| Vivek |
Hi,
Anyone got any ideas on how to make a cassette deck and most importantly, is it worthwhile? Any comment and links, if any, would be useful.
Regards,
Vivek |
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| r_s_dhar |
Vivek,
Just a few suggestions:
1. The head gap for the play and record heads are different. That means, that while you can still play your cassette through a head specifically meant for recording, you wont be getting the best.
2. Most deck mechanisms have a single head averaged for both playing and recording. Such deck mechanisms are not the best ones for HiFi.
3. Try to get a ceramic head specifically meant for play back with as high an impedance as possible -- this costs more, naturally.
4. Have you ever wondered why a car cassette player on a 12V battery sounds clean? That is because automobile cassette decks have heads that are designed specifically for playback. Try to get a decent car stereo deck and work up your circuitry.
5. While on this subject, I should remind of you LM1897 -- that would be an ideal tape head preamp for you.
good luck. let me know how your project is coming up |
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| Brett |
A second alternative would be to buy a good second hand cassette deck and just use the transport. Redo all the electronics and off you go. Best avoid anything with microcontrollers (unless you have expertise) as these can often control many aspects of the audio circuitry, and would create lots of unneccessary headaches trying to design around them. Otherwise tha audio is similar to a phono preamp, but with different EQ.
Good quality, reliable and well performing transports are nearly being given away at the moment. |
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| Havoc |
| Something to try: balanced head amplifier. But I would go with a readymade transport. |
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| MuFollower |
I somehow very seriously doubt that you'll do better than an existing commercial design. The mechanical tolerances on the transport are such that DIY would be very hard.
The TASCAM and Nakamichi decks would be near impossible to beat... The cassette is a crappy format anyway!
just my $0.02 |
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| Lisandro_P |
| quote: | Originally posted by Brett
A second alternative would be to buy a good second hand cassette deck and just use the transport. Redo all the electronics and off you go.
(...)
Good quality, reliable and well performing transports are nearly being given away at the moment. |
Excellent advice! I found a lot of old decent cassete decks at ridiculous prices at pawn shops or electronics shops. Most of the times they had some minors repair to be done (unhooked casette door, etc). |
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| bawang |
| Hmmmm, I agree to agree with MuFollower. Excellent commercial cassette decks (not THAT readily available nowadays) are available. Anyway, I have an AKAI GX-52 that keeps me smiling. How I wish for the NAKAMICHI DRAGON......... But with the popularity of CD Burners, cassettes may be going out the door........ |
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| dice45 |
Vivek,
hate to join the downtalk (you find me no fan of tuning a '65 Volkswagen Beetle to get fit for the Rallye Monte Carlo), but methinks you are better on with a second hand cassette tape deck.
A buddy of mine tried what you intend to try and just getting the tape EQ right for recording and playback drove him crazy.
Moreover, to get the heads properly aligned, you need calibration tapes which might be hard to find nowadays.
You put too much effort to get something working not worth the effort. If you want to take a swing to it, go with a reel2reel tape recorder. This is worth the pain!
A good reel2reel can outperform a vinyl TT. Not kidding, ya know, me vinyl person :) |
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| kayes |
I have the copy of JLH cassette deck articles ( 1976 wireless world and postcript article subsequently published in WW)and a set of 5 piece ( Mother board /daughter board construcion based on old Hart electronics kit of the same design) PCBs incase Vivek is interested as I am in Bangalore india - I think he lives here as well.
The PCB set is expansive due to seperate record / replay amps on a motherboard/ relay switching and unbeatable circuitry suited for most of the ferrite /permalloy type cassette heads. The beauty of this JLH project is that you can learn about magnetic recording process and head design /influence of materials and circuit on record replay cherecteristics. I have some of the transistors as well as the special erase head for a novel bias oscillator circuit. Anybody else is welcome eventhough the cassette format is dying. |
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| Vivek |
Hi,
I did not expect to get so many replies on this thread.
I think the best thing for me to do is to see if I can find a cheap transport or try to con someone into parting with his/her old cassette deck. I can then probably hook it on to a tape pre-amp.
The problem is that though I buy only CDs or get them burnt from a friend, I still have a huge load of tapes. I was looking to try and find something better than the commercially made deck I now have.
Shashidhar, what cassette deck do you have and do you have any idea what commercially made decks cost here?
Kayes, what kits do you sell?
Thanks to all for their comments.
Regards,
Vivek
P.S: Bernhard, nice looking tonearms. |
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| r_s_dhar |
Vivek,
Believe it or not, I have rigged up a car stereo deck. The deck mechanism and the preamp are run on a 12V battery. AC mains can be noisy. As someone remarked in this thread, cassette decks are a dying thing and there is no reson why we should spend a fortune on them. I concentrate on power amp and speakers.
Good luck. |
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| BlackWidowAudio |
Hey Kayes,
I have a JLH hood cassette deck you talk of but i cannot get any details on it would you be willing to give me a copy of the articles?
Vivek, I once build a cassette deck, the playback section I got a mechanism initially from the electronics souk, then I manage to purchase a brilliant mech from Hart Electronics in UK they do a single head and a twin head, with decent heads and solenoid operation.
Dan |
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| fdegrove |
| quote: | | A good reel2reel can outperform a vinyl TT. Not kidding, ya know, me vinyl person |
I agree,but that isn't that easy either IMO.
And good tape costs a lot too especially if you run it at 7.5 IPS.
Here too I'd rather buy a good secondhand one such as a Studer C37 or Revox G37.
And you all know why I prefer these don't you?
Cheers,;) |
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| Peter Daniel |
I wouldn't bother with building a tape deck nowadays. I have at least ten of them (including 2 R2R) and I'm using none.;) The best way is to find a good bargain on a used equipment market.
http://www.diyvideo.com/forums/show...ld+classic+gear
I have Nakamichi 1000ZXL, which is considered one of the best cassette decks (the other one is Tandberg) with full service manual. I was thinking about modifing the circuits and adding Dolby S, but somehow after 4 years, still didn't do nothing about it.;) |
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| fdegrove |
Peter,
| quote: | | I wouldn't bother with building a tape deck nowadays. I have at least ten of them (including 2 R2R) and I'm using none. The best way is to find a good bargain on a used equipment market. |
Think when you live in India it just ain't that simple.
Cheers,;) |
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| Peter Daniel |
| quote: | Originally posted by fdegrove
Think when you live in India it just ain't that simple.
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You mean building them, right?;) |
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| sangram |
It depends on what you use it for and how much it costs.
I've built quite a few decks, and there are major problems with the playback quality of commercial designs currently available in India. I have access to schematics of NAB tape preamps, but they need to be well built (read: No veroboard) to keep noise down.
Therefore I generally recommend buyin a used deck. I personally use a Sharp deck with a replacement Ferrite head and overhauled mechanical transport (the really hard push button keys) that is working excellently. No Dolby, simple VU meters, etc, and the thing cost under 3000 Rupees. A great buy by my standards.
As to the comments on India, there are a few problems, let me clarify what Vivek must've been trying to say.
The most widely used format in India is the cassette tape. It is much more economical than CDs, which typically constitute (legally) about 5% of music sales. Also most of CDs in India cost about $10, and some about $5-&6. Cassettes typically cost $2.50 or so, and if you look at the average GDP of the country, cassettes make more sense for most of the population. This is of course not counting piracy and downloading from K*Z**.
If you now account for the fact that most new music hits the indian scene first through piracy (an Example: Riding with the King was relased in India almost 6 months after its international release) and in the form of cassettes, a tape deck makes a lot of sense in our context.
Of course the cassette being a listening format not extensively suited for high end listening, it does not make sense to spend mucho bucks behind it in the first place... |
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| Vivek |
Sangram,
I have found the cheaper alternative to those expensive CDs available in the market. Many of my friends have CD writers. A blank CD costs about Rs 30. I get most of the albums I want (including Riding with the King) burnt at my friends' places. But again, I have some very good albums like ACDC, Guns and Roses on tape. I just do not have the heart to chuck them out.
By the way, where can I get one of those Sharp players you are talking about?
Cheers,
Vivek |
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| sangram |
Vivek:
1. Copying CDs at friend's places is piracy. You should not be talking about it on an open forum , specially since you're under your real name... Keep those topics for PMs. You might offend someone. Nobody's holy, but let's not be blatant about it either...
2. We have a good source in Calcutta for used equipment. You may not be able to find exactly the model you are looking for, but you can get pretty close and a good deal as well. I'm not sure where in Bangalore you can find one. I have a friend but he runs a proper showroom, I forget the name but it's on Airport Road (he also has another shop on MG Road near the St. Marks' Crossing), I think it's Modern Radio but I'm not sure. He may not remember me but you can use my reference and ask him if he knows anybody willing to dispose of a cassette deck. You might just hit paydirt. If of course you are willing to spend money you can pick up a ProFx from the showroom around 15 grand or so... |
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| sangram |
| Sorry... his name is Aqeel. |
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| r_s_dhar |
Sangram,
Thanks for very sensible words. If you went back to read previous threads on this topic, you will see another reason why some of us still hang on to tape decks. Good classical music is available only on tape and the few CDs that are available in this genre are obscenely expensive.
Please will you care to answer a few technical questions?
1. I am looking for a simple deck mechanism (no inbuilt amp). What do you suggest?
2. What do you do for speakers?
Beware!! If you answer these questions, more may follow.
Thanks. |
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| Vivek |
Hi Shashidhar,
Long time no see. What's up pal? Which projects have you completed?
Cheers,
Vivek |
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| sangram |
Hi Shashi (may I call you Shashi?)
I'm gonna go out on a limb and assume you wanna DIY it. If you wanna buy it, the grey market is a pretty good source. I pick up used stuff locally, and have access to evrything - Nakamichis, Denons, HKs, Sansuis... the works, and sometimes under 10 grand. If you want new, TEAC, Sony, ProFX (Denon in India) have stuff available legally, mostly above 15 grand. Sources available on request.
There are good soft touch mechanisms and associated cabinets available in Mumbai, Chennai and sometimes Cal. Delhi definitely. Bangalore - not so sure.
For a preamp, most of the stuff pretty much is low-fi, or mid-fi at best. There's no good preamp circuits DIY available, last time I checked, all were lo-cost designs with LA3161 etc. You can try to homebrew if you can whip up a PCB or a nice layout. I'm a bit leery of making low-signal circuitry on veroboard.
If you can score a working PCB from a used Sonodyne or Philips decks, you might hit paydirt. Canging the transistors around and moving everything to metal film and polyesters/tantalums will help a lot, but the basic circuitry in those decks is pretty solid. Use NAB EQ circuits, I have one based on opamps though if you wanna go discrete you'll definitely be able to find what you need...
Why don't you get in touch with kayes? He seems to have some stuff suitable for the electronics....
Those were a few options on decks.
What do I for speakers? I have just picked up a pair of Jamo 470s as my stereo speakers, and am weighing whether I need a sub or not. If not, the NAD C521i is on my shopping list for this month.
What do you do for speakers? Gee, I dunno. I used to love the Philips drivers. 7 years of trouble free service, and damn nice for 1200 bucks for the drivers (at the time, Philips no longer supplies those drivers) for a stereo 2-way system. I'm not sure quality drivers are still available in India. I never much cared for Bolton drivers, all talk and no walk. I know someone else over on the loudspeakers forum has mentioned that Peerless drivers are available in Mumbai (not the real peerless, some others). I really wouldn't know man. The last pair of speakers I built was last night, when I moved my Philips drivers into a new cabinet because the old one had termites... Never bought drivers in a while. |
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| ashok |
Today you can buy a new VCD/CD player for Rs3000/- (US$60/-). The VCD player is also available in kit form - chassis -transport-control board-audio /video board. So for a minimum outlay you have a new base to start on. May not be the best of systems but you can do a lot with it. Maybe even make it sound really great - that's what DIY is all about.
A 90 minute tape is Rs50 (US$1/-)
A blank CD-R is Rs15 or less (US$0.30)
You can see where the cassette tape will end up. Right now there is a market in the rural areas for tapes . I know people who used to make bulk cassette tapes ( recorded). The business has shrunk so much only a few key players are left - and shrinking as the cost of CD players drops.
You may not be aware of the present situation. When I tried to sell my 2 year old Marantz CD-67se I was offered Rs 4000/- (US$80-) ! Why buy a used cassette deck for Rs10,000/- ?
Have fun.
Cheers. |
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| sangram |
You bring up an intersting point, except if I remember correctly we established the fact that a cassette deck was what was required, not a CD player. Some 10 posts back.
I personally have stopped listening to cassettes, yet I have some very good bootleg tapes that cannot ever be found, I assume a lot of people has such tapes it will be impossible to find.
On the question of the 3000 buck all-in-one Cd players, I must comment on poor taste of anyone who thinks those players can be called 'good' by any stretch of imagination. Those players sound positively horrible, have the cheapest possible circuitry, and are built by electronic 'quacks' in China. The sound of one of those makes me cringe, it is so terrible. Dry sound, boomy and dull low end, and harsh upper treble, the midrange sounds as if someone took a knife to the vocalists throat and then got them to sing. And the distortion!!! If you think compacts sound good, then possibly you can like the sound.
And the mechanisms. Oh, my GOD! Solidly mounted with metal brackets to the chassis, no suspension. And those cheap XO oscs! and a single 7805 for the entire digital curcuit and the servo and the mech motor, bolted onto the chassis wothout a heatsink! And the use of ribbon wire for wiring amp controls! My Discman sounds like an Arcam compared to some of those. And I have auditioned plenty. If you value your ears, I would suggest to stay away from those players. You haven't bought one already, have you?
You can improve it a bit by DIY'ing a large part of the whole thing, but it'll cost you more than the player itself, a lot more. You can't polish a turd into a diamond.
I cannot understand the value of such a player to anyone. A good Nakamichi tape deck is worth its weight in gold. We in India think Sony and Pioneer and Onkyo and Marantz are the best you can buy. Mostly, that's a load of moo-moo. All Marantz sold in India is low-end Marantz. The top end is what sounds good, and costs a ton of cash, think in 6 figures and more.
Sorry guys. I can't control myself when someone talks about good-sounding audio in India. Half of us don't know what good sound is. Have you ever listened to any contemporary hindi film music on a good set of truthful monitors? Appaling!! And those guys are supposed to be pro sound engineers!!
Jeez. |
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| Vivek |
Phew Sangram, you have come out with all guns blazing. That should beat the daylights out of the cheap CD player market.
While we are at it, I have a Philips CD player but again, I do not have the bucks to upgrade now. What do you think of the Philips players?
Vivek |
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| ashok |
| quote: | Originally posted by sangram
You bring up an intersting point, except if I remember correctly we established the fact that a cassette deck was what was required, not a CD player. Some 10 posts back.
On the question of the 3000 buck all-in-one Cd players, I must comment on poor taste of anyone who thinks those players can be called 'good' by any stretch of imagination.................
And the mechanisms. Oh, my GOD! Solidly mounted with metal brackets to the chassis, no suspension. And those cheap XO oscs! and a single 7805 for the entire digital curcuit and the servo and the mech motor, bolted onto the chassis wothout a heatsink! And the use of ribbon wire for wiring amp controls! My Discman sounds like an Arcam compared to some of those. And I have auditioned plenty. If you value your ears, I would suggest to stay away from those players. You haven't bought one already, have you?
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Jeez. |
This is a DIY forum.
Many DIY people do just that. Me too - until I got older and could afford almost anything I wanted !
They take products and transform them into much better sounding systems. Often it is because they cannot buy more expensive products - not necessarily because they do not have enough money.
No need to look down upon cheap products. They were meant to meet a price point. Very often one can make quite a number of changes to improve the sound drastically without spending too much - especially so in India.
What else could you expect from a machine that costs so little.
Certainly a great place for someone to start tweaking. Everyone does not have enough money to buy expensive gear. DIYaudio is not about expensive equipment.
I would recommend that you look at the AV Max magazine published from Mumbai. Many High-End audio manufacturers of the world started selling their products through dealers in Mumbai quite a while ago. I just heard a B&W nautilus 801 with a Musical Fidelity Nuvista amp and matching CD player. That's just one. There are plenty of people down south with very high end equipment - you name them and they are there. Mumbai is loaded with equipment. I have been in this business for 30 odd years, maybe I should know!
Its good to encourage the youngsters and those who love playing around with hi-fi on a budget. They also come up with great ideas .
Its all about fun. If that is missing , it would not be worthwhile having a DIY forum. I think you will agree that we have to thank all the great guys who have been most patient and encouraging on this forum.
Thank you all ! |
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| sangram |
Vivek,
If the player you're talking about is one of the first Philips players, full size with a single tray (I don't remember the model number now) before they got into the Powerhouse game, you've got a good thing going. If it's one of the new Philips micros, it's a great set. Anything else from Philips was pretty average.
Ashok,
I agree that this is a DIY forum. I agree that you can take a cheap player and work wonders with it. I agree that that is the point of DIY - to have fun, do something productive and get a good sounding player all at the same time.
I also admit that I am an AV Max addict, I make it a point to read every issue. I know that B&W, Kimberkale, Arcam, Musical Fidelity, Dynaudio are available in India. I also have seen really good gear slowly come into the country. I have also been witness to the DIY scene in India, as you must have been. Ashok, do you really think we have the resources to DIY top-quality gear ourselves? How widespread are simple things like tantalums and 1% metal film resistors? Where are the drivers, the digital components? Where do you get the SMDs, and how easy is buying things from abroad?
Let me add up the costs:
New CD-Player: 2500 (average)
Wires: 300 (really good OFC shielded wire runs Rs. 80/m)
Resistors: 100
Caps: 150
Heatsink: 75
Pots: 200
ICs: 50 (LM 324 replacement, 7805 augment)
DAC kit: 600 (assuming the servo is OK, or else a new servo is in order)
Transformer/s: 1000 (Including the PSU components)
Ashok, I do not look down on cheap gear because it is cheap, but because it does not sound good. I have plenty examples of cheap systems that sound better than things 2x or 3x their price, but I'm afraid the Chinese stuff is not up there with that set. This site is about audio, too, not just DIY. And one must be discerning enough to know what is good audio, and what is not. Bad construction=bad sound, more or less. Bad components=bad sound, more or less. You can spend upto Rs. 5000 totally with one of those Chinese things, and get a halfway sounding player. Or get a new player for a little more than that, that though not the top of league, will have acceptable sound.
The day we have access to good DAC kits, custom-made transformers, nice CD-transports, I will eat my words. Till then, my friend, I am afraid the readymade segment calls the shots. I earned my living from DIY for a full two years before I got a real job. Ashok, you're in the business now. What do you really think? Honestly? Do you think we can DIY at a level that can compare with a good international name? And with the CD-kits that are available?
It has also got a lot to do with how discerning we as consumers we are. As long as we go on swallowing cheap systems without feeling the need to complain, we will get exactly that. As long as the public buys things with more lights on them than sound quality, we will get substandard systems.
I am not saying all of us should go and buy the most expensive system we can afford, or lust after the top end of audio only. I have seen plenty of the new micro-hifis that omit the flashy lights, 200 control buttons and stuff like 'DJ bass' or some other beef, and instead concentrate on getting the sound right. And it IS a major improvement. They indeed sound as good as systems 3x their price, but are not successful because we guys want the 200 control buttons, the airport displays and 4-level bass system that muddies and colours the sound.
Ashok, remember the old days of Indian audio? The Silver Sonodyne cassette players with built in amps? Or the Philips separates systems? Where have they gone? Sonodyne is marginalised into professional audio and the Genie systems. Philips is making systems with blue LEDs dancing in the speakers (I will reserve my comments on this). Where have players like Cosmic disappeared? Where has the average Indian taste in music gone to? What does the average Hindi film recording sound like? What does the average hindi film song sounds like?
Please weigh what I am saying carefully. I am not trying to put down your opinion. I am talking about the fundamental issue of taste, or rather our lack of it. And I am crying out against it. |
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| Vivek |
Sangram,
When you refer to those old Sonodynes or Philips Hi-Q amps, you are talking hi-fi. Those were the good days. A friend offered me one of those Philips amps with a set of Philips speakers for Rs 1500. That price was dirt but I did not have money to buy it. That set is a classic. I would put it up against brands like Onkyo or Bose.
I have a Sonodyne FM 2000 (modified by me) but I find that it is not as good as the Sonodyne rack system my uncle bought in 1985. That system was a wonder even with its cone tweeters.
I fully agree with you about today's generation. All they want to see is the airport displays with leds dancing about in bizarre ways. And there is the craze for watts. No one ever bothers to notice the quality of sound. They just want the whole house to rattle with overamplified bass. I built a pair of speakers with Indian made Peerless drivers (much better than present day Boltons). The first thing my friends asked was the wattage. I told them to comment about the sound and not to worry about the wattage. With the current state of things India can boast of volume enthusiasts and not sound enthusiasts. Sad but true.
Finally, check out www.circuitsonweb.com. They have some Philips amp kits and a couple of Crescendo kits too. They also have some Philips pre-amp kits. Let me know if any of them are worth trying. Also let me know if there are any kits available in India which are worth trying.
Cheers,
Vivek |
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| sangram |
| quote: | Originally posted by Vivek
...Finally, check out www.circuitsonweb.com. They have some Philips amp kits and a couple of Crescendo kits too. They also have some Philips pre-amp kits. Let me know if any of them are worth trying. Also let me know if there are any kits available in India which are worth trying.
Cheers,
Vivek |
Thanks for the link.
Actually the only kits in India worth trying out are the TDA 7294 gainclones, which are available in Banaglore. These are pretty decent power opamps, and though they are opamps, they can give a lot of discrete amps a run for their money.
The original Philips amps are available in kit form, upto the 40w/ch model, pretty readily. You can rustle up one for very little moolah, though beware - they use output caps. |
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| Vivek |
Hi Sangram,
I suppose the output caps introduce distortion. Basically, what I was asking you was which kit (discrete only) is worth trying. I have built an STK 4171 amp but I would like to go a little further.
The Zens, Alephs, P3As are certainly worth trying but with the problem of part availability, one gets fed up. The link has a couple of Crescendo amps too. Do you think I can try that?
Cheers,
Vivek |
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| sangram |
Maybe, I dunno. I've never heard the Crescendos in action, but from a challenge point of view they would be nice. Some of the discrete designs that keep popping up on this site are quite nice.
If you want a REAL challenge, try to pick up a Philips amp and modify it for running off a split PSU...
Joking there. I peaked at a bridged 4191 using a preamp from the Philips design book. The amp is happily chugging along, currently being used as a subwoofer amp (don't ask!), having been run at 100% volume levels for numerous parties, and being dropped two dozen times - even though I've lost the book.
I've never DIY'ed discrete, I've never found good enough designs. I've heard good things about Crescendo, so I don't think it would hurt to try one channel and see if it works well for you. |
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| jethari |
| quote: | Originally posted by Vivek
Hi Sangram,
The link has a couple of Crescendo amps too. Do you think I can try that?
Cheers,
Vivek |
Vivek
I've tried the Mini Crescendo - a slightly scaled down version of the Crescendo. Its brilliant with an absolute clean output. Its rated at 50W rms and believe me its much more than you need!! But make sure you use the biggest heatsink that you can lay your hands on!!! |
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| kayes |
Guys in Bangalore - If you want I have a fully built MiniCrescendo with metal film resistors / switch on delay / film capacitors of Vifa etc -With Aluminium frame welded box - all aluminium with front and Top Aluminium covers Powder coated/ Computer grade Power supply caps and 35 Amp rectifier bridge for 2000 Rs -
Ofcourse it has Aluminum L bracket bolted on to the Heatsink at the back.
Incase you want to build a nice 50 W RMS amp without bothering to source the compnents and soldering or trying to make the L bracket suitable for mounting the power transistor as this circuit board has direct mounting of MOSFET.
Since I partly buit Linsely hood Class A amp - I kept this away.
Anybody buying this should rewire and clean up the wiring and general arrangement for a beatiful 50 W amp.
Yeah you can try Power supply bypass or component chage or stabilised power for driver stage etc.
The heatsink and Aluminium box alone would cost the price I am asking.
Since i am in US right now, if you show interest I have to ask somebody at my home to take it out and give it to you
I am not interested in shipping as it is heavy with transformer / |
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| r_s_dhar |
Sangram,
Thanks for your reply.
Although Mangalore, where I live and work, boasts of a Regional Engineering College and half a dozen other engineering colleges, DIY electronics here is dismal. I cannot even dream of having access to all those brand names that you mention in your post.
Anyway, as to electronics (preamp), I have a thing or two to say. Indeed most indian circuits (a la EFY) are limited to LA3161. In my letter to Vivek who has posted here I had told him that LM1898 is worth a try. It is a dedicated new generation tape head preamp with DC coupling. You must here to believe it. This, coupled with TDA7294, can be a great thing. Discrete designs may in principle beat IC based circuits. But you spend a fortune and an age in maching transistors and getting all those 0.1% MFRs.
My experience with Philip 8" Woofers was not a happy one. I spent two months in measuring the TS parameters of these drivers only to find out that these are not particularly HiFi devices. I had paid almost 450 Rs for each driver. I have just started a new thread in this forum about the feasibility and the advisability of using bi- and triaxial speakers. Have anything to say?
Please continue to share your experience on usable decks. I am basically looking for a car deck that can be run on 12V source.
Thanks. |
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| sangram |
| quote: | Originally posted by r_s_dhar
Sangram,
Thanks for your reply.
Although Mangalore, where I live and work, boasts of a Regional Engineering College and half a dozen other engineering colleges,
and some of the best seafood I have ever tasted, a wonderful virgin white beach, and arguably the most challenging landing strip in the world which only the most seasoned pilots can tackle :D ;)
DIY electronics here is dismal. I cannot even dream of having access to all those brand names that you mention in your post.
Anyway, as to electronics (preamp), I have a thing or two to say. Indeed most indian circuits (a la EFY) are limited to LA3161. In my letter to Vivek who has posted here I had told him that LM1898 is worth a try. It is a dedicated new generation tape head preamp with DC coupling. You must here to believe it. This, coupled with TDA7294, can be a great thing. Discrete designs may in principle beat IC based circuits. But you spend a fortune and an age in maching transistors and getting all those 0.1% MFRs.
Yes, unfortunately I've never built any discretes, nor do I plan to. I'm so far happy with my setup at home, all of which is purchased, all of it is imported new and used gear, because I do not think we are at a stage where we can DIY anything to any sort of hi-fi standard.
My experience with Philip 8" Woofers was not a happy one.
Mine was :) Although I'm referring to the NOS woofers, which go down to around 30 Hz with no problems, and were purchased in 1995, and are still happily blasting away. The new ones are not worth talking about, I've seen them as a matter of interest and to make a long story short, am not interested. Even the dealer does not recommend them anymore.
I spent two months in measuring the TS parameters of these drivers only to find out that these are not particularly HiFi devices. I had paid almost 450 Rs for each driver. I have just started a new thread in this forum about the feasibility and the advisability of using bi- and triaxial speakers. Have anything to say?
Please continue to share your experience on usable decks. I am basically looking for a car deck that can be run on 12V source.
I think you are talking about mechanisms? I know for a fact that complete car systems are not that hi-fi, unless you're looking at the cream of the crop. For mechanisms my friend, I am at a loss. I do not know of a single tape transport avaailable in the country that can satisfy a hi-fi buff like me, even accounting for the fact that the tape is a deficient listening medium.
Thanks. |
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| Vivek |
I have a couple of huge heatsinks originally bought (Rs 350) for building the P3A. I however have doubts about building the P3A under Indian conditions.
But if Jethari thinks that the amps are good, maybe I will give it a try.
I just want to hear a discrete amp.
Shashidhar,
The tragedy in India is that most people (99.99%) study BE electronics just for the sake of the degree. They do not study it for the love of the subject. |
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| Vivek |
Kayes,
Can you tell me where premium components are available in Bangalore (things like computer grade caps). Most of the idiots in SP Road do not understand tech jargon.
Cheers,
Vivek |
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| kayes |
I got components from UK/ Japan/ Hong Kong/ US etc like Multicap Polyustrene caps and large number of Nakamichi cassette deck spares and alignment tapes/ instruments
as well as Opamps like OPA 2614/ OP275 and dual matched Toshiba Fets all of
costing a lot. I also got some some Precision polyusterene caps locally. But such caps cannot be bought in small quantities.
Interestingly I have 5 Nakmichi decks including top of the line CR7/ Dragons!!!- some of them for sale and one is brand new and prestine / Mint!
I also have Linsely hood Deck circuit & Boards and components which You cannot get it in India. Unfortunately if you are thinking of not spending money, you cannot do much.
If you look at how Nakamichi mechanism is made and the engineering behind these mechanism,their playback/ record / erase heads as well as their circuitry, you will understand why they are still go for 1000 US dollar on Ebay auctions.
Getting even good quality Polyester cap is very difficult in Bangalore! So you have to look beyond local shops if you need them.
Kayes |
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| Cobra2 |
Hi, Do you have spares for the CR-5?
Would also be interested in alignment tape/equipment.
I have a RX-202 w.broken turn-mecanism and worn drivebelts if we can trade...
Arne K |
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| kayes |
What spares you need for Cr5?
My spares are in India and probably I can try something here in US. I have a fully working CR7 here in US -110V for sale
Kayes |
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| sangram |
| quote: | Originally posted by kayes
... Unfortunately if you are thinking of not spending money, you cannot do much. |
I whole-heartedly second that.
However, if you do want to spend (like I do) the best way is to buy, not build...
Decks and parts are difficult to find in India. I guess Mumbai would be an exception.
Then again I found a matched pair of original RCA 6L6 tubes in a small 2ft by 2ft. shop in Cal. They were charging about 2 grand for the pair so they knew what they were talking about, too... |
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| r_s_dhar |
Kayes,
I have often considered buying decisive components (such as 1% MFRs in E24 Series, Polypropylyne 2% Caps) from kit vendors abroad. I never went ahead as I have no idea how many pieces one has to place an order for as minimum and the modus operandi of payment. Now that you are in the US, could you tell me whether the likes of Radio Shack honour small time orders? Would it be possible to make payment in terms of Indian Rupee?
Please let me know.
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| ashok |
This post is specifically for DIY guys in India. There are tons of parts avalable in India. If not in your city certainly in one of the other metro's. Get help from your friends - classmates-colleagues.
Mumbai is certainly the best. I bought Hitachi MOSFET's 2SK1058/2SJ162 from a street shop for Rs 560/- ( US$11.20) a pair. That is as good as many international prices. I also paid about Rs 330/- (US$6.60) for the same in Hong Kong. There are lots of other components available in Delhi and Mumbai. Heat sinks are far cheaper in Indian than in Europe. There are tons of computer grade capacitors up to about 100 volts or so.
I opened my limited production Rogers GS-1 loudspeaker to find an Indian made polyester capacitor inside!
So Indian parts are not all trash. Check them out and pick the good ones. All semiconductors are generally genuine if they are not used very widely like 2N3055 !
Fake products generally will be very widely used and making it worth while faking !
Imports for personal use. Today's import rules say that you can import any of these components including speaker drivers without any licencing required. There is a duty on it with surcharge etc which amounts to about 51 %. You can import it and pay duty on arrival. There is a US$5000/- per year restricition on how much you can send abroad or spend on your travels abroad ( totally) ( on credit card or taken as drafts or exchange from a FX dealer).
I bought 6L6 tubes ( not matched ) for Rs700/- a pair. ECC82's for Rs75 each. ECC 83's are mostly fake and actually ECC 82 with the labels changed - a few are genuine. Look around. There is more than what you have seen so far. That is true for any country.
DIY and have fun.
Cheers. |
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| kayes |
Ashok
If you are not lucky, or not willing to grease the palm of guys at Customs, you will end up not getting your parts or pay through your nose as duties / fines.
My 20 lot 10nF Multicap costs more than 100 US$ crosses the 1 year import quota of a person and one Nakamichi alignment tape would cost around 80 $ (shipping from Japan will cost 20$ additionally) One Nakamichi Head alignment gauge costs over 400US$ at 65% total duty on the one item will make you run away from any thought of importing.
Secondly you may not receive your parcel thru our mailing system or pay large money to receive it through Fedex.
Importing is easier said than done. But still you get large number of semiconductors in ordinary shops in SP road or Lamington road - I have spent lot of times in these roads including Madras shops. If you do not ask the price in many shops you end up paying double for the same semi in the first shop you asked.
However in US you have to order everything through internet and the shipping costs are prohibitive.
If you want few items, plan and get as many items from one vendor at a time. If you want special semis or Inductors or Caps and if you are willing to spend money US/UK/Dutch / Germany are the places to look.
Ultimately you need strong leg/ time and money for it and few of us have got it. India had missed the oppotunity by stupid import policy regarding electronic components compared to Computer components - or Digital ICs - so you find large number of computer related items are available at international prices in India and no importer is interested in Audio related stuff any way.
My wishes to all those who are willing to go forward even though it is not easy
Kayes |
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| Vivek |
Guys, forget about importing things to India. It is not worth the trouble. The whole system is ****. I got fed up asking how I can import a couple of Vifa tweeters. All everyone said was that the customs will make you wish you had never thought of importing. Even Blue Dart said it will be very difficult dealing with customs.
Vivek |
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