receive a hearty "hey hey!" and perhaps some knitted mittens from Mrs. Annan.
Yours in frustration and ignorance,
Kofi |
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| chipco3434 |
Yo Kof
Have you thought that this whole Thorens thing may just not be "in the stars" for you? |
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| HDTVman |
Why not just look for a different tone arm for that TT. I don't remember that as a great arm anyway. Try to file down the spindle only if you sure it's to big. Just take your time and do speed checks often. I would let the motor run and use fine sandpaper or a small file, but be careful. Once it's to small, well it's not good.
Later BZ |
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| Kofi Annan |
Chipco,
Allow me to repeat the instructions for the assignment:
Please respond by selecting the correct letter and elaborating on the reasons for your choice.
OK-- sorry I'm being a smartarse.
Yes, it crossed my mind that the Thorens line of turntables have something against me. If I do ultimately receive persuasive assistance that spurs me to buy another TD 160 and THAT one screws me too, then I will purge my Thorens collection in the all-cleansing fire.
I have a parting line all ready in case of this contingency:
"Hey TD 160s! when you get to Hell, tell 'em Kofi sent ya!"
Kofi |
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| Geek |
| quote: | Originally posted by Kofi Annan
Should I:
(a) stick with this one and try to fix it?
(b) buy a new-to-me TD-160 and use the old one for parts?
(c) buy a linear tracking TT (theres an HK linear on Ebay that looks neat)? OR
(d) make my own music by cupping my hand under my armpit and squeezing? |
a - will frustrate you
b - probably most logical
c - caveat emptor
d - can I hire you to play at my anniversary?
You did forget an "e"
- Kofi Annan should stick to CD's :D |
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| audio-kraut |
| quote: | | (d) make my own music by cupping my hand under my armpit and squeezing |
whats wrong with kraut?
Anyway, since your technical abilities seem rather limited and the job stress seems to get to you, I would recommend D, especially after using deodorant so that concomittand (I like using fancy words, just trying if it fits here) with the sound a rather pleasant odour gets relaesed. Especially recommended before engaging in spousal engagements mafter a romantic dinner.
Seriously - why not consider the td 145 with the tp 16 arm? And it even lifts off the record at the "grooves end" - no, it does not return the arm to the start position.
But I said consider - not "I recommend". I am allergic to economic sanctions... |
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| Kofi Annan |
| quote: | | b - probably most logical |
That's what I thought. I really liked the sound of the Thorens, but the, shall we say, "issues" I had with this one made it more of a frustrating endeavor than I would have liked.
| quote: | | d - can I hire you to play at my anniversary? |
Doing a Bah Mitzvah in February and I got the D'Appolito wedding in May, otherwise I'm free and clear. Contact my agent.
| quote: | | Kofi Annan should stick to CD's |
Sounds like my wife. Hey, you been talkin' to my wife? You stay away from her, or the last thing you hear will be the armpit rendition of "Taps", capish?
| quote: | | your technical abilities seem rather limited |
Yep. My think-i-fying abilities ain't so good either. Public education, baby.
I can put together the audio (tube amps, mostly) and do a few things with the turntable (balancing, mounting carts, etc.), but once it got to the level of neutrinos and string theory, I raised the white flag. I think, AK, your last instructions to me were along the lines of:
... now take the electron microscope and set the first condenser lens aperture to Avogadro's Number...
Can I be blamed for trying to find an easier alternative? Don't answer this one.
Oh yeah: Antidisestablishmentarianism!. There. Fancy word and non-sequitur all in one. I may have made that one up, though.
The TP 145 sounds nice. Too nice. In fact, if the arm came up off the record automatically like that, I'd never get my fundament off the furniture.
I think I may try for another TD 160. They're readily available on Ebay and I liked what I heard. Besides, the Karmic balance of the universe simply would not allow for another debacle, right? I think that's string theory... is it string theory? Does Murphy's Law trump string theory?
Kofi |
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| Geek |
| quote: | Originally posted by Kofi Annan
Sounds like my wife. Hey, you been talkin' to my wife? You stay away from her, or the last thing you hear will be the armpit rendition of "Taps", capish? |
EEEEEEEP! :eek:
*quickly escapes from under bed*
:D |
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| planet10 |
e) get a new tonearm -- Grace 707/704/714, Mayware Formula 4, Linn Basik(?) would be nice, a rega RB250 might be overkill... the Thorens was not great.
f) build a 50 Hz motor controller...
dave |
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| Carondimonio |
Kofi,
definitely option a)!
Reasons:
a1) It will improve your skills and knowledge of TT technique
a2) If your attempts do not bring any result, you can always switch to option b) or c) (but NOT the linear tracking HK, please...)
a3) Do not let anybody say the Secretary General gives up so quickly on some tough tasks... :D
Cheers,
Bruno |
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| Kofi Annan |
| quote: | | e) get a new tonearm -- Grace 707/704/714, Mayware Formula 4, Linn Basik(?) would be nice, a rega RB250 might be overkill... the Thorens was not great. |
OK, I'm becoming convinced... I looked on Ebay and so far, no such tonearms available. Other than Ebay, any other sources for these?
| quote: | | f) build a 50 Hz motor controller... |
To paraphrase Audio-Kraut, "my technical abilities [are] rather limited". Can I get a push in the right direction here? Can I find out about it at 50Hzmotorcontrollers.com?
| quote: | definitely option a)!
Reasons:
a1) It will improve your skills and knowledge of TT technique |
Oh, so I'm supposed to do it myself, am I? Like its some kind of hobby? Well... uh... you have a point here.
| quote: | | a3) Do not let anybody say the Secretary General gives up so quickly on some tough tasks |
Right! One thing I won't have anyone saying is that tha K Dogg gave up! I won't give up on Mideast peace, I won't give up on House Resolution 1441 (OK, bad example) and I won't give up on the Thorens TD-160! YYYYAAAGGHHH!!!
That's it! I'm getting a tonearm! I'm building a 50Hz motor controller! And most importantly...
I NEED MORE HELP!!! YYEAAAHHH!!!!
Kofi |
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| Kofi Annan |
Hey-- I just got done looking for tonearms on Audiogon.com (seems like they have lots for sale) and I just had to look at the zillion dollar tonearms they have for sale.
Let me say first that while I would never buy a three-thousand dollar tonearm, nor would I begrudge anyone that has one, doesn't the price / enjoyment ratio graph get a little flat at three grand?
That is, is there and can there be a mind-numbing, jumping-for-joy, karate-kicking-in-the-air difference between a $300 arm and a $3,000 arm?
Just asking. Also, if anyone could lend some guidance on a design for a 50Hz motor controller (if such a thing can be made with limited funds and mental faculties), please let me know.
Also, Rega 250 for $175-- good deal or no?
Kofi |
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| audio-kraut |
| quote: | | Also, Rega 250 for $175 |
Reasonable - could use a little upgrading - check with origin live |
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| serengetiplains |
| quote: | Originally posted by Kofi Annan
That is, is there and can there be a mind-numbing, jumping-for-joy, karate-kicking-in-the-air difference between a $300 arm and a $3,000 arm?
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Ah, the seemingly ever present myth of declining marginal utility. The whole of history, it seems to me, is a history of declining marginal utility, nothing essentially new under the sun, it's all mostly been done before and, in my dad's estimation, why not drink chokecherry wine?
Is the marginal importance of a difference larger or smaller (a) before one is alive to that difference and (b) after? |
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| planet10 |
| quote: | Originally posted by Kofi Annan
Rega 250 for $175-- good deal or no?
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Not a barn-burner deal... but fair (i got $230 USD for a new 300 -- but that was when the USD was worth a lot more than it is now -- USD has lost about 30% since then). The RB250 is considered by some to be a better starting place than the RB300 (me included). It is a really good arm... possibly better than the Thorens deserves -- but it can always come off and go into the next TT.
| quote: | | Also, if anyone could lend some guidance on a design for a 50Hz motor controller (if such a thing can be made with limited funds and mental faculties), please let me know. |
Basically you are building a device that takes 60 Hz AC in and generates 50 Hz AC for the motor. I have seen it touched on in a couple threads, but haven't seen anything that would let me go ahead and build one (i have a Linn bearing, inner platter, & 50 Hz motor that deserves to be used in a project someday)
dave |
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| planet10 |
| quote: | Originally posted by Kofi Annan
is there and can there be a mind-numbing, jumping-for-joy, karate-kicking-in-the-air difference between a $300 arm and a $3,000 arm? |
yes.
But keep in mind that the TT itself is more critical than the arm (ie i'd put a $300 arm on a $3000 TT, but not the other way round)
dave |
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| audio-kraut |
| quote: | | present myth of declining marginal utility |
when it comes to utility - there is none in a tone arm except for some audio nuts.
It is not the utility what has been asked - it is the audible difference, and there I douby that a 3000$arm is 10 times better than a 300 $ arm. A combination of an RB 250 or 350 with a good shure system - V15VxMR at 500$ is maybe not the perfect system, but will allow me a musical enjoyment that a 5000 $ combo definetely will not - price is a consideration with me.
A tonearm only performs well with the right system - physical parameters see to that, and it is very much tougher to find a system for a very lightweight tonearm than for one like the "middle weight" rega. |
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| Kofi Annan |
I have reviewed the possibility of chnaging the 60Hz to 50Hz and it really looks like a potentially expensive process and a pain in the *** to boot. I am also afraid of sanding / filing down the spindle for obvious reasons.
That said, wouldn't a homebrew DC turntable motor / PSU with analog speed adjustment do the trick? Anyone got any links to a design for these?
Looked on DIYAudio forums, but I have come up empty, so far.
Thanks for all the great advice. If your respective countries ever become unstable, I'll make sure you're at the top of my list for Loya Jirgas.
Kofi |
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| Apogee |
Kofi,
Clearly, I would choose "A" simply because you don't want Mrs. Annan ticked off because you now have two turntables (especially one that is collecting dust!). Also, you've "made your bed and are now laying in it" so to speak and you have to redeem yourself somehow... (just buying a new one doesn't qualify IMHO...) :whazzat:
The above having been said, here's more info than you might want but I did this so you and others would have reference links to lots of information on these tables...
I've read that the Thorens is very similar to the Linn LP12 as well as the AR tables. If you can find someone who would be willing to measure the inside platter diameter, perhaps you'd get lucky and just be able to order a pulley from Linn or AR... Or, you could just have one machined out of brass if someone will give you the measurements of the original.
Your other option would be to go with a DC motor system like Teres uses that would take the table to a completely different level...
One other option that I haven't seen mentioned would be to grab a PS Audio P300 powerplant with multiwave. You can step the freq up and down and you could very the speed that way. The other similar option of this type would be a VPI SDS unit or the Origin Live unit...
Based on what I've read, this table looks to be a very good starting point for some serious tweeking...
A couple of other thoughts that I will mention:
Regarding the skipping near the center of the record. Was your tracking force set correctly? Was the table level? Lastly, what is the condition of your stylus? If any of these were off, the table would react as you described near the center of the record...
Also, if memory serves, there was a group buy some time ago on the Maxim motors. I Searched and the thread is listed below; perhaps you might consider sending an email or starting a new thread to find out if anyone has an extra that they'd be willing to sell you...
Here are some related threads that I thought you'd find interesting:
AC PSU for synchronous motor:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/show...4090&highlight=
Improving a turntable (motor controller circuit)
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/show...2461&highlight=
Clean AC power for Project 9 TT:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/show...4660&highlight=
turntable motors...:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/show...0905&highlight=
Motor for turntable.:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/show...0725&highlight=
Anyone built a VPI-SDS clone?:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/show...8718&highlight=
Group purchase of EPCOS B25839 MKV caps and TT maxon motors:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/show...5436&highlight=
Power supply for Thorens 160: (see if he'll email you the schematic)
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/show...76702#post76702
Linn TT motor:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/show...6999&highlight=
Linn LP12 motor malaise ?:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/show...2971&highlight=
Turntable motor spindle is slightly bent...:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/show...2718&highlight=
Here are the Thorens links mentioned above...
http://www.retrohifi.co.uk/thorens_160.html
http://www.theanalogdept.com/thorens_td_160_dept_.htm
http://www.trian.peachhost.com/Home.htm (replacement parts)
http://www.theanalogdept.com/rktd160ii.htm
http://www.theanalogdept.com/pulley_removal.htm
http://www.teresaudio.com/ (motor and power supply source)
http://www.hi-fiworld.co.uk/hfw/old...orenstd150.html
http://www.nakedresource.com/phpBB2/viewforum.php?f=17
http://www.elexatelier.com/thorens.htm
Origin Live - Motor, Power supply and Tonearm solutions...
http://www.originlive.com
(although the orginal arm looks to be a low mass tonearm, something that the Rega is not...)
Contact this guy to see if he has a spindle (plus I'd order the kit)
http://cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...5736312031&rd=1
This might be a pretty good combo...
http://cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...5737106180&rd=1
Manual:
http://cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...5737378018&rd=1
VTA Adjustment for the Rega:
http://cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...5737242768&rd=1
What would they cost to ship from France???
http://cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...5737629816&rd=1
Motor pulley available:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI....5736882339&rd=1
Very Cool Combo!!!
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI....5736196997&rd=1
Grace 707...
http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...3859370396&rd=1
Enjoy and Happy holidays! :) |
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| Kofi Annan |
Apogee,
Thanks so much for all the links. I have learned quite a bit over the last few weeks.
The only remaining question I have is: Are you ready for the punch line?
I decided I would take another look at the motor this afternoon to determine if it really was the spindle. When I did, I noticed that the spindle had a dark mark on 1/2 of its circumference, but not on the other half.
Hmmm....
Being an Encyclopedia Brown fan, I decided to investigate further by removing the spindle using the directions on The Analog Dept. website. On the TD-160, there's a brass collar holding the spindle onto the pulley (right terminology?). According to the website "Brass locking collar has two set screws".
When I loosened the first screw, the entire assembly came apart immediately.
Hmmm....
So, the other screw was never tightened. It must have contributed to a crooked mounting, causing a greater distance between the pulley fulcrum and the platter, I thought. Well, actually, first I thought, "now you broke it FOR GOOD, DUMBASS!", then I thought the other thing.
I reassembled the spindle / pulley, only this time making sure to tighten both screws. When I started it up: WALLA WALLA, WASHINGTON! Its holding speed at 33 1/3!
Little Stevie Wonder sounds little... but not too little! And wow, what an improvement over my old Music Hall MMF 2.1!
I really want to thank everyone who helped me through this one. I know I can be a real pain, and a dumbass, and a stooge, and a lazy bum, and it really helps me to maintain those qualities when I have support like this from all of you.
I looked at the Grace tonearm link you sent, thanks. I'll be looking into that one, but I will likely purchase a used RB-250, since they seem to be in great supply and can be tweaked, upgraded, etc.
Thanks to all! Mittens and scarves to all who want them! Get knittin' Mrs. A!
Kofi |
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| Kofi Annan |
OK, last question for real this time. It does actually run a a teeny bit fast. Is there an adjustment for this?
I'm going to play with the motor mounting a bit to see if that addresses the speed issue, but I thought I'd ask in case anyone knows.
Kofi |
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| audio-kraut |
Hi kofi - you owe us bigtime for the wild goose chase - or we send the security council after you:D
Since the motor is a synchronous ac motor - as far as i recall -, there ain't much to adjust.
But if it just runs a teensie bit fast - why worrie? My old transcriptor hydraulik whom i had a new pully machined for does the same. Except for people with perfect pitch or for studio purposes IMHO it doesn't matter.
You could use the already recommended power supply at a couple of hundred bucks - but that would defeat the purpose of a reasonably price TT, wouldn't it? |
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| anatech |
Hi Kofi,
Use a light solvent to remove the dark line on the pulley. That will reduce the diameter of the pulley ever so slightly.
I have owned and enjoyed the Thorens TD-160, 125 MkII (current), TD-115 and others. My cartridge of choice so far is a Ortofon VMS-30E, I'm told an OM-30 is the same beast. The original Thorens arm is fine, nothing wrong with them.
Anyone know where to get original Thorens belts? Most have an incorrect width.
There are many fine turntables, I don't believe the Thorens tt or arm deserves to be knocked. Esp. in their price range.
-Chris |
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| Kofi Annan |
| quote: | | or we send the security council after you |
The Security Council? I am the motherfather Security Council, motherfather!!!
Just watched The Last Detail and I couldn't resist.
| quote: | | But if it just runs a teensie bit fast - why worrie |
Yeah... but its driving me nuts. Well, more so.
I really want to slow it down a bit. I think I'll try and shim the motor down a bit an see if that will help. Sorry, but once you hear something, you just gotta fix it. Like when I point out to Mrs. Annan that the faucet is dripping and she didn't notice it before. Then she hears it. Then she can't stop hearing it. Then she hits me in the face.
| quote: | | Use a light solvent to remove the dark line on the pulley |
Will Formula 409 work? I could go as high as Formula 412 if necessary, but that's experimental. Hey, I wonder where the schmuck is who thought up Formula 408?
| quote: | | Anyone know where to get original Thorens belts? |
I got mine from Trian Electronics. It says "Thorens" on the belt and they're the official Thorens dealer in the US, so I'm assuming its authentic.
Any other ideas on how to slow this down a bit?
Kofi |
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| anatech |
Thanks Kofi,
Use Methyl Hydrate or lacquer thinner to remove all the rubber off the pulley. Fold up a paper towel so you don't dissolve a Q-tip.
If you want to slowly make the pulley smaller, run the motor and gently hold some 600 grit wet / dry sandpaper against the pulley. Maintain the original contour.
The better Thorens tables used a multiphase frequency generator. Basically an AC synchronous motor driven from an internal oscillator. The was an adjustment available as well. You may be able to use a cassette motor to drive the table, but I can't see this being as stable as the Thorens units. Look up the TD 125 MKII for the motor design.
-Chris |
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| Kofi Annan |
| quote: | | Use Methyl Hydrate or lacquer thinner to remove all the rubber off the pulley |
Will do.
| quote: | | If you want to slowly make the pulley smaller, run the motor and gently hold some 600 grit wet / dry sandpaper against the pulley. Maintain the original contour. |
Maintainin' the original contour is what I'm all about, mah man!
Hey-- if I get the Rega RB250, will I have to build an armboard or can I mount it in place of the original Thorens arm?
Kofi |
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| planet10 |
Thorens belts can be had from Sound Hounds... 250 595 HiFi
i just use isopropanol to clean the pullies.
dave |
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| Kofi Annan |
Last last question (probably):
Just bought a Rega RB-250 off Audiogon and I need to know if there's something special I need to do to mount it to the Thorens TD-160. Will I need to build a tonearm board? If so, what materials are best?
Will I ever stop asking questions? Will I? What's that rash on my leg? OK, I can ask a doctor about that one. Just help me with the tonearm mounting then.
Kofi |
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| Gaucho |
| quote: | | Will I need to build a tonearm board? If so, what materials are best? |
Aluminum tends to sound bright, where as wood is to reasonant and will lead to some colouration. Acrylic is very good IMHO. I suspect delrin would be very good as well.
Regards |
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| anatech |
Hi Kofi,
Thorens actually made blank mounting boards for that purpose. They were made of MDF and should not be that hard to replicate. The top surface was painted semi-gloss black.
MDF is not a very resonant material, if you are worried about this, you can stick putty an the bottom. I don't recommend this, as it throws the weight off. Just copy the board that is on the unit.
-Chris |
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| Kofi Annan |
Should the new armboard be attached to the sprooooing mechanism on the Thorens like the current arm is or should it lay on top of the platter, not attached?
Am I making sense here? I can't tell anymore.
Kofi |
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| anatech |
Hi Kofi,
Since I am now using a TD-125 MKII, that's what I am remembering. I think the arm board screwed from the bottom on the TD-160 series. Mount it the same as the original, it uses the same mounting screws.
Others may disagree, but I think the best mounting board and method is used by the manufacturer when looking at products in this class.
-Chris |
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| Kofi Annan |
Thanks!
And since I don't have the mounting template, how will I be able to tell where to drill the hole for the pivot? Will I use the same place as the Thorens or will I need to change it?
Kofi |
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| anatech |
Hi Kofi,
Normally, you would mount your blank and use the mounting template that came with the arm. That sets up your overhange range. The height may also need to be adjusted. Check the web for instructions on this. I only know what I've seen while servicing these. My stuff has always used the manufacturer's arm.
One reason I haven't changed arms in the past is a the poor mounting jobs I have seen. Also, many arms that cost more were the same, or inferiour to the factory arm. I guess it's easy to throw darts at a stock item.
Sorry I couldn't help you more withthe specifics.
-Chris |
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| planet10 |
209mm IIRC ... i can double check or you can join the TT forum and download the manual.
dave |
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| Kofi Annan |
Thanks!
| quote: | | One reason I haven't changed arms in the past is a the poor mounting jobs I have seen. Also, many arms that cost more were the same, or inferiour to the factory arm. I guess it's easy to throw darts at a stock item. |
After much examination, I came to the convincing conclusion that the original arm was toast. I could feel the resistance in the arm as it ventured toward the center of the record. Plus, the tension line was broken... headshell wires had seen better days... etc. Hence, the bailout and purchase of a new arm.
I did like the Thorens arm, though, when it worked. Sounded fine.
| quote: | | 209mm IIRC ... i can double check or you can join the TT forum and download the manual. |
Joined the Vinyl Engine forum and found the information.
According to the Origin Live version of the Rega setup instructions, the distance is 223mm. I had downloaded the Rega manual, but it only indicated that I needed the template. The Origin Live version had the details.
Man, this is going to be a bit more complicated than I thought. I tried to make a template out of MDF this evening and failed miserably. I just couldn't get the depth correct. Side-cutting 15mm MDF really sucks.
Any other helpful hints you can provide would be much appreciated.
Thanks for all the advice!
Kofi |
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| planet10 |
| quote: | Originally posted by Kofi Annan
Rega setup instructions, the distance is 223mm. |
209mm must be the Grace 707 then...
dave |
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| Kofi Annan |
Everyone likes closure, right?
Here are a couple of photos from the sanded-spindle, Rega-mounted TD-160 that you have all helped create. |
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| Kofi Annan |
And another....
Also, I did actually sand the spindle quite a bit to reduce the speed. It had an exceedingly low yield on the effort / results ratio, so I started to look at the motor mounting.
The TD-160 motor is held in place by three screws (well, two screws and one screw post). The screw nearest to the platter is on a tight spring, which made me think. I loosened this screw a bit and the spring kept the mounting firm, but the motor inched (millimetered?) closed to the platter which, in turn, slowed the rotation.
I effed with this for a few hours and finally got the speed about right.
Per your collective advice, I mounted the Rega with MDF. It was surprisingly easy to do. I'm sure the VTA could use to be adjusted, but I think I'm going to leave that for another day-- unless of course someone preaches disaster to me about this...
The sound is truly beautiful and I can again enjoy my vinyl collection! Even Mrs. Annan is pleased. Well, by "pleased" I mean she's stopped hitting me in the face. Relative terms, baby.
Also installed some new Auricaps and stepped attenuators in the tube line stage, so that's really smoothing out the sound. Never thought I'd ask for and be delighted to receive capacitors for Christmas, but there you go.
Thanks again for all the fine help you all gave, and thanks for putting up with my stupidity. Now I gotta listen to vinyl and wait for something else to screw up.
Kofi
PS-- I'll be building a tube phono stage soon, and you know what that means. Don't think you're rid of me. I know where you live. |
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| anatech |
Hi Kofi,
Now it looks like you can enjoy some music! Are you going to paint the tonearm mount some time?
You might want to look into something like a "Platter Matter" to replace the original mat at some point. This thing adheres to the album and damps out resonace pretty well. You have to peel it off the LP after use. It's a pain to use but makes a hugh difference to the music. Enough so that I still use mine.
Don't forget to correct the vertical tracking angle if you change mats.
Well done,
-Chris |
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| Kofi Annan |
| quote: | | You might want to look into something like a "Platter Matter" to replace the original mat at some point. |
Asked for and may receive a new mat / record clamp for Christmas.
| quote: | | Don't forget to correct the vertical tracking angle if you change mats. |
Uhhh... I uhhh... really haven't aligned the VTA. I'm just kinda eyeballing it right now. The cartridge is aligned properly and the table is balanced, to the best of my ability, but the VTA... well... still need to do that.
Is it worth investing in one of those Rega VTA adjsuters? Will I destroy my record collection and rob myself of enjoyment if I don't meticulously adjust the VTA until later?
Kofi |
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| anatech |
Watch out for the ghosts of vinyl past. I think if you are in the ball park with VTA then you are fine. At least the cartridge isn't 15˚ off center ... is it? Have a great holiday!
-Chris |
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| rkay5 |
Ok Kofi I was reading your post today about your TD160 as I have had a 160 a TD146 and now I have a Thorens TD150mkII,you say that your table runs fast and faster with a new belt .Thorens belts are to tight it should be a total of 520mm to 530mm in lenght so what I did is put the belt on a 12" ruler overnight or for about 24 hours and that will help you also can adjust tilt of motor and you can get the speed right on also you can us a out board psu that is what I'm using a Project Speedbox .Now on to the tonearm on my TD150 I us a Rega RB250 that I got on ebay for $179.00 new 1 1/2 years ago I see RB250 on Audiogon all the time for $229.00 witch is a very good price
and for the money a very very good arm I love mine ,Hope as help Robert |
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| planet10 |
| quote: | Originally posted by rkay5
RB250... a very very good arm |
and even better tweaked up...
dave |
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| Kofi Annan |
| quote: | Originally posted by rkay5
Thorens belts are to tight it should be a total of 520mm to 530mm in lenght so what I did is put the belt on a 12" ruler overnight or for about 24 hours and that will help you also can adjust tilt of motor and you can get the speed right on also you can us a out board psu that is what I'm using a Project Speedbox . |
I figured out that you could adjust the tilt of the motor to adjust the speed, so things are definitely better, but still not perfect. I'll eventually splurge for an outboard TT motor, but I've got my hand in a speaker project right now (Swan D-101a). Couple that with some work issues that need attention (Iranian nuclear proliferation) and I've become a busy man.
Thanks for the reply!
Kofi |
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