| PaulH_1980 |
My friends held another LAN Party last night and today, and I was lucky enough to have brought my camera along and get some very cool pictures I wanted to share with the forum. I am not going to be like some of the people out there and say "go buy a commercial projector!" but I find this experience was VERY motivational for me in terms of the type of quality projector I plan to build, and now have renewed energy to continue working very hard on.
Two people at the LAN Party had brought commercial projectors which got setup in a seperate room side by side for massive gameplay on UT2 Multiplayer. They took up almost the entire wall which is similar to a "widescreen" ratio size, because of a shelf underneath it mounted to the wall. You can see from the pictures the quality and differences between the two in the following sets of photos. I will try and provide information about the two projectors and just general comments about the various pictures to explain how they had things setup.
The two projectors used were the:
Compaq MP2800 [DLP] [which is the projection on the left]
Projector Review
Manufacture Info
Epson Power Light 7300 [the projection on the right]
Manufacture Info
The pictures will be listed in the posts below:
-Paul- |
|
|
| PaulH_1980 |
Picture of the Compaq MP2300. Notice the DLP logo on the side. :)
Getting the two projectors setup side by side. [With lights on]
Looking really nice and sharp with lights off. DLP on the left and LCD on the right
Computers up and running loading into windows.
Two screens in one. DLP overlaying the LCD projection. You can see winamp ghosting through the background of the other PC.
UT2 multiplayer side by side. Both are on opposite teams. I hope no one is peeking at the the other guys screen. hehe
MP2800 is action. Blinding all who walk in front of it.
Epson Powerlight 7300 & Compaq MP2800 side by side.
Clear shot of the MP2800.
What do you know. He found you... I wonder how he knew where you were ¿ |
|
|
| PaulH_1980 |
This setup was done by hooking both of the projectors up to one computer with the nvidia dual view feature. It outputs your desktop to multiple monitors as one desktop. This would be [IS] great for watching huge widescreen movies. Very cool effect in general. This is something I want to setup myself, by creating to high quality, identical DIY projectors. Also these are good pictures to compare the quality and color/contrast between the 2 projectors. The DLP looks really sharp, but in some pictures it looks like the color is better than the other one, and in some it looks more washed out. Judge for yourself.
Joe standing 6 feet in front of the projection. He is standing between the twp projectors which are setup out to the sides angled in. This way he doesn't throw a shadow on the screen. I'm taking the pictures from in between the two projectors.
Note sure what movie this is.
Which one do you think is better Joe ¿ Oh really, the DLP you say...
Fast and Furious off some guys computer. Some good shots of colors and comparisons.
Picture #2
Picture #3
Picture #4
Picture #5
The black line between the two can be removed if you align the projectors perfectly which only takes a minute to do. I told them do do that so I could get some pictures for the forum, and people would be able to tell where one projection stops and the other begins.
I hope people are able to get a good comparison from the pictures. Being able to watch this last night and get ideas from what I saw has really inpsired me to keeping working hard on my DIY projector. In the future I would like to be able to setup 3 projectors side by side, one DLP commercial, one LCD commercial, and one really nice DIY projector, to compare the quality between them all. Seeing this has given me even more drive than before to create a really nice, high quality projector. Thanks to all in the forum for the ideas and inspiration, I think this is what keeps the community strong and helps keep people on track.
-Paul- |
|
|
| Bricolo |
I want one!!!
So small, so beautifull, DVI input and composite inputs, the image looks good
4500$ :hot: |
|
|
| PaulH_1980 |
:hot:
I have seen people on the forum at times post that commercial is the way to go, and about how much they spent on their DIY setup. But I feel that for the money you save doing it yourself, it's totally worth it to build your own. Look how far people have come in just the last two years. Who knows, a year from now we may be building projectors of this quality, based of the inovations people on this forum come up with day to day.
I think these pictures are a good representation of the quality differences between exsisting commercial projectors, and a good benchmark for those who already have great quality DIY's that they are improving everyday. I mainly wanted to share some pics for those who have not seen DLP or LCD commercials in action. They look great but I am all for DIYing it !! This has been good inspiration for me. :)
-Paul- |
|
|
| Negative Design |
nice, on your next lan party I want to see a comparison with a CRT :)
I seen an episode of techlive whre they showed 1 LCd and DLP...the LCD won..
anywho my real reason for posting is...Nice avatar! I love RK;) lol |
|
|
| freeupyermind |
| personally i like the lcd better from the pics youve shown, im qute interested now in building 2 identical projectors and using them side by side, bigger picture size, major cutdown on screendoor, are you sure its really that easy to align them? |
|
|
| PaulH_1980 |
NegativeDesign - Thanks man... Kenshin is a great series. Loved the final OAV. I'll be interested if we can track someone down with a CRT projector. I will be asking around. With 3 types of projectors we would probably need to do it in a longer room with more wall space for the next set of pictures. :) Always a good thing though!
freeupyermind - Yeah the LCD looked really nice for some things, and the DLP looked really nice for others. Notice the scene in picture #3 and #4 of Fast and the Furious. In #3 you can notice some skin colors are off for what you would normally expect and the white shine off his eye is sharper with the DLP projector. Picture #4 makes this more apparent as you can see the distortion as the car is speeding down the street. [Look at his arm for a good example in this shot.] The DLP had issues also where it seemed that if you moved your eyes from one point to quickly you could see RGB flashes. [I can't really explain what this looked like.] Seemed both had their pros and cons. I think the best thing about the DIY projectors is that we know more about our setups than someone who bought a commercial. According to the guy that had the MP2800, when I told him a MH can put off about 15,000 - 25,000 lumens on average he told me that his projector puts off "60,000 - 90,000 lumens". *hehe* I just smiled and nodded.
I think for aligning two DIY projectors you would just want to make sure that they are at the same height. Like when you setup R-L front surround speakers. As long as they where at the same height you should not have a problem. The spacing would be good to work out before you have anything set in stone, but for these two they were about 6-7' feet apart and not really at much of an angle. As you can see in the pictures the MP2800 is actually about 2-3' feet lower than the epson power light 7300, but this projector is able to angle the image upwards without any kind of distortion. I agree that this would cut down on screen door alot, as I was about 4' feet from the wall at times and did not notice any pixels, and I would say the images were about 4-5' feet tall. Another nice thing is if someone is standing right in the middle of the screen you won't get a huge shadow blocking a lot of your picture. You can see when my friend is standing there there is actually no shadow at all, unless he is extending his arm out to the sides. I am also very interested in creating a setup like this, for a really huge high quality widescreen. Thanks for the input.
-Paul- |
|
|
| freeupyermind |
| well if at the next one your gonna have a retail lcd, dlp, and crt, you should also have a diy lcd to be able to get some good comparison shots! |
|
|
| Negative Design |
| quote: | Originally posted by freeupyermind
well if at the next one your gonna have a retail lcd, dlp, and crt, you should also have a diy lcd to be able to get some good comparison shots! |
Why not have a Plasma,Flat LCD tv, and a WEGA tv as well :eek: and lets not forgrt the 100" tv :)
If you were in my area I'd probably lend you my CRT for compariosn, I dont have any room for it anyways..lol
as for DIY LCDs...I think they can compare will many retails but I doubt it can compete with anything above 1,500:1 ratio
My new goal is to find the HIGHEST ratio projector...either LCD or CRT whichevers cheaper....
anywho..what "FINAL" OAV are you talking about? seisouhen?
Because thats the nly OAV I've seen, I also seen all episodes(uncut) up to 64, I'm waiting till I have a MAIN projector so I can see the rest...RK deserves no less! lol
ND |
|
|
| PaulH_1980 |
freeupyermind - That's the plan... I deffinitly want to get some good shots comparing the various types of projectors. From what I saw as far as picture quality even my ghetto DIY projector I have right now is decent compared to these. And that's with using a Dukane 4003 with the stock bulb, and a 3M 6400 panel [640x480] The biggest difference in picture quality was the amount of light these put off compared to mine, and I will be judgeing the difference again once I get my new bulb. [The resolution was also much higher but I have yet to upgrade my panel/LCD to one from a monitor, with higher res. I think they both were doing 1024x768] I'll put up some comparison pics with the stock FXL bulb and the new MH bulb. Thanks for the input...
ND - Hey man if you bring all that over, I'll hook it up and take pictures. *hehe* Yeah, where in New York are you, I used to go out the City about once a year, and out to Long Island. Yeah it's too bad the contrast ratio on LCD monitors is not quite that high yet, but I would probably be happy with 300:1 - 400:1 for now. That'd be good for the second projector on my list.
Seisouhen OAV is the final OAV, doh! Big spoilers in that one. The series went:
Original OAV - Volumes 1,2,3,4 [Each was 45min long - Story of Kenshin as a child [Shinta] becoming the Hitokiri Battousai. Really good OAV !!!]
TV Series - Episodes 1-95 [Story of Rurouni Kenshin, the wandering samurai.]
Kenshin Movie ["Requiem for the Restoration Royalists" 90mins - Movie would take place sometime during the TV series or possibly right after.]
Seisouhen OAV [Final installment of the Kenshin series, reflects on the rest of the series, and shows who Enishi has become. This was meant to be the final episode of the TV series more or less as you can tell by watching the last episode they tried to cram way to much into a 23min episode.]
Yeah Kenshin is deffinitly one of my favorite animes ever. My friends are really into anime also so they are always giving me more stuff than I ever have time to watch. They are pretty current on all the fansubs that are coming out of Japan. They're so obsessed they freak out on wednesday when the new episode of Naruto comes out in Japan, and then pace until friday when it is subbed and released to the torrent sites in english. *hehe* Hope some of the kenshin info helps. Later
-Paul- |
|
|
| Negative Design |
Ahhh I see, I undestand now! lol I saw the 4 OAV but I havent seen seisouhen but i HAVE it on my pc :)
yeah the 4 OAv are perfect. the imagery looks amazing on my last projector (QA 1200) Im not watching the rest till i have another.
yeah I have the movie too, my version is called "Samurai X"
hey! dont mention enishi! your ruining it for me! lol
ohhh so ThaT where my friend gets his naruto! lol
oh yeah im in Brooklyn NY, I dont know If I'll still have my CRT by the time you get here...I dont have anywere to place it...:(
(feel free to email me you other favorite animes ..so I can begin downloading em :))
ND- |
|
|
| PaulH_1980 |
Just a couple more pictures of the setup. Two really good shots of each individual screen this time also.
Joe by projection.
Good clear shot of LCD projector.
Good clear shot of DLP projector.
Screen door effect on Dan's CRT monitor... and on Dan himself. :clown:
Another shot of the projectors in a well lit room.
Epson PowerLight 7300 in action.
Whoops my flash was on. Projections still look good though.
More split screen movie watching.
Colors do look better on the LCD projector in this one.
Split desktop with Nvidia dual view.
Well that's it for the pictures from this LAN party. I do have more but they are mainly off topic drinking/keg pictures... hehe Hopefully next time I will be able to get a good comparison, with projectors people have mentioned. DLP, CRT, LCD, DIY etc, etc... Please let me know if you have any other ideas of what would make a comparison. I'm very excited to get my DIY projector up to par for the next LAN Party so I have something very comparable to those, shy of the contrast ratio. Let me know what you think.
-Paul H.- |
|
|
| pizzi |
PAULh
Did you ask how much did they cost their owners? These are older units so I was wondering how much they paid. And another thing the compaq is lower in lumens by alot but in the picture they look the same?
The rgb thing you said is known as the rainbow effect one of the downside of dlp. |
|
|
| Mr.Kh |
| Is this dual video/monitor thing only possilbe on nVidia cards? Or do parehelia and radeon's also have similar programs? Also is that just mediplayer? |
|
|
| MovLab |
| quote: | Originally posted by Mr.Kh
Is this dual video/monitor thing only possilbe on nVidia cards? Or do parehelia and radeon's also have similar programs? Also is that just mediplayer? |
Hi Mr.Kh:
http://mitglied.lycos.de/stereo3d/
This Will output dual Video.
This Is Many Ways.
I Have A Dual output Card. (5200).
I Don't know if other Cards have dual Output..
Just a little input here...
Cheers,
MovLab :) |
|
|
| PaulH_1980 |
Pizzi - I did ask about the prices on the projectors. For the Compaq MP2800 apparently it belongs to the guys father, and is for "work use" only. [Which I would say the LAN Party qualifies as. ;) ] But he said he uses it every now and then for special things like this, and watching "good" movies on it. From what he told me the bulb life is about half way gone now and the bulb itself costs about $500.00, doh! [BTW I think it is a 1000 hour bulb.]
The Epson PowerLight 7300 cost my friend less than 200 dollars because he works at a place where they recycle old computer equipment. Every now and then companies send in stuff that still works fine. His bulb was also at about it's half life when he got it, and I think this bulb may cost about $300 - $500. I'm not sure how long it lasts though.
Yeah I wasn't aware of the difference in Lumens either by just looking at it. The Compaq was also on it's lowest light setting to conserve to bulb more. It may have been the ambient light from both projectors in the room, or the Epson may have been turned down also. I'll try and ask and find out about that.
The rainbow effect ? I knew I wasn't just drunk that night. :) Thanks...
Mr.Kh - The dualview feature is available through the drivers of the nVidia card once it is installed. I have looked online and it appears ATI also has similar support for their cards.
Google - "ATI Dual Display"
I'm not sure about the other card, but several people have asked me about the ATI cards and whether or not they can do this. I cannot personally verify this though as I do not own an ATI card that can.
Yes we were just playing DivX movies through media player. Another reason the picture doesn't look quite as good as it was. I think we should have used a DVD for a good example but those guys were too lazy. [Also I have compressed the images quite a bit and they do not show the full quality of the images].
Hope this helps...
-Paul- |
|
|
| Negative Design |
Yeah ATi's can do it :cool: actually we had it before Nvidisuck did :p I think its called Dualvision or something like that..lol
most new cards(ATi) Have one VGA and one DVI port and some other ports.I use my LCDs on my VGA-to-DVI ...me like :)
oh yeah its called HyDraVision!(cool huh:cool: )
Paul, I signed up to that site you told me about...I saw ur id..dang 2 weeks!? thats too long I'll search on kazza.
ND |
|
|
| LOOie |
Great pics.. games on projectors are fantastic!!!!
re: multi-monitor..
I have a GeForceFX 5600(Nvidia) 128MB and Radeon9800XT(ATI) 256MB. The 9800XT is currently the fastest consumer 3D graphics card on planet for games. The only thing that comes close on the Nvidia side is the GeforceFX5950. I've replaced my GeForceFX with the faster ATI so I've had a chance to play with both on multi-monitor and on the projector.
I should mention that ATI driver support for multi-montor SERIOUSLY SUCKS at this point in time. Hydravision!! hahahaha.. are you serious?.. :xeye:
This is because Nvidia's driver nView driver can emulate two monitor outputs as a single large screen, e.g. 2048x768 (or 2 monitors @1024x768 ). To software, it's just another weird resolution. Developers can take advantage of this without having to change thier code very much. The Matrox
Parhelia also does this with its 3 monitor output (though the Perhelia's 3D performance leaves a lot to be desired). Quite a few games support this feature. i.e.
http://www.matrox.com/mga/3d_gaming/surrgame.cfm
On some games like X2, I could have the projector displaying the main screen on the wall and the second desktop showing status and other views. e.g. 1+4 http://www.egosoft.com/x2/info/patch11info/
Since I got the ATI I lost just about all these features :(
This is because ATI choose to implement thier Windows drivers the officially correct "right way" as dictated by Microsoft and instead of "faking" it like Nvidia/Matrox. :xeye:
ATI drivers emulate a second PCI video card in the drivers. Same way you can stick another PCI video card in your PC to get multi-monitor windows. This works great with Windows desktop applications but a huge pain the *** for games and videos.
(btw- I managed to get 5 monitors going once, 1 dualview AGP + 3 PCI :) )
Dont get me wrong, I still love the ATI card, it kicks Nvidia butt on just about everything 3D games wise at the moment. But I miss nView's features like easy multi-monitor games, desktop arranging and video overlay output on second monitor for DVDs.
p.s. just got informed of a rumor (finders crossed!..) that Catalyst 4.0 drivers for ATI will support this emulated span mode. |
|
|
| Mr.Kh |
| Yeah I saw something on HardOCP a little while ago it was a QA with an ATI rep, and someone asked about a span mode, and the answer was something along the lines of - it's something we're looking into. |
|
|
| Negative Design |
Hey paul, I took these Rk shots for you knowing ur big fan :) (liek me :D)
These pics are kinda bad...plus the source videos is low Q...but its still rocks...to me at least lol
 
I took some shots form "stabbing westward" but they were too dark...
Oh yeah thanks for the site you gave me ...all I need now is that "News" site for naruto eps.
BTW these are form my CRT projector its SXGA and 725 Lumens..your LCD pix look wy better...lol
ND |
|
|
| hello |
Wow That duel projector setup looks amazing
I've thought about doing this For a while
Thanks for the pics, I can actually see what it looks like
If you want to use three displays in span mode you need a matrox |
|
|
|
