| EUVL |
As mentioned on the Pass Forum, F5 thread, this is a mini group buy for Fairchild power MOSFET FQA19N20C / FQA12P20, matched N pairs and P pairs, and probably better (quads, etc) depending on the devices.
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/show...771#post1494771
Within the EU only (for bank transfer, postal & custom claim form reasons).
Maximum 500 pairs (I simply don't have the time to measure more devices) and the Group Buy will close.
And First come first serve.
We have so far :
40 pairs EUVL
100 pairs Jacco
100 pairs yggdrasil
20 pairs Yunick
190 pairs short.
Please only post here and not on the F5 thread.
Please note that Digikey price is excluding VAT, which is 19% in Germany (and in Holland I think). On top of that, Digikey charges a handling fee of something like 20-20 Euros, and we probably have to have 10% reject calculated in if we want matched quads (2Ns & 2Ps, but probably N-P with different Vgs, depends on what we get). On top of that postage to you (for 100 pairs by Small packet uninsured 7 Euros within the EU, Parcel / DHL insured 17 Euros.) It will endup somewhere around Euro 1.50 to 1.70 per pair depending on matching reject rate.
Patrick |
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| EUVL |
> Within the EU only (for bank transfer, postal & custom claim form reasons).
I shall make an exception for Tino for posting the balanced circuit.
:)
And minimum 20 pairs please.
Patrick |
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| CfM |
Hi Patrick,
I would join with 60 pairs.
Are you sure you can order 500 parts at Digikey? It seems to me they ship only multiples of 450.
Thank a lot in advance!
Greetings,
Chris |
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| zinsula |
| quote: | Originally posted by EUVL
I shall make an exception for Tino for posting the balanced circuit.
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Patrick, very kind of you...so I cannot resist:
30 pairs for me
Thank you a lot for your efforts.
Tino |
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| EUVL |
> Are you sure you can order 500 parts at Digikey? It seems to me they ship only multiples of 450.
You are right.
So the group buy will stop at 400 pairs. We shall purchase 450 of each type. And the not-so-perfectly-matched devices will be distributed proportionally among all the participants.
We have so far :
40 pairs EUVL
100 pairs Jacco
100 pairs yggdrasil
20 pairs Yunick
60 pairs Cfm
30 pairs Zinsula
30 pairs Tazzz
380 pairs up to now. 20 pairs short.
If there are no takers today, I shall take the extra 20 pairs.
Cost estimates, payment terms and methods later.
Please indicate whether you want insured (17 Euros) or not insured (7 Euros) parcels by the Deutsche Post.
Patrick |
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| EUVL |
Again,
ONLY 20 pairs left !!!
Group buy will close today.
First come first serve.
Patrick |
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| danny_66 |
Hello Patrick,
Count me in for the last 20 pairs.
Regards,
Danny |
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| EUVL |
Group Buy closed !!
For those who missed this chance, if you wish to start a new Group Buy, PLEASE start a new thread !!
This thread will be used to inform the participants of progress, etc.
They are :
40 pairs EUVL
100 pairs Jacco
100 pairs yggdrasil
20 pairs Yunick
60 pairs Cfm
30 pairs Zinsula
30 pairs Tazzz
20 pairs Danny_66
I shall enable my PM the next few days.
Please send me a PM stating :
You full name, postal address, and whether you wish the transistors to be sent insured or uninsured. The cost calculations will follow.
I have no Paypal account, so payment will be in advance and by EU bank transfer (which is free if you do online banking). Bank details only through PM. For Tino, if you have problems with the transfer, please let me know and I shall find a special solution for you, somehow.
Thanks you guys. That was quick.
Have a good weekend,
Patrick |
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| EUVL |
Group Buy closed !!
If you wish to start a new Group Buy, please start a new thread.
Attached an excel sheet for cost estimates.
I am pretty much spot on with Euro 1.50 to 1.70.
Once I received emails from all, I shall let you know by PM how much to transfer and to what account.
When I have received all payment, I shall place order to Digikey, and keep you informed of progress. Matching will take a while (900 FETs !!), unless some of you what them unmatched but sent earlier. Please indicate in PM.
Patrick |
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| zinsula |
Patrick, thank you very much for this effort.
You got mail.
Ciao and a nice sunday to all
Tino |
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| danny_66 |
Hello Patrick,
I can't send you an email through Diyaudio. I get the message: "Sorry! That user has specified that they do not wish to receive emails through this board."
Can you send me your mailaddress ? danny.ts (at) gmail.com
Regards,
Danny |
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| EUVL |
> I get the message: "Sorry! That user has specified that they do not wish to receive emails through this board."
Strange. I have enabled private message this morning.
Can't understand why it does not work.
> Can you send me your mailaddress ?
Will do.
Patrick |
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| CfM |
| quote: | Originally posted by EUVL
> I get the message: "Sorry! That user has specified that they do not wish to receive emails through this board."
Strange. I have enabled private message this morning.
Can't understand why it does not work. |
Hi Patrick,
same applies for me. :( I tried several times today. Maybe you can send me your E-Mail address via PM to me.
Greetings,
Chris |
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| EUVL |
Chris,
You have mail.
I shall send an email to all remaining participants so that they all have my email address.
Patrick |
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| EUVL |
Jacco, yggdrasil, Yunick, Tazzz
You have mail.
Patrick |
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| EUVL |
I have contacted all and informed everyone but Danny of my banking details and the amount to transfer. Danny should also have my email address by now. Please get in touch.
Please note that the parts are non-stock at Digikey and are only ordered only at request. Estimated delivery by Digikey is 25 May if we order today (and we won't be because of time needed for the bank transfers). So please bear that in mind. Realistically, we are looking at end of June, middle of July EARLIEST as I need to find time to measure 900 FETs as well.
There was another question regarding match current.
For the amount of FETs, I can only do one single point at Vds=Vgs at a fixed current (see Nelson's article). For the SE version, nominal bias is 1.3A. For the balanced, I would suggest 2A. Therefore, as a compromise, I suggest 1.6A as the measurement point, if there are no objections. There is still time to debate.
Patrick |
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| yggdrasil |
It is simply great that you have put this together, and additionally do the matching job.
1.6A sounds ok for matching.
Johnny |
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| EUVL |
That is the only way I am sure the matching is done right.
;)
Patrick |
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| danny_66 |
Hello Patrick,
I still haven't received your email, can you try again ?
Danny |
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| jacco vermeulen |
Patrick,
transfer done.
What's the plan for the matching ?
(you're a fast mover, Mr Veldhoven) |
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| dshambala |
Can I still get in on this group buy?
I'll go in for 20 pairs if possible |
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| EUVL |
> Can I still get in on this group buy?
No, GB closed. Please join the other 2 on-going group buys, especially for America.
For the GB participants :
All have been informed of transfer details, including Danny a minute ago. If you still do not recive it today, then probably you need to check your spam filter. I am not posting bank details here.
At least 3 have confirmed their transfer which I shall check during the week (Thanks). Experience says it takes 3 days +. Once all transfers are received, I shall confirm here again and place the order. Then it is waiting time .......
>What's the plan for the matching ?
Room temperature, clamp FET on a large block of aluminium to keep case temperature stable. Run a constant current source at 1.6A through the FET (Drain-Source) with gate tied to Power Supply +ve (for N-FET) via 100ohm resistor. Measure Vgs with 0.1% 4-digit multimeter. Will take ages because of electrical connections (no socket for TO247 that will take 1.6A without much voltage drop) and clamping on "heatsink".
Within 10mV would be considered matched, as the voltage will keep drifting as the FET warms up. The only way to match to better than 10mV is to run it at steady state on a real heatsink. And I am NOT going to do that for 900 FETs, for all the money in the world.
;)
Any better suggestions ?
Patrick |
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| yggdrasil |
Money transferred.
Johnny |
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| EUVL |
Just checked bank account.
Nothing as yet (did not expect either).
All have notified bank transfer or to be done later today.
Thanks.
Am not in town for a couple of days as from tomorrow, and Thursday is public holiday in Germany.
So probably order during the weekend, earliest.
I shall only update here to safe time, except for special circumstances involving personal details.
Nice evening,
Patrick |
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| EUVL |
Update :
Tino was the first to transfer and his money just arrived with thanks.
Meanwhile, the dollar is creeping up to 1.556 against the Euro.
So we already lost 2% of the 10% currency allowance.
:(
I guess the rest would not arrive before Friday, tomorrow being public holiday.
Patrick |
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| zinsula |
| quote: | Originally posted by EUVL
Tino was the first to transfer and his money just arrived with thanks.
I guess the rest would not arrive before Friday, tomorrow being public holiday. |
Swiss banks still quick despite troubles, eh..... ;)
| quote: | Originally posted by EUVL
Meanwhile, the dollar is creeping up to 1.556 against the Euro.
So we already lost 2% of the 10% currency allowance.
:(
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Don't worry, Mister Bernanke will cut the Fed rates today, and the Euro will go back up. :D
Tino |
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| EUVL |
Transfer also received from Chris, Johnny, Mikael, and Jacco with thanks.
Two more pending. Keep watching.
Nice evening,
Patrick |
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| EUVL |
Transfer from Danny arrived, but not from Dave.
I shall take the risk and go ahead with the order over the weekend. I am sure there is no real problem getting rid of 30 pairs matched in the worst, worst, worst case scenario.
;)
Good weekend to all,
Patrick |
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| Yunick |
I don't know why it's taking so long to arrive.. If they don't show up beginning of next week I will send them again.. Sorry for the delay..
Best regards
David |
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| EUVL |
David,
Danny transfered the same time as you, and he was just in late Friday. So maybe yours is in on Monday.
If not, check with your bank first before sending again. Save me returning them later if they came double.
I have the FETs, so I have no worries.
;)
Patrick |
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| EUVL |
Guys,
Order placed.
Price as in Excel sheet.
Estimated delivery 7 July !!!
Which means probably end of July for sending off to you, earliest.
Now waiting time ..........
:o
Enjoy the rest of the weekend,
Patrick |
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| EUVL |
David's transfer arrived on Monday with thanks.
Patrick |
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| Yunick |
Great! I was worried for a while..
I even called the bank and asked for transfer papers.. Anyway, good to know you got the money :) |
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| EUVL |
I was tied up on business engagements all week, so did not get any chance to check my account until late last night. Sorry to have caused any anxiety. It's alright now.
Nice weekend,
Patrick |
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| EUVL |
Still waiting for Digikey, but as some of you might have seen at the Pass forum, the first 2 F5 protos are working with Toshiba MOSFETs in the meantime.
:)
Patrick |
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| EUVL |
Quick update.
Digikey has notified shipping and sent invoice by email.
So hats off to them for keeping to schedule.
Have not received the goods yet.
Shall keep you informed.
As they all come in one go, please allow a month for the matching.
Expect shipment to leave Oberkochen around mid-August.
Nice evening,
Patrick |
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| EUVL |
I hope you are keeping an eye on the thread. :)
Another update :
The goods have arrived last weekend (at Bertram's who handles all purchasing matters for our DIY group; many many thanks as always, Bertram). It is now on its way to me by DHL.
We also have the invoice, etc.
450 pcs FQA12P20 217.50 Euros
450 pcs FQA19N20C 180.10 Euros
UPS handled the VAT clearance at the German customs, and charged 101.60 for that, of which 85.80 Euros is German VAT, and the rest (15.80) handling charges. As the total sum is above 350 Euros, it cannot be done by the private person who receive the goods, but by the forwarder instead (German law).
I have not received the original invoice instead, but I think we were not charged delivery costs (new offer from Digikey for orders above 150 Euros).
The total comes to 499.20 Euros for now. P&P costs to be added when I am done with the matching.
I shall keep you posted once I have further news.
Patrick |
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| zinsula |
| quote: | Originally posted by EUVL
I hope you are keeping an eye on the thread. :) |
Of course :cool:
Thank you for your (and your buddies) work Patrick! |
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| jacco vermeulen |
| quote: | Originally posted by EUVL
I hope you are keeping an eye on the thread. |
I'd say so, yes.
Monday is a great day for happy tidings, Patrick. |
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| yggdrasil |
| Looking, and grateful! |
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| EUVL |
FETs arrived today.
I managed to measure 5 tubes of 30x N-devices.
Takes about 45 minutes for a tube, due to thermal connections to an alu block and screwed terminals for current. So the whole lot will take a while.
At 1.6A, Vgs (=Vds) varies from 3.72 to 3.83 V, so far.
Within a tube, the largest variation is 0.09V, the smallest 0.07V.
So your would have been lucky getting say 2 sets of 4 from a tube.
Shall try to post some photos tomorrow.
Bed time now, :o
Patrick |
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| Blitz |
Any chance to get four matched sets for two F4 and four sets for two F5 in brideged mode ? Would be great....
Best Regards
Frank |
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| EUVL |
In principle all 900 FETS have been taken in the GB, though we set the quota at 400 pairs, allowing 50 pairs as matching rejects. So pls wait a few weeks until all matching is done, and we'll see whether you have luck, and whether the others would agree.
;)
BTW, the P devices has different Vgs at same current to N devices (pls see comments from jackinnj and Nelson on F5 thread). So you may have to change the front end of F4 if you want to use them there. For F5 this is no issue, that I know.
Patrick |
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| EUVL |
Continuing from yesterday, I measured 4 tubes of P-devices this evening.
The spread is a lot more, varying from 5.39 to 5.75V at 1.6A.
And more often than not, one cannot find a set of 4 to within 10mV in a tube.
So expect more matching "rejects" from the P devices.
Also the majority tend to be towards the high Vgs end.
The average difference btw P and N is thus much more than 1V; more like 2V.
Patrick |
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| EUVL |
As promised some photos :
900 MOSFETs !!!!!
:bigeyes:
Patrick
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| EUVL |
"Coarse" Matching Setup....
Patrick |
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| EUVL |
Guys,
The matching is done after 20+ hours' work !!!
I am not going to do this again......
You have PM regarding how to proceed from here.
Please vote here at the Forum. Just say agreed or not agreed.
Voting closes Sunday. Majority rules.
Cheers,
Patrick |
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| zinsula |
Patrick, I agree.....
Tino |
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| EUVL |
As always Tino is first off the mark.
Swiss efficiency !!
;)
Johnny, Insured Parcel (min 5kg) to Norway would cost 30 Euros !!
Could I send uninsured instead ?
Otherwise your transferred amount is not sufficient.
Patrick |
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| Yunick |
I also agree..
Thanks alot Patrik!
Best Regards
David |
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| yggdrasil |
Hi Patrick.
Just send them uninsured. Whatever is the least trouble for you.
Your effort is awesome. Again, thank you!
Regarding your proposal it is more than fine with me.
Johnny |
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| EUVL |
So we have majority.
I shall proceed to send the FETs in the next two days as either international maxibrief or small packets, uninsured.
For Danny, Mikael and Christian, their delivery would be first put on hold until I hear from you, in case you are not in town to pick up the delivery from your friendly post office.
Please get in touch using the forum here. As soon as I hear from you, I can send the FETs off. they are already all packed.
Christian of course get his delivery insured (per DHL), as requested.
Patrick |
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| danny_66 |
Hello Patrick,
That's perfect for me.
Thanks for the great effort you're doing ! |
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| EUVL |
2 small packets (2kg) uninsured and 3 maxibriefs went to Johnny, Jacco, Tino, David and Mikael just now. I missed your message before going to the Post Office, Danny, so maybe tomorrow.
Total cost, incl FETs, Tax, Postage & Packing, ...., etc. comes to 550 Euros. Total received, including 52 Euros from me, amounts to 621 Euros. So 71 Euros will go to Unicef, as soon as I find time.
Let me know here at the thread when you received them.
I hope I made no mistakes and everyone is happy with the match they get. I tried my best.
Now we should see a few more F5's before long. I shall publish more measurement data of the FETs on the F5 forum, in say a week's time.
Patrick |
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| EUVL |
Danny,
Yours were also send by Maxibrief today.
So other than still waiting for Christian to get in touch, the GB is complete.
Thank you all for supporting charity,
Patrick |
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| danny_66 |
Thx Patrick,
now I only need some PCBs that will soon be available at the passdiy site and I can start :-)
A question about a balanced F5, I see different proposals in the F5 thread, which one is the best solution ?
Regards,
Danny |
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| EUVL |
You should build the original version first and see whether you like it.
And you have enough FETs to build all versions.
:)
Patrick |
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| EUVL |
Two have already received -- Tino and Mikael.
Please let me know here when the rest also does.
Patrick |
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| Yunick |
My parts arrived yesterday!! :D
Thanks alot Patrik! |
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| CfM |
Hi Patrick,
first I also agree.
Thanks for your efforts in this GB. I had to back out a bit in the last few weeks and could not keep track on diyaudio regularly, therefore my late reply.
I will be home to receive the parcel, but it seems I will need another three or four weeks until I will find the time to start things working.
Greetings,
Chris |
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| EUVL |
Do you mean I can send parcel ?
Please send me a private mail to confirm.
I no longer check here everyday.
Thanks,
Patrick |
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| CfM |
| quote: | Originally posted by EUVL
Do you mean I can send parcel ?
Please send me a private mail to confirm.
I no longer check here everyday.
Thanks,
Patrick |
Hi Patrick,
the FETs arrived today. Thanks a lot for arranging this GB! :yes:
Greetings,
Chris |
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| danny_66 |
Hello Patrick,
The fets arrived yesterday.
Thx! |
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| EUVL |
Were you up 2 o'clock in the morning !!!
;)
Patrick
PS I am waiting for all the payment from the "left-over" FETs to come in before making the donation in one go. Shall report when done.
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| yggdrasil |
They all arrived safely today after a stop in customs.....
Again, thanks Patrick for arranging this groupbuy. |
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| EUVL |
So finally I heard from everyone. All have received their FETs and seemed to be happy. I have arranged the donation of 71 Euros to Unicef to be done this week. So a satusfactory end to the group buy.
I have not received all the money from those who reserved the "left-over" FETs yet. So that part of the donation still to follow.
:)
Happy soldering and group buy declared closed,
Patrick |
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| EUVL |
Attached the confirmation of the Unicef donation, as promised.
Patrick |
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| Ryssen |
| If anyone bought more than needed,I would lika couple of pair...:) |
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| theAnonymous1 |
| I have 60 of each FQA19N20C/FQA12P20 if anyone is interested. They have not been matched. |
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| Ryssen |
| My interest is in first hand matched.:) |
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| EUVL |
How many do you want, and how well matched ?
Patrick |
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| Ryssen |
For a pair of F5īs and some just in case, 6-8 I donīt know how well matched they usualy are...
The price? |
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| EUVL |
> For a pair of F5īs and some just in case,
Balanced or single ended ?
> 6-8
6-8 of each type (N & P), or 6-8 in total ?
All matched to same Vgs or just in pairs ?
> I donīt know how well matched they usualy are...
The ones from the group buy is 10mV at room temperature.
If you want something more accurate, they need to be matched at temperature (say 60 degC) and working dissipation (say 32W per FET).
And if you want to be really demanding, then they also want to be matched for transconductance.
>The price?
Depends on what you want, see above.
If you want something simple, you should really buy from Tech-DIY. If you want something fancy, you could contact me.
Patrick
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